Hoist Tool 2021 & Up Proper Weight Field & Format

[MattG]

I'm sure this has probably been asked but I didn't find it and I'm sure others are wondering, especially as the event world is picking up.

 

With the updated hoist tool in v2021 and up there are a lot of changes.  If I am not using braceworks what is the proper field to use in the OIP to manually enter a weight that would be most appropriate to use?   From my basic reading in the help section I think this is "Hoist Force"?  Is that correct?  The default value in there shows a value in "lbf".  

 

In short I'm wanting to be able to manually enter in weight values of the items hanging from a hoist calculated outside of VW.  My hope/understanding is that when I enter these values I can have them populate and not really effect the overall functionality of the backside of the hoist tools.  

 

I'm also updating my worksheets and reports for these and want to use the correct fields.

 

Additionally with the appropiate field what is the unit value that it is defaulted to?  I am looking in some of the backend items and it looks like a lot are formatted in grams.  I am fine with whatever I just want to know what my base unit is for the field to use it appropriately in a function in the worksheet.

 

@JCodgell  Any thought?

 

Thanks,

Matt

Edited June 24, 2021 by MattG

[Steven Morgan]

I have tried to incorporate the VWX21 Hoist Tool but it's just not quite there yet on a technical level. It's great for designs, showing spansets, etc. The fact that I can't easily swap hoist functions and add load weights in the OIP is a bust for me.

 

For the time being I have still been using the legacy tools which can be added back in under Tools>Workspaces>Tools (not to state the obvious but I've ran across quite a few people that didn't know the legacy tools are still in there.)

[Sam Jones]

 

3 hours ago, MattG said:

In short I'm wanting to be able to manually enter in weight values of the items hanging from a hoist calculated outside of VW.  My hope/understanding is that when I enter these values I can have them populate and not really effect the overall functionality of the backside of the hoist tools.  

 

I'm also updating my worksheets and reports for these and want to use the correct fields.

Matt,

 

The new hoist is confusing in the extreme.  None of the parameters can be viewed with the plug-In manager, but, as you have seen, they can be listed when you create a worksheet of the Hoist PIO.  The universal name of the new Hoist PIO is BrxHoist.  I have written a script that collects all of the parameters of a selected object and writes them to a worksheet.
Below is an image of all the weight and weight related fields that I could find.  I will be referencing the column A names.  You will notice that "WeightWithChain" comes in formatted as a dimension.  It does that both in the vectorscript and the worksheet database.  As a result I have no idea what that number actually represents.

 

I have written another script that collects the weights of all selected objects (of any kind) and lists them in a worksheet and totals them.  For the BrxHoist, I use the "WeightWithChain_formated" field.  I parse the units being used "lb" or "kg" and convert to kg and lb as needed.  I haven't tested, but I suspect that metric drawings are formatted in "kg" and imperial drawings are formatted in "lb".  But this needs to be tested.  My script doesn't care since it will take whatever comes in (kg or lb) and convert to the other.

Hopefully, VW will come back with an explanation of all weight relevant BrxHoist parameters, but until then good luck with your worksheets.  If you are interested in the "Collect and Total Weight" command it is part of the latest AutoPlot Tools for Spotlight upload, 6/17/21.  Which is fully functional for 2 months without registering.

 

 

 

[jcogdell]

@MattG 

The default definition of the hoist fields are

•  Hook Weight equivalent  displays the total load acting on whatever the hoist is hung from, including the hoists own body weight and the total weight of its attached chain (max chain length x weight per meter or foot).
• Hoist Weight equivalent displays the the load acting on the Hoist
•  Hook Force and Hoist Force display the same data but as a force (Kilonewton, pound-force, etc...) rather than a unit of weight.

Since you are not using Braceworks you don't have to use these fields the same way. The only limitation is that the fields are formatted in the hoist properties according to the type of data they are designed to display, so fields documenting a force will use kN or lbf and weight fields kilograms or lbs (or whatever your document units are)

 

 

12 hours ago, MattG said:

In short I'm wanting to be able to manually enter in weight values of the items hanging from a hoist calculated outside of VW.  My hope/understanding is that when I enter these values I can have them populate and not really effect the overall functionality of the backside of the hoist tools.  

This will not cause any problems, you could for example do a test hang of your rigging system, using load cells to get the exact loads for every hoist in the system and then add this to the hoist properties. The only thing to be aware of is that if your file is then run through Braceworks the values in the fields will be replaced by the results of the Braceworks calculation.

 

12 hours ago, MattG said:

I'm also updating my worksheets and reports for these and want to use the correct fields.

 

Additionally with the appropiate field what is the unit value that it is defaulted to?  I am looking in some of the backend items and it looks like a lot are formatted in grams.  I am fine with whatever I just want to know what my base unit is for the field to use it appropriately in a function in the worksheet.

The new hoist object record has 2 versions of each weight related field in its object record, plain and formatted. The plain version  displays the weight in the internal format that Vectorworks uses (Grams) and the formatted version will display the weight using your document unit settings. The fields use the same naming as the Hoist properties.

 

 

@stevenmorgan94 

10 hours ago, stevenmorgan94 said:

he fact that I can't easily swap hoist functions

The enhancement request is in for this

 

10 hours ago, stevenmorgan94 said:

add load weights in the OIP

As long as you are not going to be using Braceworks you can do this, see my above answer

[MattG]

I may be doing this incorrectly and let me know if I am so I can be corrected, but I want to use a data tag that shows the overall point at the top of the hook connecting to the structure in the ceiling.  What field do I use?  My understanding is I should use the "Hook Weight Equivalent" as described above.  I want to be able to enter the known value hanging from the hoist info under "Hoist Weight Equivalent" and have the value in "Hook Weight Equivalent" update its total based on the weight entered and the weight of the hoist & chain.

 

Right now in what I am doing this does not work.

 

Is this correct?

[BSeigel]

Hello @MattG I actually ended up putting something together along these lines a few weeks back. The proper answer is to use Braceworks and have it fill out all of these fields for you. However, not everyone has Braceworks and it would be nice to punch in some information and have it add up in the correct hoist parameter. While it's not an official workflow and you should take all necessary precautions, using a mix of Data Tags and the Data Manager, this is possible in Spotlight. I had a user request to automatically calculate total point load, which is past VW terminology for Hook Weight Equivalent. The formulas are pretty basic except that a lot of the non-formatted fields are in grams and require some conversion. I don't have much time today so I'll post the file for now and try to upload a video soon. 

Point Load Data Tag with automatic Hook Weight Equivalent.vwx

[MattG]

This is basically what I'm looking for.  I get it and can adjust this with your info but this is really a regression from the previous tool for most users.