goochpurdue Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 When using the Instrument Insertion Tool some of the internal geometry of an instrument defaults to the None Class instead of the Active Class. Please tell me I am just missing something simple. This occurs in both 2008 and 2009. Thanks, Geoff Gooch Quote Link to comment
michaelk Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 That's how all symbols behave. (If I understand your question correctly.) The symbol is in a class. The components of the symbol can be in the same or any other class(es). This gives you a lot of flexibility controlling the graphic attributes and visibility of symbols and their components. If you want to change the class of any components of a symbol, you have to edit the symbol, and change it there. hth michaelk Quote Link to comment
goochpurdue Posted October 22, 2009 Author Share Posted October 22, 2009 So there is no way to have the entire symbol insert on the current class? Seems like a royal pain as different shows have different classes and I would rather them take on the properties of the currently selected classes instead of having to edit the symbol on each and every show. Geoff Quote Link to comment
michaelk Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Maybe I'm not understanding. Are you hanging a rep plot and you want to have different graphic attributes for rep units and show-specific units? michaelk Quote Link to comment
goochpurdue Posted October 22, 2009 Author Share Posted October 22, 2009 No, I want to insert symbols and when I turn off the class they were inserted on, they should disappear. Unfortunately this does not work as some of the geometry is on the class none. Geoff Quote Link to comment
Pat Stanford Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Symbols (and groups) are container objects. If the symbol has a class (look in the Object Info Palette) and you have a different class active and you make that class invisible, then everything inside that symbol should disappear, no matter what class the actual objects are in. To phrase it a different way, if the container is in an invisible class, then all of the objects inside the container are also invisible. Sometimes this works to your advantage (like for what you are trying to do now) and sometime it works against you (like when you make all the classes invisible and step through them to see where something is and you can't find it because you have to have two class (the container and the object) both visible at the same time.) If you are seeing something different, then something is wrong. Quote Link to comment
michaelk Posted October 22, 2009 Share Posted October 22, 2009 Is this what you're trying to do? (example is VW 2009) There was no editing of symbols. Just put each instrument in a different class. hth michaelk Quote Link to comment
MrTemplate Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 hello Geoff; it sounds as if your instrument symbols are comprised of multiple classes. when you're inserting them, not all of the 2d components of each symbol are acquiring the active class upon insertion. have you considered inserting each set of symbols on a different layer instead? each layer can have any number of classes on it. would that be an option? hth, shelley Quote Link to comment
Tmonson Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 (edited) Geoff- I'd agree with Shelley that your root symbols are likely inadvertently comprised of multiple classes. An easy fix if that is the issue rather than editing/checking each symbol try this: Create a new class...i.e 'lighting instruments' Group all your lighting symbols together in one folder and use the Tools/Utilities/Change Symbol Atts to make all your root symbols now in the 'lighting instruments' class. Hopefully, that should solve the problem of symbols being comprised of different classes. Tmonson Edited October 28, 2009 by Tmonson Quote Link to comment
goochpurdue Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 Tmonson, Your suggestion works and gets my current drawing to where I want it to be. I still don't understand why a symbol won't inherit the current class on insert. Why should a symbol maintain a class structure when the whole point of classes is to define things as you draw? What am I missing and not understanding? Thanks, Geoff Quote Link to comment
Sam Jones Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 A little late to this thread. Here's the deal. When you create a symbol definition that symbol definition will be placed in a class. Every time the symbol is placed the symbol definitions class will be assigned to the instance, period. This keeps chairs that are symbols in the chair class always being chairs and not assigned to, for examaple, the table class that was used just before the chair symbol was made active. If you want a chair assigned to the table class you have to make a sym def that uses that class. While this reasoning makes a certain amount of sense in a simple world it pretty much sucks. Suppose you want to assign the chairs to the living room class so you can count them. Although I'm a lighting designer I used the furniture example on purpose to show that it is not just entretainment that would like this behavior changed. For now I use both layers and classes to control groups of visibility. I put the rep plot or shared fixtures on one layer, each ballet on its own layer. I would do the same with shows. At the local user group we all want to be able to insert different instances of the same symbol definition with different class assignments, and most of the members are architects. Sam Quote Link to comment
C. Andrew Dunning Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Jumping in... Sam, I don't believe I'd agree w. you on your conclusion. Though perhaps not implemented 100% to everyone's liking, this current system is quite usable. I use different Classes within Symbols to great benefit. For example, I might have a truss Symbol that gets placed in a "Flown Truss" Class. BUT, the Symbol contains: - A Loci Class so I can turn Loci on and off. - "Simple" and "Complex" Classes so I can view truss as either a simple box - or in full detail. - A couple of Classes that aid in creating entertainment rigging plots. I can then turn all flown truss on or off - or control the appearance of the truss Symbols contained in that Class. Piece of cake... Quote Link to comment
Sam Jones Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 But Andy, everything you do would be possible if we could assign an instance of a symbol to a class different from its definition. As it is now the only way to make 26deg light used only by ballet #1 different from a 26deg light used only by ballet #2 is to put them on different layers and and use layer colors. I do that now, but I lose other color control that I would prefer to keep. I guess one other option is to make a symbol definition for each ballet, but that's not going to happen. Sam Quote Link to comment
C. Andrew Dunning Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Sam - We CAN assign an instance of a Symbol to a specific class. The Symbol simply retains it's "creation" Classes. What I think you're wanting (and what has been discussed before) is to have the ability for drawing Class attributes to be able to over-ride "creation" Class attributes. For example, regardless of "creation" Class attributes assigned in a Symbol definition, any time that Symbol is placed in Class "Sam's Super Ballet" the line color is changed to red. That what you're wanting?? Quote Link to comment
Kool Aid Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Excluding selection of the symbol, I think this need could be solved with some 50 lines of VectorScript: a Point PIO which copies the geometry from the SymDef and assigns everything to the class of the PIO itself. Why, the possible 3D part could even made independently tiltable? Quote Link to comment
TimOlson Posted November 13, 2009 Share Posted November 13, 2009 Hi Sam. The first time I saw this was in a tomcat truss symbol I got from their website. I imported it from autocad and, the first time I went to turn off the truss class, saw bits & pieces of the truss still there. what I then did was edit the symbol, select all, and select the class I want everything in. Now ungroup the selection - if you see more objects in OE than you had before, you have to make sure THEY are all selected, and put those bits & pieces all in the same class. stuff inside of groups can be different classes than the group itself, which really messed with my head till I figured it out. once you have every bit and piece inside the symbol all on the same class, you can put that symbol on any class or layer and turn different groups of the same instrument off and on all day long. Andy, I'm looking forward to seeing your VW class @LDI peace, Tim Olson Quote Link to comment
C. Andrew Dunning Posted November 13, 2009 Share Posted November 13, 2009 Sam - I thought I has a flash of brilliance this morning that was to be THE solution to your problem. It turns out I was mistaken - but I'm not giving up... Tim - Lookin' forward to seeing you in Orlando... Quote Link to comment
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