Workgroup Hierarchy - Replace?

[MattG]

I find I regularly want to replace a symbol in a file with a symbol from a workgroup library.  I have in my workgroup a big folder of files that are referenced.  It works great for using as a shared directory for inserting symbols.

 

However when I try to replace symbols there is no ability to expand the workgroup libraries tab to allow me to select them.

 

Is there a certain type of file structure I need in place in the directory for this to work?  Anyone have any thoughts? 

[MattG]

It seems shocking to me that a @vectorworksemployee cannot answer this. 

[jcogdell]

This is a bug, I'll get it reported

 

[Marissa Farrell]

@MattGHave you refreshed your library? Also, this appears as though it's coming from a tool, is that correct? If yes, which tool?

[Lada]

Hello @MattG,

Workgroup and User libraries follow the same structure and rules as Vectorworks Libraries. This means each tool has its own set of folders which are available in Resource selectors. Please, check the list of available folders inside Vectorworks libraries. If you put your files inside one of those folders in Workgroup/User library they should be available.

[MattG]

This is not in a tool.  Let me know the folder structure they should be in.

 

Right now the folder we have linked as a "Work Group Folder" has these in "workgroup folder" - Libraries - then the .vwx files.  They all show up in there if wanting to just grab a symbol or something.  However if I have a symbol that is in a file.  I select it and choose to replace that symbol these files are not accessible. 

[Lada]

Any of these folders should work. When you add a Workgroup folder the same folder structure is being created inside it. So just put your files into the relevant folders.
Difference between the Resource manager (palette) and Resource selectors is that the Resource manager shows all folders and files inside the Libraries folder, but selectors show only relevant folders. In particular, this list is for the Symbol tool.

 

[MattG]

So someone in a workgroup directory has to make a sub directory to match that even if their file directory would not make sense in that folder structure?  Otherwise this feature would not be available?

 

It seems like there should be a better way.

[Lada]

Another option is to use Favorites. They always available in selectors. 

[jcogdell]

@MattG
When you create a Workgroup folder in the Vectorworks preferences it automatically sets up the correct folder structure for you in the location you have specified.
If you want you can add further sub-folders to help organize them but its not required.
The resource manager only display the folders in your workgroup folder if they contain a library file.
 

[MattG]

We use favorites but trying to use workgroups with multiple users across dropbox.  Workgroups seem like the correct option, I think?

[MattG]

11 hours ago, jcogdell said:

@MattG
When you create a Workgroup folder in the Vectorworks preferences it automatically sets up the correct folder structure for you in the location you have specified.
If you want you can add further sub-folders to help organize them but its not required.
The resource manager only display the folders in your workgroup folder if they contain a library file.
 

What do you mean "If they contain a library file"? I'm not sure I understand that.  I have the files with the resources in a folder that has a library directory in it in VW.  I can see them just viewing in the resource manager but am unable to see them when replacing symbols in a file.  Please see the video for an example of what I am seeing.  What am I doing wrong here?

[Pat Stanford]

The Workgroup (and User) folders are not intended to be be general purpose storage locations of things a team might need. It is intended to be a location where project or team specific VW content can be storage. This would be primarily "Default Content" and "Object Styles."

 

Put VW files with the "correct" type of objects into the correct folder hierarchy and you get those types of objects (Default = Line Types, Hatches, Door Hardware, Hoists, Irrigation, Renderworks style, backgrounds & textures, etc.) (Object Styles = Cabinets, Plants, Lighting, Soft Goods, Title Block Border, Walls-Slabs-Roofs, etc.) and they will show up when you go to create or replace an object instance.

 

You can even just put aliases to a VW file that has multiple of these defats and styles into the correct folders and they will still be found when needed.

 

If you give the file in the User or Workgroup folder the same name as the file in the Applications folder, then it will hide that file. With this you can hide styles you don't want and only show styles and defaults that you do want.

 

For other more general things (that you don't want to have to try and shoehorn in to the Objects folder structure, then Favorites files on a shared (DropBox, OneDrive, Local shared volume) are a better option.

 

HTH

[Pat Stanford]

Although VW creates the entire required folder hierarchy when you nominate a folder as a Workgroup (or User) folder, the Resource Manager (RM) only shows the folders that actually have VW files in them that contain the appropriate type of object for that folder in the structure.

 

So if you put a file with no line types into the Library:Defaults:Line Types folder, the RM will not show that folder even though you can see if in the Finder/Windows Explorer.

[MattG]

29 minutes ago, Pat Stanford said:

The Workgroup (and User) folders are not intended to be be general purpose storage locations of things a team might need. It is intended to be a location where project or team specific VW content can be storage. This would be primarily "Default Content" and "Object Styles."

 

That has not been my understanding, but then again maybe my understanding is incorrect.  So for example a group of about 8 of us in one company want to share resources (Symbols, sytles, templets, etc.) what is the correct way to have these shared items in VW available in the resource manager that can be managed by us internally?  

 

It does not seem to me that this should be this complicated or inaccessible but maybe I am just looking at this from an outsider view here. 

 

Matt

[C Beard]

Hi @Pat Stanford,

 

On 8/31/2022 at 6:43 AM, Pat Stanford said:

So if you put a file with no line types into the Library:Defaults:Line Types folder, the RM will not show that folder even though you can see if in the Finder/Windows Explorer.

 

I am trying to set up a Workgroup Library following this setup with line types in the Line types folder, Data Tag Styles in the Data Tag folder etc. However, every time I shut down my computer and restart, the tools for each item (door, window, hatch, line type) forget their connection to the workgroup file within the tool/attribute themselves.

 

All the files a showing up perfectly in the Resource Manager, and I can drag and drop items in.

 

I have tried refreshing the libraries multiple times.

 

Sometimes one tool will work (for example data tags), but others do not. And then I restart my computer, and we are back to square one.

 

 

The file naming conventions are all copied from the standard Vectorworks library, and the Workgroup Library folder has the correct naming convention.

 

 

Is this a common problem?

 

Also is there a fix? This thread is the closest I have found to match my problem.

[Pat Stanford]

I would say that no it is not a common problem.  Let's see if we can figure out what is going on.

 

1. What operating system and hardware are you running? You might want to add that to your signature along with your VW version as those will almost always be the first questions we ask in trying to come up with a solution.

 

2. Can you post a screen shot of the Vectorworks Preferences:User Folders screen?

 

3. Are you certain that you have all the search options on in the Resource Manager? The following screen shot shows the Workgroup Folder option (orange arrow) unselected so the RM will not show anything from the Workgroup Folder.

 

[C Beard]

Hi @Pat Stanford

 

Thanks so much for touching base quickly.

 

I have attached a snip of my Resource Folder as well as my Vectorworks preferences.

And have updated my signature with the system specs.

 

I am also running windows 11 Home v. 22H2 if that helps.

 

This morning when I booted up, the following tools were linking to the Workgroup library options;

- Window, Door, Title Block Border, Data Tags

And the following tools/attributes weren't connecting.

- Wall, Hatches & Symbol Insertion

 

(These are the predominant tools that the office uses at this point)

 

 

Yesterday none were linking to their respective tools (which is why I sought a solution online), and they all at some point have connected.

 

I've never had a problem with the Workgroup Libraries being visible/accessible in the Resource Manager though.

 

 

Thanks in advance.

 

 

[Pat Stanford]

My next suggestion, as a test, is to copy the workgroup folder from the synology to either your local hard drive or a different shared service like dropbox and change or add a link to the new location. See if it works from there. If not, it could be that there is a Synology problem involved.

 

Take a look at this post about file names starting with a period. Could it be that sometimes someone else has the file open which is why you can't see it?

I did a quick scan through the forum and did not come across many recent Synology issues, and those I saw were mostly about Project Sharing, not workgroup folders.

But the nature of the intermittent access makes me think server or networks problems.

 

HTH

[The Hamma]

@C Beard

I have a Synology Diskstation and I found that it not wise to link Vectorworks to the Workgroup folder on a shared synology drive.  There are some issues with adding resources to the files when they are being linked this way.  The best way to do this is to use Synology Drive and create a synced copy of the workgroup folder on your local computer.

 

You can also put uncategorized files in the Synced copy of the workgroup {Favorites} folder.

 

I store everything in our workgroup folder.
 

 

 

 I also store my keynote libraries and some other settings in the workgroup folder but Vectorworks only looks in the user folder for these items so I create a sybmolic link to those folders to my user folder. Below are the command lines that create them. I have my User directory located in my "Documents" folder rather than my %appdata% folder.  The " The {C:\Users\David Hamer\Documents\VWUser} need to be edited to the path of the local user's VW User directory and the {D:\VWWorkgroup\} need to be edited to the Synology Drive synced directory.   These commands need to be executed at the CMD prompt with Adminstrator rights. 

 

rmdir "C:\Users\David Hamer\Documents\VWUser\2023\Libraries\Defaults\Notes"
mklink /D "C:\Users\David Hamer\Documents\VWUser\2023\Libraries\Defaults\Notes" "D:\VWWorkgroup\2023\Libraries\Defaults\Notes"

mkdir "C:\Users\David Hamer\Documents\VWUser\2023\Settings\Select Similar"
mklink /D "C:\Users\David Hamer\Documents\VWUser\2023\Settings\Select Similar\Saved Settings" "D:\VWWorkgroup\2023\Settings\Select Similar\Saved Settings"

del "C:\Users\David Hamer\Documents\VWUser\2023\Settings\Eyedropper Tool"
mklink /D "C:\Users\David Hamer\Documents\VWUser\2023\Settings\Eyedropper Tool" "D:\VWWorkgroup\2023\Settings\Eyedropper Tool"

Copy "D:\VWWorkgroup\2023\Plug-ins\Common\Data\PubliemNames.xml" "C:\Users\David Hamer\Documents\VWUser\2023\Plug-ins\Common\Data\PubliemNames.xml" 

mklink /d "C:\Users\David Hamer\Documents\VWUser\2023\Settings\DWG_DXF\Export" "D:\VWWorkgroup\2023\Settings\DWG_DXF\Export"

 

Also looking at your path it seems very long.  Windows has a file name and path limit of ~256 characters.  So if the file name and path exceed this limit Windows cannot write to that file. 

Edited July 7, 2023 by The Hamma

[Pat Stanford]

@The Hamma Thank you for the real world advice on Synology.  I appreciate the backup.

[C Beard]

Hi @The Hamma

 

Thank you for your advice on Synology. This has fixed the problems I posted about earlier.

 

My Workgroup Library is now working perfectly.

 

And another thank you to @Pat Stanford for your assistance as well.

[The Hamma]

@C Beard  glad it’s working and glad to be of service!