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Tom Klaber

STRUCTURAL MEMBER BUG(s)

Question

I am encountering a series of FRUSTRATING behaviors from the structural member tool.  If I change the 3D class settings for my beam (which is the only way to actually change the class of the object) - it changes the height settings of the attached columns.  

 

Officially giving up on this tool and going back to extrudes.  These things are soooo glitchy and just spontaneously brake themselves.  Not ready for primetime - feels like still early alfa.  

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17 hours ago, Jim Wilson said:


Yessir:

Bridle Analysis
https://youtu.be/AJNSe8oyjRo


Braceworks Autoconnect Enhancements
https://youtu.be/rIpMbUHEolQ


Dead Hang Object
https://youtu.be/jMmteB9qEQI


Hanging Position Improvements
https://youtu.be/jvp6nqlxeZI

 

@Jim Wilson

Do you have any videos of the Structural Members tool? 
Have tried abit but it do not seem like this tool works? Maybe I do it the wrong way..

When i try to draw with the tool, there is nothing showing up.. 

Really looking forward to the new Braceworks tools! 

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On 9/13/2018 at 11:29 AM, Endre Torkildsen said:

When i try to draw with the tool, there is nothing showing up.. 

Its broken. Have contacted tech support. Its a known issue which they say they will try and sort out when the new service pack is released.

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4 minutes ago, markdd said:

Its broken. Have contacted tech support. Its a known issue which they say they will try and sort out when the new service pack is released.

Thank you for the intel! 🙂 I also have sent a request/video about the issue, haven't got an answer yet. I am a bit disappointed about a lot bugs for a 2019 update.

Having massive issues with resource manager on truss items, this function is way to slow to open...

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Did the structural member tool ever work properly?

 

It was broken in VW2017, and I've never got around to trying it out again in 2018.

 

Yet another tool that could be pretty useful. If it actually worked and was reliable.

 

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We have other issues with this tool as well. 

(1)

Some of our beams just sudden become 'transparent' out of nowhere. 

In other words, the lose their solid information, and only their wireframes are left. 

And in OpenGL or in section view, you don't see the beam.

We tried everything- turning on all classes, checking the object has a fill, checking the class has a fill etc etc.

In the end we had to re-build these beams with the Structural member tool (or better still, just extrude or use walls)

(2)

This second issue is a little ridiculous it is almost laughable. 

Beams cannot connect with walls or slab with the same hatch.

We have tried everything to make beams made with 'Structural Members' to merge with adjacent objects with the same hatch (eg wall, slab). 

But we cannot get rid of the line between the beam and these adjacent objects. 

We ended up re-making all of the structural beams, which we have diligently created with the Structural Member tool, as either walls or extruded objects.

We find this laughable because this structural objects- purportedly there to make modelling structure easier- does exactly the opposite. And along the process wasted a lot of our time. 

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In my version the beam is rotated 90 degrees in top plan view. For example, a 200mm x 50mm beam it is 200mm wide in top plan view and in any 3D view it’s 50mm wide - the correct orientation. Rotate the profile and it’s right in top plan but not in 3D.... was a promising feature...gave up on it very early on.

Edited by Aspect_Design

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Bump.

 @Jim Wilson is there anything official on Structural Tool issues? Great tool on paper but completely unusable... especially in polyline insertion mode

Struct tool 1.jpg

Struct tool 2.jpg

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Don't trust the Structural Member tool, it is not fit for purpose.

On release it had a really bad bug. If you had a beam set to one side of a line, then it jumped to the opposite side when going between top/plan 2d. and top3d.

That meant beams could fluctuate 150-200mm longer and shorter, depending on the view you used. That was patchedrelatively quicly with a service pack, but it was just a quick fix which didn't attempt to solve the other problems, and they were never sorted since. I've not seen any progress on this tool since then, so I my feeling is that it's been developmentally shelved for the time being which is a shame.

Remove the tool from your workspace and forget about it until you see VW advertise a major revision/upgrade. Stick to extrudes and so on in the meantime.

 

Once it's fit for release, it'll be a major and very cool step forward. Modelling line cages and applying auto-truncating beams will be a dream come true, especially if it starts to ship with basic auto-connections later on in it's life. Imagine having beam-styles that you can apply to a mass of lines really quickly, or connection styles which auto-detail for you, what an incredible tool that would become, especially if it worked with truss libraries too!

 

But for now, I like to think of it as a free paper-weight or door wedge that comes with VW.

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I've also been trying to use the tool but it has resulted impossible to do so. The elevation limits simply do not work...

 

I created this post 

 

But then found this one which basically proves that the tool is not working properly.

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oh and one more thing... it's strange that there are literally no videos about this tool. The only one I found is this that's from the design summit 2016 presentation.

 

 

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This tool has wasted so much of our office hours.

- it doesn’t merge with other structural objects in section 

- class overrides in viewport do not work (eg we want dotted lines showing beams above in plan)

- the solid fill in the beam object disappears out-of-nowhere, leaving our renders and elevations looking sh*t

 

In the end a VW forum member offered a solution: that I should use ‘beam’ object in ‘framing member’ in lieu of the use of structural object. That worked.

 

For one project, we went from (1) starting with ‘beam structural object’ then (2) abandoning this and remodelling them as ‘walls overhead’ (problematic) and then (3) in the end remodeling all those beams as ‘framing member- beam’.

 

All in all, inclusive of the trial and error in generating 3D renders and incomplete elevations/section, multiple attempts at remodeling, discusssing this issue internally and with others, it was in total about 20+ hours office time down the drain.

 

I say the following in the most sincere way: Please stop wasting my office time, the good people at Vectorworks. When you put out faulty tools like this, businesses (like mine) that rely on your products suffer a loss of billable hours  from the abortive work incurred. That results in a loss of money. Kindly take note.

Edited by Amorphous
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fffarrrrrrkkkk. Pardon my french. I echo the sentiments of those above. What are they thinking! Releasing a tool that doesn't work, and hasn't worked for many years it sounds like, I have wasted days setting up hundreds of these beams for a project and then they go haywire when i get to the sheet documentation stage. With deadline looming! Suggest to me that this company is being controlled by gamers not designers. The eerie silence from VW affiliated experts speaks volumes also. This shouldnt be a complicated tool and should be priority fix. They need to stop making silly headline grabbing features like VR and rendering stuff and actually make the modelling experience less minding bending. Time to cut my losses (over 15 years on VW) and buy Revit or Archicad. 

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It seems some work has been done to solve issues with Structural Members and stories. Hopefully now it's working fine.

 

Take a look at issue this issue: VB-158260 - Structural Member not working with stories

 

The above issue is contained in this release note: https://www.vectorworks.net/downloads/notes/2019SP3_Notes 

 

 

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But still in SP3 VW 2019 Structural Elements don't merge with other structural objects in section...

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