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Mac Silicon OS and VW


Don Seidel

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2 hours ago, dtheory said:

This was in a main window.. main monitor.

I just asked because I've realised that OpenGL can become jittery when I have a floating view pane open - this affects the main pane and the floating view pane. I think there are various problems with floating view panes...but this is a subject for another thread.

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Seems like problems related to things sleeping or not sleeping or not waking is a common them with the M1.

For me, it's a monitor that sometimes refuses to come to life when I wake the machine. The problem always happens after the M1 has been left alone overnight (ie when it's been asleep for some time).

 

I've found that I can largely prevent this from happening by (1) switch off the troublesome monitor then (2) put the M1 to sleep, at the end of each day. No idea why this should make any difference but it seems to save me from the situation where I can only get that monitor back by restarting the computer.

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Posted (edited)

Normally the Wacom monitor reconnects after I switched it off and back on.

AFAIK I had rare cases where I had needed to pull the USB out and back in

or even a restart too.

 

Unfortunately when switching Wacom off/on, or after awaking, sometimes it

has a wrong and lower screen resolution. Most times a single off/on again

helps but in rare cases it may need 2-3 or more off/ons.

 

And if you add that my (many) 27 QHD(s) awake with a green tint, when the room

temperature is 20°C or more, so you have to off/on, it is even more annoying

that the Wacom re-starts with a non-tinted screen again but wrong M1 resolution.

🙂

Edited by zoomer
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11 hours ago, zoomer said:

Normally the Wacom monitor reconnects after I switched it off and back on.

AFAIK I had rare cases where I had needed to pull the USB out and back in

or even a restart too.

 

 

Yes, that works for me most of the time, but sometimes it doesn't, and it seems to change when I come back to the computer when I've left it overnight.

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I bought a Samsung UHD monitor and it occasionally just goes black for a few seconds.  It can also be difficult to wake up after the computer has gone to sleep.

Nudges also don't always show immediately.  There can be a slight delay.

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Posted (edited)

Anyone knows if Parallels on an M1 will let you run older VW (2017) versions under an older Mac OS? I can't take the $2021$ hit right now.

 

Update: Started a new job and had to take the plunge on a Powerbook M1.

 

Running VWs 2021 with minor issues:

  1. Screen vertical banding when drag-scrolling

  2. Delays and freezes with push/pull, working with older files

  3. Crashes while dragging libraries, push/pulls

  4. Beach ball appearances after many operations.

 

Edited by Ramon PG
Update
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  • 1 month later...

One small issue I have run into with my multiple display setup on an M1 mini: the display that I have connected via a Displaylink adapter works fine but it looks like I can't do colour calibration on it. I have a datacolor spyder5 thing that I use and it can do the other two monitors but not the displaylink-connected one. Not really a big deal for me... I never feel very confident I know what I'm doing with colour calibration anyway.

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19 hours ago, line-weight said:

I never feel very confident I know what I'm doing with colour calibration anyway.

 

here too.

(Spyder 3 ?)

 

Different Displays never look anything similar after calibration for me.

I can't even tell if the calibrated result is better than before 😉

I just use and trust it 🙂

 

As the Spyder Software doesn't work anymore, I just copy my old

monitor color profiles from machine to new machine, since years.

 

It is just,

my Wacom has wide color spectrum.

If I use it on Linux, so without any calibration,

Firefox's orange App Icon will burn your retina instantly.

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4 hours ago, zoomer said:

 

here too.

(Spyder 3 ?)

 

Different Displays never look anything similar after calibration for me.

I can't even tell if the calibrated result is better than before 😉

I just use and trust it 🙂

 

 

haha, I'm glad it's not just me, then!

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On 7/12/2021 at 2:42 PM, line-weight said:

I'm not sure how true it is, but I seem to remember reading that older calibration devices degrade over time and therefore become unreliable.

For colorimetric devices (e.g. Spyder) this is true as the colour filters contain (organic) dyes that can/do degrade over time.

 

For spectrophotometric devices (e.g. Colormunki Photo/Design by Xrite) this doesn't really apply to the same extent though aging hardware/electronics may cause issues over time as well, but to a lesser extent than colorimetric devices like the Spyder.


Though it is possible to (re)calibrate colorimetric devices if needed, the question is whether it is worth the cost vs getting a new colorimeter.

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Another thing to keep in mind is that older colorimeters (e.g. Spyder 2 and probably also 3) are not really suitable for flatscreen/LCD monitors with LED backlight, they will still work for flatscreen/LCD monitors using CRT backlight

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2 hours ago, Art V said:

For colorimetric devices (e.g. Spyder) this is true as the colour filters contain (organic) dyes that can/do degrade over time.

 

For spectrophotometric devices (e.g. Colormunki Photo/Design by Xrite) this doesn't really apply to the same extent though aging hardware/electronics may cause issues over time as well, but to a lesser extent than colorimetric devices like the Spyder.


Though it is possible to (re)calibrate colorimetric devices if needed, the question is whether it is worth the cost vs getting a new colorimeter.

 

Over what kind of timescale would that degradation apply? Or in other words how likely is that it would be having a significant effect on my Spyder5?

 

Any "colour calibration for dummies" tips - ie devices / software that will give a 'good enough' result for those of us who don't have highly technical requirements? My aim is really just to know that the colours I see on my screen have a reasonable chance of being as similar as possible to what others will see on theirs.

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20 hours ago, line-weight said:

Over what kind of timescale would that degradation apply? Or in other words how likely is that it would be having a significant effect on my Spyder5?

It depends on the quality of the dyes and the environmental/use conditions etc. but typically they should last at least 5 years without serious issues and maybe a few years more. For critical calibration purposes I'd check against another new/calibrated device approx. every 1 or 2 years if possible (e.g. if you know someone who has a new(er)or recalibrated version of your device). If the differences are large then it is probably time to get a new one. For personal/hobby use it is less critical.

 

20 hours ago, line-weight said:

Any "colour calibration for dummies" tips - ie devices / software that will give a 'good enough' result for those of us who don't have highly technical requirements? My aim is really just to know that the colours I see on my screen have a reasonable chance of being as similar as possible to what others will see on theirs.

In that case you may want to forget about calibration if your purpose is to "make sure" that the colours someone else (random) sees on his/her monitor are similar to what you see. That is not really the purpose of calibration.

 

You need calibration if you want consistency across your publishing workflow of which you are in control or e.g. when you have  to send files to a printing service where they use calibrated printers etc. (in that case they would provide you with a profile). What calibration does is creating a translation table that converts/translates the colours of your monitor, printer etc. to a known standard so that on another device calibrated to the same known standard the colours should translate consistently (note that I am saying consistently and not saying accurately because that depends depends on the quality of the calibration (device and process) to a large extent, but that is something else for another discussion, though it should be reasonably accurate as well when using a decent device).

 

It also makes a difference whether you calibrate for sRGB or Adobe RGB, if you calibrate for the latter and it gets viewed on an sRGB monitor some of the colours could be way off. Because you have no way of knowing what someone else equipment and settings are (e.g. brightness turned all the way up, old monitor with faded colours, bad backlighting, manually adjusted RGB values etc.), let alone whether the other side is using calibrated monitors etc., calibrating your monitor with the expectancy of more or less predictable colours on someone else's side is basically a moot excercise.

 

The safest bet would be to set your monitor etc. to use sRGB as most people who don't use calibration are very likely to have a monitor set to sRGB as well using the default sRGB profile. Most non-professional (e.g. office) colour printers are sRGB as well. This is as close as you can get to a predictable colour across multiple devices/monitors as you can get without calibration (with the caveats mentioned earlier).

 

Maybe a bit too much info and a bit too technical but I hope you get the idea of whether it is still useful to calibrate your monitor or not depending on you final purposes.

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14 hours ago, Art V said:

 

You need calibration if you want consistency across your publishing workflow of which you are in control or e.g. when you have  to send files to a printing service where they use calibrated printers etc. (in that case they would provide you with a profile). What calibration does is creating a translation table that converts/translates the colours of your monitor, printer etc. to a known standard so that on another device calibrated to the same known standard the colours should translate consistently (note that I am saying consistently and not saying accurately because that depends depends on the quality of the calibration (device and process) to a large extent, but that is something else for another discussion, though it should be reasonably accurate as well when using a decent device).

 

Thanks, yes, I think I understand this in principle. I realise that other people's monitors will vary enormously - and that it's impossible to guarantee they will see the same thing as I do - but I suppose my thinking is that the closer my monitor is to "correct" then the better chance of them seeing something to what I intend, because otherwise there is colour skewing going on twice - once at my end and then again at their end. Maybe this thinking doesn't actually make any sense?

 

My work doesn't generally involve sending stuff to printers, so that's not such a big concern for me. I do however occasionally print things out on my own printer, and for obvious reasons it's best if what comes out of the printer is as similar as possible to what I see on screen. So, again, it seems to me that the closer my screen is to "correct" the best chance of this happening. But again, maybe that's not the case.

 

From my previous dabblings in trying to understand colour calibration, I realise it's all rather complex.

 

I did do something a couple of years ago that involved printing a design onto fabric, to match some existing dyed fabric; I knew this wasn't going to be easy but it turned out to be much more difficult than I assumed. In the end the only way of matching colours was to look at physical samples the printers gave me - and it also became apparent that it was effectively impossible to match some of the colours, using their printer - they simply were outside of its colourspace.

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On 7/15/2021 at 10:33 AM, line-weight said:

Maybe this thinking doesn't actually make any sense?

Maybe, maybe not because it depends. IF your monitor is well calibrated at the factory then there is probably little to be gained by calibrating it yourself. If you notice that in practice the colours etc. are noticeably off from what it should be then it would make sense to calibrate it your self anyway and then probably for sRGB because that is the most likely colour profile that others would be using.

 

So calibration makes sense for as far as it applies to your monitors and only of they are noticeably off colour wise.

 

On 7/15/2021 at 10:33 AM, line-weight said:

From my previous dabblings in trying to understand colour calibration, I realise it's all rather complex.

 

I did do something a couple of years ago that involved printing a design onto fabric, to match some existing dyed fabric; I knew this wasn't going to be easy but it turned out to be much more difficult than I assumed. In the end the only way of matching colours was to look at physical samples the printers gave me - and it also became apparent that it was effectively impossible to match some of the colours, using their printer - they simply were outside of its colourspace.

Yes it can be complex, because e.g. for a simple printer you would still have to create profiles for each combination of ink and paper type, let alone for things like fabric. It also depends on substances in the paper/fabric/whatever that can have additional chemical reactions with the inks used that can complicate things even further and as you mentioned whether the colours fall within the colour space of the printer or not. Most people probably have seen this when trying to print bright green (R=0%, G=100%, B=0%) on an ordinary inkjet printer as that comes out quite a bit darker because of the CMYK colour inks that ordinary printers use. With special ink it is possible to get close but that requires a different kind of printer setup.

 

So my advice would still be, for your purpose, don't worry too much about calibration unless your monitor is noticeably off and stick with sRGB for your monitor profile.

 

If you do want to control the printing output and monitor combination then it is probably better to get a spectrophotometric calibration device as these can be used for both print and monitors and will suffer less from deterioration of colour measurments because they don't use colour filters like colorimetric calibration devices..

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  • 2 months later...

I updated macOS 12 Monterey to Public Beta 9

a few days ago. There seem to have been some deeper changes in PB 9.

 

The bad news,

Vectorworks will no more quit normally, needs force quit instead and maybe some

more issues. Bricscad also has some new issues. And latest Safari is incompatible

with so many websites for me too.

 

 

But the good news,

the Display issues seem to be solved now !

At least, for the first time my M1 Mini behaves like any Intel Mac now. I can put it

to sleep, without my Wacom Display reawakening every few minutes. And awake

it again with out the need to restart and reconnect my Wacom Cintiq.

M1 Mini feels like a Mac for the first time.

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2 hours ago, zoomer said:

 

But the good news,

the Display issues seem to be solved now !

At least, for the first time my M1 Mini behaves like any Intel Mac now. I can put it

to sleep, without my Wacom Display reawakening every few minutes. And awake

it again with out the need to restart and reconnect my Wacom Cintiq.

M1 Mini feels like a Mac for the first time.

 

Hooray! I'll look forward to moving to Monterey when it's stable.

 

Meanwhile one of my frustrations is to do with running several monitors - for which Displaylink works pretty well, except for one annoyance which is that Displaylink does not support rotated monitors on M1 macs. And I have one of mine rotated, so I have to make that one the "native" one even though it's not my main one. And my main monitor (which for most of the time is my Vectorworks one) works just about fine via Displaylink but I do notice that it's just a little more glitchy when doing stuff like flying around in 3d, compared to how it runs if it's the "native" one.

 

There's a very long thread on the Displaylink forum of people asking when they are going to support monitor rotation... but zero response from the company on whether they have any intention of doing so. I wonder if the problem is somehow on the "apple end" and things will change with Monterey.

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1 hour ago, line-weight said:

Meanwhile one of my frustrations is to do with running several monitors

 

 

I have only one monitor and can't test that.

Therefor I only said display issues "seem" to be solved 🙂

 

Now it looks that my CADMouse is preventing from sleep again, most of the time 🙂

I hope the 3DConnexion Driver will left Beta status finally during the next decade.

 

Edited by zoomer
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