Help for AutoCad users?

[DGHPTS]

Is there a book or tutorial anywhere for AutoCad users? I've been using AutoCAD for years, just discovered VW Designer, am blown away by the features!

But I'm having a really hard time making the change in terminologies and plotting controls. The manuals that came with it don't seem to follow in an order to get a newbie going, or my brain is still stuck in AutoDesk land.

Any help in pointing me in the right direction would be greatly apprieciated!

Thanx!

[Travis]

Daniel,

Please see this thread and the referenced links:

http://techboard.nemetschek.net/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=12;t=005477

After that you might do a search here on this board under "new user" and other keys. There's a considerable amount of information directly related to your situation. . .it's just spread across numerous posts and threads. I seem to recall that "Oldguy" and "David Bertrand" are recent switchers from A-Cad. You might search on their screen names and scan the threads for answers to their questions.

Finally, since we're both here in Utah, I'd might be able to spend an hour or two with you to help get you started. PM me if you're interested.

Good luck,

[ 11-08-2005, 01:12 AM: Message edited by: Travis ]

[alanmac]

If I remember correctly Nemetschek used to supply a CD or literature specificaly aimed at the Autocad switcher. Check out the main site or do a search there www.nemetschek.net

It's been reorganised a bit with the release of VW12 and like my wife tidying up I can't find things like I use to !!

Alan

[ 11-08-2005, 06:45 AM: Message edited by: alanmac ]

[TomG]

Although improving, the manuals supplied with VW are more like dictionaries in the way they define tools but don't give a working process. The new v. 12 Learning Series CD's look like a good place to start--I've seen the Fundementals disk and it is good. Buy another that covers your area of expertise (Architect, etc.). Also, VectorWorks By Project is good if you can find it and Jonathan Pickup has new v. 12 books coming out in the next month. You'll find his books here on the VW website. Email him to find out his schedule and you should ask him directly if he has chapters that apply to an ACad user coming over.

[Guest]

Recently I purchased 'Essential Vectorworks' from Jonathon Pickup and it is excellent. He provides many exercises for a user to get their head around the software in a structured manner. Most exercises and examples he provides also have a movie that can be viewed. This really helps. I believe if you go down that path and start from scratch you will be up and running in the quickest possible time.

[jan15]

Plotting in VW is visually oriented. The grey-line rectangle (or grid of rectangles to show tiling), which is always on the screen and can't be erased, shows you the part of the drawing that will get printed with the present print set-up. Similar to the dashed line rectangle that appears in Autocad's new layout tabs.

You can change the size of that printable area by changing the printer, paper size, orientation, and print scaling factor, all in the Print Setup window (File > Print Setup), and also by changing the Printable Area in the Set Print Area window (pull-down Page > Set Print Area).

You can move the printable area rectangle by grabbing it and dragging it with the Move Page tool. As if that print window you can select in Autocad were to stay displayed on the screen and you could just move it over a little if you didn't get it in exactly the right place.

The main problem with learning this system after Autocad is that you just can't accept that it's so simple and straight-forward. The only thing that's a little hard to remember is that the Set Print Area is also involved. Sometimes after you use the Print Setup window tiling appears by accident. But you can get rid of that by setting Printable Area to "One Page", which is at the top of the pull-down list.

[jan15]

As far as terminology, here's a list I made years ago comparing AC and VW terms. Parts of it are no longer valid. I'm sorry that I don't have time right now to update it. Perhaps others can point out the obsolete parts.

Same name in VectorWorks as in AutoCad:

Line, Arc, Ellipse, Dimension, Leader, Mirror, Rotate, Offset, Fillet, Trim, Pan, Zoom, Undo, Redo.

Synonyms and Equivalents:

Entity = Object

Dynamic Dialogue = Palette

Toolbar = Tool Palette

Properties = Attributes & Object Info (selected and shown on the Attributes palette & Object Info palette)

Matchprop = Eyedropper tool

Linetype = Dash Style (to create or alter one: Page>SetAttributeDefaults>DashStyles...)

Grips = Selection Handles (turn on "Eight Selection Handles, in File>Preferences>VectorWorksPreferences)

Osnap = Constraint (but it's not necessary to keep changing them, just make sure "Smart Cursor Cues" is turned on, in File>Preferences>VectorWorksPreferences).

Move = just drag the object with the Select tool

Stretch = just drag the selection handles with the Select tool

Copy = hold down Ctrl key and drag the object, or Edit>Duplicate, and then drag the duplicate to wherever you want it

Break = Tool>Trim command (not to be confused with the Trim tool, which is similar to AC Trim)

Chamfer 0 0 = Tool>Join (but the longer part of each line remains, rather than the part that was picked)

Erase = Delete key

Scale = Tool>ScaleObjects

Block = Symbol, and is a little like Group. Symbol insertions can't be re-sized, but they can be converted to Groups and then re-sized. A Group can only have one iteration.

Block command = Organize>CreateSymbol (or Organize>Group)

Insert = Symbol tool

Explode = Organize>ConvertToGroup, then Organize>UnGroup (but it's not necessary to explode a Symbol or a Group in order to edit it, just use Organize>EditSymbol or EditGroup, or just double-click on the Symbol or Group)

Circle = Ellipse tool, modes 2, 3, and 4

MLine = Wall (but VW walls also have 3D height and associated hatch patterns for each wythe, and they accept plug-in objects like doors and windows which automatically cut holes in the wall)

Polygon = Regular Polygon tool

PLine = 2D Polyline & 2D Polygon tools

Pedit = 2D Re-shape tool

Array = Edit>DuplicateArray

Distance = Tape Measure tool

Construction Lines = Guides (to convert selected objects to guides: Edit>Guides>Make Guide)

Zoom Extents = Page>FitToWindow

Zoom All = Page>FitToObjects

Layer = Class (but VW also has Layers, which have no equivalent in AC)

Attributes = Data Records, Worksheets (VW Attributes are the visual properties of an object)

Menu = Workspace (to edit it or select a new one: File>Workspaces)

User Coordinate System = Page>SetGrid and SetOrigin

The VW equivalent to an AC crossing selection (or a window dragged to the left) is a selection window dragged while holding the Ctrl key.

The VW method of adding to the selection set is to hold down the Shift key while selecting. Items already selected are removed from the selection set.

The VW method of sharing geometry or other data that's in another file (somewhat similar to AC Xref) is called Workgroup References.

Not in VectorWorks:

No need to press Enter, SpaceBar or Escape to end a command or tool. A "command" (issued from a pull-down menu or by Ctrl-key combination) usually acts on a pre-selected set of objects, and ends as soon as it's issued. A "tool" (selected from a tool palette or by pressing a letter key) ends when you select a different tool. There's always a currently active tool. Holding down the Space Bar switches temporarily to the Pan tool, and releasing it switches back to the active tool.

No comma needed to separate X and Y coordinates. Use the keypad Enter key before, after, and between coordinates. The coordinate values display at the top of the screen.

No model space and paper space. Everything is drawn to a scale, as with hand drafting, except that the program handles the scale for us. Select a scale for each layer. To have drawings in different scales on the same drawing sheet, just put them on different layers, at different scales. If you want another view of something at a different scale, just copy and paste it onto a layer with that scale, or create a Layer Link to it, which will update automatically when the original is changed.

No equivalent to the AC Extend command, unfortunately. There used to be a very good VW Extend tool, but Nemetschek discontinued it after version 8, and they keep trying to tell us that a new tool (I forget which one) does the same thing. Except for this, they're very responsive to users' needs.

Not in AutoCad:

Every object has line weight, color, and dash style, all visible on screen the same as they'll print out (be sure to select "Zoom Line Thickness", in the "Display" tab of File>Preferences>VectorWorksPreferences). These properties are called "Attributes".

VW 2D surfaces are very useful. They can be made with the Rectangle, Polyline, Polygon, Regular Polygon, Arc, and Ellipse tools, and can be combined by addition and cookie-cutter-subtraction (Tool>AddSurface, or ClipSurface, or IntersectSurface) or by polyline editing. Every surface has associated fill, which can be none, solid color, vector hatch (with or without solid fill background), or bitmap pattern. An entire plan can be quickly put together by combining rectangles into a single surface. Elevations can be drawn quickly by combining rectangles into a complex shape representing a wall surface, with hatching to represent the coursing lines, and then placing solid filled symbols or groups (representing windows and doors) on a layer above that of the walls.

VW Layers are not like AC layers. They're like different sheets of clear film that each contain part of the drawing, layered one on top of another so that all are visible but you can select any of them as the one to draw on, without bringing it to the top of the pile, and with or without seeing the other layers. Alternatively, you can work on all layers at once (Organize>LayerOptions). Filled objects on a higher layer block objects on layers below. Objects within a layer also have layering and can be moved up or down within that layer (Tool>Send>SendForward, Backward, etc.). New objects are drawn at the top of the current layer. VW also has Classes, which are similar to AC layers.

VW has scale, just like hand drafting. Each layer has a scale associated with it, and everything on that layer is drawn to that scale. You can only work on or snap to layers with the same scale as the current layer. Text size and line weight are relative to paper, not to the scale of the layer.

The VW Group is extremely useful. It's not like the AC Group. In some ways it's like the AC Block, but without multiple iterations that all change at once. In some ways it's like an un-named sub-layer (in the VW sense of Layers). It's a way of combining a number of related objects, so they can be selected, moved, copied, mirrored, rotated, etc. all as a group, or so their properties can be changed all at once, or so that the objects in the group can only be edited in a special "EditGroup" mode, during which objects outside the group are visible and snappable but not editable (Organize>EditGroup, or just double-click on the group).

The Wall tool creates a linear object consisting of some number of parallel lines at designated spacing and with specified hatching or bitmap pattern fills between some or all of them. Walls can be edited and joined, and symbols can be inserted in walls, interrupting them for things like doors and windows, and automatically healing when the inserted symbol is moved or deleted.

Text objects can be multi-line, either by using the keyboard Enter key to insert hard line-breaks, or by stretching the text entity to a finite width, so that word-wrap inserts soft line-breaks. End the text object with the keypad Enter key. There are a lot of text formatting options. Version 10 text objects can have tab stops.

Text objects and other visually-located objects can be "nudged" into an exact location by using the arrow keys, alone or in combination with the Shift and/or Ctrl keys (as determined by the "Arrow Keys" section of the "Edit" tab of File>Preferences>VectorWorksPreferences).

Sheets are defined by specifying which Layers and Classes are to be visible on each sheet. The Sheets Menu is pulled up from a tiny icon in the lower left, on the scroll bar.

There's always a Print Border shown on screen as a grey rectangle, showing the limits of the current printable area (not the paper size, but the part of the paper that will be printed on). That printable area is determined by:

1. File>PrintSetup (Printer Name, Paper Size and Orientation, and Scaling); and

2. Page>SetPrintArea (normally keep this set as "One Page", which is at the top of the pull-down list).

The Print Border can be grabbed and dragged to a new location with the Move Page tool.

[Robert Anderson]

Jan15, nice list! A couple of updates:

quote:

---

No model space and paper space. Everything is drawn to a scale, as with hand drafting, except that the program handles the scale for us. Select a scale for each layer. To have drawings in different scales on the same drawing sheet, just put them on different layers, at different scales. If you want another view of something at a different scale, just copy and paste it onto a layer with that scale, or create a Layer Link to it, which will update automatically when the original is changed.

---

Design Layer (nee "layers"), Sheet Layers and Viewports (in VW11 and later) are an equivalent of MS/PS in ACAD.

quote:

---

No equivalent to the AC Extend command, unfortunately. There used to be a very good VW Extend tool, but Nemetschek discontinued it after version 8, and they keep trying to tell us that a new tool (I forget which one) does the same thing. Except for this, they're very responsive to users' needs.

---

I think you're talking about the Connect/Combine tool here.

[quigley]

Robert, no it is not the same.

It only works on one extend at a time. What users want is a tool where they can select a line or curve or object and select multiple lines and say "extend these all to this object".

The VW extend tool requires you click from object to the boundary for each line - very time consuming.

Every Autocad user I meet asks for this!

[propstuff]

kq,

Combine /Connect 1st mode

select multiple objects

hold down option key

click one of the extending objects

click the boundary object.

it's been like that since VW11 I think.

cheers

[David Bertrand]

jan15 says:

quote:

---

Plotting in VW is visually oriented.... The main problem with learning this system after Autocad is that you just can't accept that it's so simple and straight-forward.

---

Huh?

quote:

---

You can change the size of that printable area by changing the printer, paper size, orientation, and print scaling factor, all in the Print Setup window (File > Print Setup), and also by changing the Printable Area in the Set Print Area window (pull-down Page > Set Print Area).

---

Hello! That is not simple.

The whole thing is much easier in AutoCad (here we go again). But since I no longer have AutoCad, it's all moot.

What I've been doing in VW is to create a special sheet layer in which I can play around with different paper sizes, orientations, and print scaling factors (as jan15 suggests). That way I don't mess up my normal sheet layer.

Note that it is better to change the scale in the "page setup" menu than to change the scale (of the viewport) in the "object info" palette. That's so that the leader arrows and the dimension tick marks are scaled properly in the printout.

Of course, then you have to change the size of the sheet to account for the change in scale. See, it gets complicated.

quote:

---

As far as terminology, here's a list I made years ago comparing AC and VW terms...

---

Actually, in AutoCad, the terminology is whatever you want it to be. You can usually assign any keys to do any task by editing the "acad.pgp" file (remember that AutoCad is at its best when used from the command line). My favorite commands were usually shortened to 1-3 letters.

Or you can create an AutoLisp routine to do a series of tasks and then assign any keyboard terminology you like, as with macros.

AutoCad and Vectorworks are so different from each other that it may be better just to forget AutoCad altogether and immerse yourself in Vectorworks alone. That seems to work for me. Also, Vectorworks has features not present in AutoCad, so if you're constantly comparing them, you may not appreciate the difference.

[quigley]

Originally posted by propstuff:

[QB] kq,

Combine /Connect 1st mode

select multiple objects

hold down option key

click one of the extending objects

click the boundary object.

Apologies Robert, thanks propstuff :-)

Didn't know that one......you have no idea how much time that will save!!

[jan15]

But that still doesn't do the thing that we love about the old Extend tool. Whatever object or objects are selected when you switch to the Extend tool become the boundaries, and anything you click on with the Extend tool extends to meet the nearest of those, even if none of the boundary objects are visible on the screen at the time.

It's especially useful with VW's excellent polyline/surface creating tools. You can easily create a large and complex polyline as a boundary object, say the perimeter of a room, or of a wall in elevation or an element of the wall; then move around clicking on things that you want extended to that boundary, even when the boundary is off the screen (which allows zooming in and arrow-panning around to be sure of getting all the little buggers).

This wonderful feature was the second mode of the old Extend tool. A lot of users may never have known about it. The first mode didn't really do anything that couldn't have been done quicker by dragging with the Select tool, and because the default mode was useless many people may have discounted the Extend tool altogether. But the second mode was terrific. I never understood why it was the second mode. It should have been the only mode. It would be nice if there were a mode of the Connect/Combine tool that could do that.

[mike m oz]

I agree with jan15 - I used the second mode of the old extend tool a lot, and I miss its simple functionality.

[ 11-12-2005, 08:14 PM: Message edited by: mike m oz ]

[G-Pang]

Me too, but we manage written some scripts to enhance the extend tool/function.

G-Pang