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Don Seidel

Mac Silicon OS and VW

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2 minutes ago, dtheory said:

Another question to the group: Anyone using dual monitor on the M1?

Any thoughts?

I have 3 monitors running ok. See here:

 

https://forum.vectorworks.net/index.php?/topic/72941-mac-silicon-os-and-vw/&do=findComment&comment=382857

 

There is a bit of an annoying problem with one of the two 'native' monitors not always waking up when I wake the mini up from sleep. Sometimes it's solved just by turning it on and off, sometimes it needs a restart. This seems to be quite a common problem, you'll find threads elsewhere on the internet about it, and I don't know if it's likely to be solved with a Big Sur update.

 

The monitor that's connected via displaylink seems to work happily with no trouble at all.

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, dtheory said:

Another question to the group: Anyone using dual monitor on the M1?

Any thoughts?

 

looks like using dual monitors as an own PITA theme for M1 in general.

I have a friend that went through hell until he finally managed it.

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I took the plunge and ordered an M1.. I'll report back in a couple of weeks on performance, dual monitors etc...

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5 hours ago, line-weight said:

There is a bit of an annoying problem with one of the two 'native' monitors not always waking up when I wake the mini up from sleep.

 

 

From time to time that still happens to me with even just a single Monitor.

Or warnings that I haven't ejected my external TB drives and such.

Not always but every 10-20 time.

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21 hours ago, zoomer said:

 

 

From time to time that still happens to me with even just a single Monitor.

Or warnings that I haven't ejected my external TB drives and such.

Not always but every 10-20 time.

 

Yep, thats definitely a thing with my mac mini m1. I never shut my computer down, only sleep. And now I amost always get a message on wakeup about my external drive not having been unmounted correctly. The drive is still mounted, annoying and potentially destructive perhaps.

 

Here is a discussion on the subject:

 

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/external-hdd-disks-getting-ejected-when-mbp-goes-in-sleep-mode-issues-what-is-the-best-set-up.2262778/page-2

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Posted (edited)

Received my M1 Mini today: 

Used migration assistant to transfer from my Trashcan Mac Pro to the new machine.. so far I'm impressed.. everything has gone quite smoothly.

As I open some VW files, I'll let you know how it goes.

 

 

  Model Name: Mac mini

  Model Identifier: Macmini9,1

  Chip: Apple M1

  Total Number of Cores: 8 (4 performance and 4 efficiency)

  Memory: 16 GB

  System Firmware Version: 6723.101.4

  OS Loader Version: 6723.101.4

  Serial Number (system):XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

  Hardware UUID: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

  Provisioning UDID: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

  Activation Lock Status: Enabled

 

M1: cinebench

multicore: 7563

single core: 1504

 

Mac Pro: cinebench

multicore: 5316

single core: 742

 

Results from Geekbench 5:

 

Screen Shot 2021-05-01 at 9.29.44 PM.png

Edited by dtheory
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ok, so you all are telling me that when I need to upgrade from my Mac Pro (late 2013) then I can go with a Mac mini.

That is how I am understanding all this.

 

215788220_ScreenShot2021-05-02at7_39_11AM.thumb.png.789cf6fba23f035291397dbcaa3ec302.png

 

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40 minutes ago, digitalcarbon said:

ok, so you all are telling me that when I need to upgrade from my Mac Pro (late 2013) then I can go with a Mac mini.

That is how I am understanding all this.

 

215788220_ScreenShot2021-05-02at7_39_11AM.thumb.png.789cf6fba23f035291397dbcaa3ec302.png

 

 

I did and have not regretted it. If you want to connect a ton of peripherals the mac mini is limited in comparison. Other than that its the most bang for your buck I have ever seen apple bring.

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37 minutes ago, digitalcarbon said:

 

I have 3 monitors and a usb hub...

 

 

I think you should buy an additional TB dock.

3 Monitors can be tedious but not completely impossible.

 

 

1 hour ago, digitalcarbon said:

ok, so you all are telling me that when I need to upgrade from my Mac Pro (late 2013) then I can go with a Mac mini.

 

Basically.

But after all those Trash Can years you may want something notably faster than before,

so I would wait a bit for something beefier than a M1 Mini.

I think the next are faster MacBook Pros.

Large iMac and or Mac Mini in "Pro" gray may take some more time but should at least

arrive before 2022.

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2 hours ago, digitalcarbon said:

ok, so you all are telling me that when I need to upgrade from my Mac Pro (late 2013) then I can go with a Mac mini.

That is how I am understanding all this.

 

215788220_ScreenShot2021-05-02at7_39_11AM.thumb.png.789cf6fba23f035291397dbcaa3ec302.png

 

From a Mac perspective it looks like a good upgrade compared to your current system.

 

However... because of the Cinebench test above I did a Cinebench on my Ryzen 7 2700X (2018) system and for single core it beats my system but not for multicore performance.

 

image.thumb.png.07fa628d3f5eb1bb248aff32e42805d3.pngimage.thumb.png.ff7730ae328f74873cb9148264b24379.png

 

When looking at the current (late 2020/early 2021) processors I'm not convinced that for power users the M1 is the best option for upgrading, especially if you have a more recent system, because it is "just" some 10% faster for single core performance and some 15% slower for multicore performance compared to Intel/Ryzen CPU's,  unless you cannot wait.

 

If you can wait then like @zoomer I'd suggest to wait for the next M-chip (M2?) to see how that turns out.

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I think another factor to weigh when making this decision.. yes, the current M1 is not a huge improvement over a 2013 trashcan..

It is however more fluid in OpenGL.. that's nice.. and the performance is better, though not by a huge margin.

But, I would assume that as time goes on and Apple Silicon becomes more ubiquitous, that the Trashcan and other Intel models 

will likely crash (or greatly decrease) in resale value.. so now is a better time to transition if one wants to get a bit more $$ out of 

selling an existing machine.. I'm guessing that I'll either make a few dollars or at least come close to break even when I sell the 

2013 Pro.. there's still a market at this moment.. that'll get worse over time..

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43 minutes ago, dtheory said:

... now is a better time to transition if one wants to get a bit more $$ out of 

selling an existing machine.. I'm guessing that I'll either make a few dollars or at least come close to break even when I sell the 

2013 Pro.. there's still a market at this moment.. that'll get worse over time..

 

This was my logic. It was not easy getting rid of the trashcan. And when the next batch of upgraders wakes up as new macs come out the market will flood. 

 

I think its a no brainer if you can do without all the TB ports. 

 

I got a macminishaped usb hub with a 2.5'' drive enclosure as well and have not had a single moment of regret so far even i if loved the trashcan. Best machine ever built imho. 

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42 minutes ago, fuberator said:

 

This was my logic. It was not easy getting rid of the trashcan. And when the next batch of upgraders wakes up as new macs come out the market will flood. 

 

I think its a no brainer if you can do without all the TB ports. 

 

I got a macminishaped usb hub with a 2.5'' drive enclosure as well and have not had a single moment of regret so far even i if loved the trashcan. Best machine ever built imho. 

which hub did you go for?

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6 hours ago, digitalcarbon said:

 

I have 3 monitors and a usb hub...

I have 3 monitors + USB hubs running (mostly) fine on an M1 mini.

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2 hours ago, fuberator said:

even i if loved the trashcan. Best machine ever built imho.

 

 

The best Final Cut station only - at its time.

I had no real App that ever used both of my D700 GPUs.

And if I had it may have overheated like for those using real GPU rendering.

2x 6Core Xeon would have been much more affordable and even faster than

a single 12 core Xeon, therefore I had the 6 core only.

And the reality at that time would have been CPU rendering for me.

 

And I never got used to the round form.

It visually never worked anywhere between or beside something else, only

when free standing and therefore wasted my desk real estate.

Also my first Mac Pro that needed Dongles and USB Hubs, TB, for storage and

input devices. Also TB2/Mini DP unplugs so easily.

 

Yes, it was very silent, when hidden, pretty inconspicuous but far from faster

or from what I ever wanted to buy. I think most MP 2012 owners where much

happier with their long lasting Mac and Nvidia GPUs over that period.

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18 hours ago, line-weight said:

I have 3 monitors + USB hubs running (mostly) fine on an M1 mini.

 

@line-weight Could you describe how you are running 3 monitors? 

Is it a scheme whereby your screens are connected through a hub rather than directly?

 

Also if anyone in the group has recommendations for a hub that works well with a mini (especially the "mini sized" type).. I'd appreciate a recommendation.

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1 hour ago, dtheory said:

 

@line-weight Could you describe how you are running 3 monitors? 

Is it a scheme whereby your screens are connected through a hub rather than directly?

 

Also if anyone in the group has recommendations for a hub that works well with a mini (especially the "mini sized" type).. I'd appreciate a recommendation.

Two run natively and the other via Displaylink (which means it needs to be via a Displaylink adaptor).

If you read earlier posts in this thread (from around page 9 onwards) I've described the setup I ended up with:

 

https://forum.vectorworks.net/index.php?/topic/72941-mac-silicon-os-and-vw/page/9/

 

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2 hours ago, dtheory said:

Also if anyone in the group has recommendations for a hub that works well with a mini (especially the "mini sized" type).. I'd appreciate a recommendation.

 

This is the one I got, there are a bunch of the same out there with different brand names. Not all of them have a drive enclosure.

https://www.amazon.de/dp/B08QHN3229/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_XPYNH2ZKZHZV1YMJKYKX?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

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Brief description of my experiences so far with the M1, this is not a recommendation,  just a report.

Mac power user for many many (many) years..

I went for 16GB of RAM with a 1TB SSD, Though I've done many clean installs, I decided to give migration assistant a try this time and the process was flawless as far as I can tell.

 I was on a trashcan pro, 6 core D700 64GB RAM, Big Sur.. all updates incl. VW 2021 SP3.

The experience could not have been much easier, at the end of the Migration the new machine appeared virtually identical to the old.

I'm running dual monitors.. primary is a 32" BenQ, running off TB port on the M1 connected with a TB to Displayport cable, the other monitor is connected via HDMI.

No issues with sleep regarding monitors, monitor recognition et. al.

I have an OWC RAID connected via TB for content storage and Time Machine.. here is one rub: one of the RAID sets would lose integrity and need to self repair if I let the machine completely sleep, so I have set my energy saver preferences as shown.. the problem has not recurred.

1318557582_ScreenShot2021-05-18at8_17_34AM.thumb.png.51648d4e36684651347f222491d4286c.png

Vectorworks is running smoothly, all preferences and workspaces were migrated correctly .. I initially noted some funny flickering doing rotations of a smallish residential project in Open GL, which seems to have gone away, and I can't reproduce the problem, so not sure what's up there... so far literally everything I have needed to do has worked seamlessly... It's not high stress.. but fully modeled small residences including site models are working very smoothly, Rendering performance in all of the modes has become quicker, though not radically so.. especially noticeable in Hidden Line.. obviously this is totally anecdotal.. as always YMMV.

A side note, Trashcan sold very quickly on eBay for more than enough to pay for the swap.. in summary, I'm a very happy camper..

 

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3 hours ago, dtheory said:

I initially noted some funny flickering doing rotations of a smallish residential project in Open GL, which seems to have gone away, and I can't reproduce the problem, so not sure what's up there...

 

 

This wasn't when you had a floating view pane open on a second monitor by any chance was it?

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3 minutes ago, line-weight said:

 

This wasn't when you had a floating view pane open on a second monitor by any chance was it?

This was in a main window.. main monitor.

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4 hours ago, dtheory said:

I have an OWC RAID connected via TB for content storage and Time Machine.. here is one rub: one of the RAID sets would lose integrity and need to self repair if I let the machine completely sleep, so I have set my energy saver preferences as shown.. the problem has not recurred.

 

I have a standard SSD+HDD in a TB2 enclosure.

About every 2nd day after a few wake ups it says I have not ejected properly.

In very rare cases I even have to reconnect manually. Sometimes my Finder

Windows went back to default drive therefore.

Pretty annoying and I am already on macOS 11.4 RC.

 

I just shut down my M1 Mini completely over night as in sleep it will awake my

Wacom Display from time to time.

(When I activate or approach with an iOS device, don't really know)

 

But all these sleep problems of the M1 are still better than my PC with AMD GPU.

If I try to let it sleep, it will neither listen to any USB input device beside waking up

and running fans, nor output any monitor signal - even when forcing shut down.

Until I reset my power supply 😪

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1 minute ago, zoomer said:

I have a standard SSD+HDD in a TB2 enclosure.

About every 2nd day after a few wake ups it says I have not ejected properly.

In very rare cases I even have to reconnect manually. Sometimes my Finder

Windows went back to default drive therefore.

My issue was similar.. drives "ejecting" improperly during sleep.. in my case it also resulted in some RAID corruption as I mentioned.. at least in my case, setting my energy saver as shown above seemed to do the trick and this has not recurred.. I hope this si something that apple can fix with a patch rather than being something inherent in the new hardware..

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3 minutes ago, dtheory said:

at least in my case, setting my energy saver as shown above seemed to do the trick and this has not recurred

 

Yes, I also had sleep deactivated for some time.

I don't really know what Apple does or deals with its I/O ports.

 

But if I want to prevent from System Sleep,

I'll use a more haptic solution and plug in my 3D Connection Enterprise.

This will reliably prevent System and Wacom from sleeping.

😉

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