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wavlas

continuous spell check

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Would love an option to allow a continuous spell check similar to a word program.

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Many of us have QuickLook preview in our fruit.

Maybe we can have the Os X spelling, witch it's very, very good.

Edited by Mr. Gog

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I think that's a great idea.

Integrating operating system features into the application is exactly what I'm advocating.

This seems a more efficient use of programming time than trying to re-invent the wheel.

I'm not ideologically committed to Windows, if I thought the Mac created an advantage in my unique circumstances, I would switch.

Likewise, Mac users who saw an overall advantage in OLE could run Windows...without even leaving their favorite orchard from what I understand.

There's nothing wrong with real choice...at least in my opinion.

I don't see any reason to treat OLE as forbidden fruit.

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Only one thing: mac users rarely want to use windows. Is Os preference the defacto problem. I presonally prefer VW on Macs, it feels different: more stable, smother and with better interface (an Os contribution).

Edited by Mr. Gog

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An OS contribution, or more experience from NNA, since VW (formerly MiniCAD) was born on the Mac.

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That's all well and good.

I'm uninterested in forcing anyone to switch their OS.

If you beleive OSX is better for you, great.

However, even if OSX is objectively superior in every way to Windows, adding OLE would make Vectorworks better for some users.

A given feature will not benefit every user.

For some users the feature will have no relevence to their workflow.

Other users will simply not recognize it's utility.

But I would hope that no usefull feature would be rejected on ideological grounds.

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That's all well and good.

I'm uninterested in forcing anyone to switch their OS.

If you beleive OSX is better for you, great.

However, even if OSX is objectively superior in every way to Windows, adding OLE would make Vectorworks better for some users.

A given feature will not benefit every user.

For some users the feature will have no relevence to their workflow.

Other users will simply not recognize it's utility.

But I would hope that no usefull feature would be rejected on ideological grounds.

I Agree with you.

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Would someone kindly elucidate on the significance of OLE and what on earth it has to do with Engineering drawings be they Civil, Architectural or Mechanical?

If it's excess baggage, do we really need to carry that around with us too? Having said that if it's already part of the OS it should be taken advantage of, no point in wearing a belt if you already have braces.

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It's my understanding the OLE would introduce a file compatibility problem between Mac OS and Windows. For that reason I can't see it happening.

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I remember something like that on os 9, some kind of extensions for microsoft office.

Edited by Mr. Gog

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Let me try the impossible and explain to our mac friends how OLE works. Anyone else correct me if I'm wrong.

One can embed part of another document into one's current document. These two documents does not necessarily have to be created using the same program. If one has to edit the embedded document, one double clicks on it and the corresponding program related to it will open for editing.

For example, I can work in CorelDraw and I can embed a fully dimensioned working drawing created in TurboCAD and it will show clearly and correctly in CorelDraw as it would in TurboCAD. Now before anyone starts moaning, an independant CorelDraw user (or an associate or whoever) doesn't have to have TurboCAD to read the CorelDraw file because the TurboCAD file is Embedded.

Now, this will apply to all O.L.E. compliant programs. Why people can't see the advantages of this? I don't know.

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Would love an option to allow a continuous spell check similar to a word program.

Your thread seems to been hijacked wavlas. As a spelling challenged semi adult I think this is a great wish, five stars.

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Does it work on a Mac? VectorWorks files need to be openable on both platforms without any loss of data.

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A bit more about OLE.

So far as I know it does not run on the Mac. Apparently there is third party support for dynamic compound documents http://linkback.nisus.com/

[edit] Nisus offers a word processor with linkback support as well as support for right to left text --another recent VW issue. http://www.nisus.com/Express/ [edit]

In my opinion, this introduces a situation similar to backward compatibility between Vectorworks versions (I'm not implying that the Mac is backwards, only that the considerations when creating files are similar).

Historically, OLE was one of the biggest campaigns in the war between Redmond and Cupertino back in the early 90's.

As Redmond rolled out OLE, Apple in concert with IBM (and some others) created OpenDoc. The major architectural difference was that OLE objects were in the native format of a particular application, while OpenDoc objects were in a more or less nuetral format.

From an implimentation standpoint, OpenDoc was generally a cluster flop. The memory overhead was high (for the time) and the document format wasn't really neutral since it relied on the creating application embeding the all the relevent information required to translate the document into formats compatabile with other software within the document itself.

That's to say that an opendoc document created in word processor x would only be openable in word processor y, if and only if, word processor x embedded translation information for word processor y in the document itself.

One of the early results of Steve Jobs return in 1997 was the end of open doc.

Since then Apple has more or less pursued the third option which is support for static data...such as an embedded PDF or JPG.

As a sometimes utilitarian, I see that devoting a bit of programming resources spent implimenting OLE would offer more benefit to more users than spending those resources on embedding specific features such as full text justification within the application.

Likewise if developing support for Xgrid is easy and benefits many users, I'm all for it even -- though I don't run Mac servers.

Edited by brudgers

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What you say is great in theory, and if Microsoft had OLE for Mac it would work. NNA have to deal with the reality and that means if a piece of information is in a VW file created on a PC then when the file is opened on a Mac that information must still be there. That would have to be the case 100% of the time. If it wasn't the results could be catastrophic.

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Users would have the choice to impliment the feature or not.

On a few occasions perhaps there would be an issue.

In that case, a PDF could be created and embedded just as is done today.

To call it "Catastrophic" is a bit over dramatic.

What happens when an unusual font is used in a VW file?

Or a referenced file is unavailable?

There's error trapping and the end user makes a decision on how to handle it.

100% flawless interchange between computers is a truely theoretical position.

Based on the seemless exchange model, Vectorworks should cut out Renderworks as an add in.

Practically speaking, OLE would benefit many users and harm very very few, if any, and only on rare occasions and only in cases where planning and standards have not been applied...and in those cases simple workarounds would be available.

Finally, Apple has chosen not to offer OLE or a similar technology to their users.

Vectorworks users have a choice of platforms and operating systems.

Implimenting OLE wouldn't change a darn thing for those whose needs are met by OSX.

In all honesty, when I started advocating OLE I had no idea that OSX lacked a similar capabalilty.

I think it's a pity, but it doesn't change the utility of the technology.

Edited by brudgers

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Files are exchanged between platforms and therefore 100% data reliability is essential (I have seen mixed platform offices - ie some Mac and some PC).

A user not getting all of the information because of data loss is a significant problem.

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Files are exchanged between platforms and therefore 100% data reliability is essential (I have seen mixed platform offices - ie some Mac and some PC).

A user not getting all of the information because of data loss is a significant problem.

A mixed office would be free to not impliment OLE...though if they run two platforms their less likely to be big on standards.

But again, VW files are not 100% compatible now. An artistic rendered Viewport is not updateable with out renderworks and a DLVP is not well handled by Fundimentals.

Likewise with with release versions, fonts, and reference files as I've noted previously.

No one will be forced to switch to Windows or even use OLE, and as with all things those who employ OLE will do so at their own risk.

No one is saying a Vectoworks viewer shouldn't be developed for the iphone because it would not be compatible with a razor or sidekick.

OLE offers a high payoff for little effort.

It provides a smooth workaround for many systemic limitations of the application...which is exactly what it was intended to do.

Mac users won't be forced to give up their beloved hardware, although they may feel a need to give stronger consideration as to which OS they use for VW during each upgrade cycle...so what?

Edited by brudgers

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Well, going by the informative explanations offered so far, if OLE is an independent file format that doesn't trip over it's own boot laces or cause others to do so, it would seem that common sense would dictate it's adoption would be a sensible thing.

My VW files mostly run in the range of 200 to 300Mgs so i can't see that a little extra weight would cause any major slow downs, although that would depend on if NNA gets into sliming down the parts of VW that need a rebuild to streamline the redraw ability that is long overdue.

Other than that, i can't see a problem with implementing use of an already established standard.

If it works, USE IT!

Just need to see if all players can agree! Apple, Microsoft, NNA and anyone else involved . . . . .

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A continues spelling of all text entered in Vectorworks would be very welcome, could someone advise if this is planned/in development or not considered important?

 

 

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On 6/12/2008 at 1:22 AM, brudgers said:

I think that's a great idea.

Integrating operating system features into the application is exactly what I'm advocating.

This seems a more efficient use of programming time than trying to re-invent the wheel.

I'm not ideologically committed to Windows, if I thought the Mac created an advantage in my unique circumstances, I would switch.

Likewise, Mac users who saw an overall advantage in OLE could run Windows...without even leaving their favorite orchard from what I understand.

There's nothing wrong with real choice...at least in my opinion.

I don't see any reason to treat OLE as forbidden fruit.

 

plus using the same spell checker everywhere means one custom dictionary of industry terms works in all instances.

Better still OS spell checkers pick up (sometimes) client names in address books and emails and reduce flagging them in checker.

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