insulation batt folds in walls

[Cadplan Architecture]

Is it possible to include the insulation batt 'pattern' as a wall component?

AJ

[Cadplan Architecture]

Hi, thanks I tried that but I can't find one that uses insulation batt shown as folds only square mesh , so I'm guessing that folds is not suitable perhaps due to the number of curves that would result. The square mesh is fine but the wall components are greyed out in the info box so it's not possible to edit them. The only wall style that can be edited is the 'Un-Styled' one.

AJ

[mike m oz]

Wall Component 2D attributes can only be fills so therefore it is not possible to have the folded insulation pattern for a fill.

The Wall Component attributes are defined as part of the Wall Style. To change these you need to edit the Wall Style in the Resource Browser. To modify a hatch fill you need to edit the Hatch definition in the Resource Browser. Note: All Resources in a document are unique to that document and therefore any changes you make to them will only be made in that document.

[Christiaan]

It's not possible in Vectorworks. Only mature BIM apps like ArchiCAD have niceties like that.

Been on the wishlist since 2007:

http://techboard.vectorworks.net/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=84906

[VincentCuclair]

Only mature BIM apps like ArchiCAD have niceties like that.

Sorry Christiaan have to correct you there, as far as I can find the wall component fills are only hatches (or Vectorial Fills as they call em). They do on the other hand have a nice fold insolation line-type, which can be interactively made longer and wider by dragging the handles.

[Christiaan]

ArchiCAD 13 Productivity Improvements - Intelligent "Soft" Insulation:

[Danielj1]

You can also use the batt insulation tool to place insulation directly into a wall (not a component, but the wall itself), automatically adjust the insulation's length to that of the wall, and control the centering of the insulation within the wall. Not the same as adding batt insulation to a component, but it might be still be sufficient in certain cases.

Dan J.

[VincentCuclair]

Ah, now that is a bit misleading, it's still a hatch with a certain width, nice touch with the auto orientation adjustment though.

The catch: change the component width and you have to change the hatch (Symbol Fill as they call it).....

[Danielj1]

Alas It's not a hatch, but rather a plug-in object, the characteristics of which are modifiable in the Object Info palette. And yes, it's not linked to a component's width, so must be adjusted appropriately when things change. As I mentioned, not the same thing as adding a hatch to a component, but in certain cases it may still be sufficient.

Dan J.

Edited February 21, 2011 by Danielj1

[VincentCuclair]

Nope, it's a hatch and is created and adjusted accordingly.......the 'intelligence' of its use is on the plug-in (wall) side.....

[Christiaan]

Well it looks like "nicety" is probably not the best description. Nor I might add is Graphisoft's description of it as the "perfect solution."

Anyone know if Revit has this one nailed?

[Ariel]

Same thing. Revit uses hatches and provides a line-based insulation tool to create the batt fold pattern.

Edited February 21, 2011 by Ariel

[Cadplan Architecture]

Ok I guessed as much, I'll go with Chris D's hatch suggestion which will work with all wall shapes-

techboard.vectorworks.net/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=84906

AJ

[taoist]

Archicad is not the only software that will fill the wall cavitites with insulation as you draw.

This is so basic and we still do not have it.

taoist

[Chris D]

It's there in 2012...just tested it myself. A little bit buggy in display terms though...horizontal to the screen the batt folds are ok, but they disappear in vertical walls, unless i zoom right in...or right out...strangely.

[taoist]

Thanks Chris!

As I do not have 2012 yet it is good to know.

taoist

[RDS Casa]

Hello, Just searching for finding a better way to do this.... Maybe there is not one....

 

But its 2018 now. So I just make a complex line type (using world geometry scale) and make a repeating line type of the batt. Then when I make a wall style, I put this is on one side of the component edges and turn the other side of the component edge off.  Works ok, not ideal rendering at junctions but no one seems to care on site. 

 

2D only I guess.

 

Please let me know if there is a better way.

 

Thanks

 

 

[RDS Casa]

Ah... just discovered an issue with my approach. When sectioning walls, the left/right option for the complex line types does not work.... or at least it only works for any single direction of a wall.  When sectioning the opposing direction, it renders the complex line geometry on the wrong side of the line. One work around is to duplicate the wall styles so there is a left/right style and a right left/style... but this is not great. frustrating, as if there was a centre line options, this issue would go away. Also could be used for a simple stud in wall approach. 

[AlanW]

You can easily create the Batt Insulation as a wall component. Create a texture with the Batt image and it will show up as 3D.

HTH

Edited August 8, 2018 by Alan Woodwell

[RDS Casa]

Thanks

 

But not in 2D? or will it? 

 

I found another work around for the complex line type approach. For one element, such as the insulation@90mm, I make 3 components. 

- one at 45mm with nothing in it

- one at  0.01mm with the complex line type (which is 90mm geometry - I also put 44x90mm cls studs in it @ 450mm centres) 

- one at 45mm with nothing in it.

 

This effectively put the insulation line and its complex geometry in the middle of where its supposed to be. So works sectioned either way. 

 

The result is ok. A stud wall in 2D. The stud positions are a bit random but no one cares about that. They put them where they want them anyway. 

 

The bad thing is that when using offsets and stories to bound them, you have to set up 3 components. and everything is 0.01mm out (but I'm ok with that now!)  

 

You also have to make line types for each stud thickness, but that's not so bad.

 

This strategy also works for any repeat components. Like Stepoc Blocks in a wall. I had thought I could do beam and block floors this way, but then realised its only correct if sectioned them one way! 

 

I've put in a wish list for wall types to allow for a centre line (rather than just a left or right) in a component. This is useful for membranes also. 

 

I'd also like the hatch editor to be as simple as the complex line editor! which is not that complex

 

Thanks for the suggestion. 

 

[AlanW]

In 2d also works. In class set fill to the batt hatch or any hatch you want to represent it

[Gadzooks]

I'm intrigued @RDS Casa..

 

It seems you want to show insulation and then you seem to have turned to wanting to have studwork also.

 

Why are you wanting to devise a method of having the studwork drawn which (by your own admission) is not really that 'accurate' and doesn't work very well in walls? Why aren't you using the framing tool? This will provide you with a really very good 'design intent' 2D plan of the stud layout(s).

 

Also 3D framing panels if you wish - but it seems maybe the contractors only need an 'indicative' from you.

 

 

[RDS Casa]

I was just looking for the simplest way to have repetitive elements in a wall build up. The complex line types combined with wall styles almost enable this in a really simple way.

 

I've not played much with the framing tool to be honest, but yes, that looks potentially a better way of doing it (certainly for head plates and sole plates in the wall, and trimming out opening etc). But it's just another process and set up, that's all. At the moment I still take the sections vieworts when they are pretty much right, then when I'm ready I convert to group and edit the fiddly bits all in 2D. I know that's a archaic, and I'm left with a static section, but it works for me currently. Its the shortest way to useable output - until the design changes of course. 

 

Thanks for the suggestion - I'll look into the framing tool in more detail. If you know any good tutorials, do please post them. 

 

 

[JMR]

In extrapolation of this topic, how does one export batt insulation so that it is visible in the .dwg as well?

 

I can select batt insulation tile as a wall component fill and for me it looks perfect, but it will not export to .dwg -> insulation appears empty for a structural engineer looking at my .dwg file.