Customizing Symbols

[S. Schmidt]

I'd like to be able to create a symbol (in this case a picture frame) and add a way to change the texture on just one surface in each instance of the symbol (in this case a picture inside the frame).  Similar to the way the TV tool drops a symbol but allows you to change the image on each individual tv.

 

No idea how to begin figuring out how to do this so any guidance on vocabulary, types of tools or processes would be helpful. 

 

thank you!

[michaelk]

Check out Andrea Facchinello's plug in.  It does exactly what you're talking about.  

 

https://plugins.andreafacchinello.it/frames/

[markdd]

Model the frame as you would like and save it as a symbol

 

place the symbol in the drawing and draw a surface/3D poly or extrude to fill the frame

 

select both objects and convert to a blue symbol (group)

 

then add the blue symbol wherever you need the pictures to be and they will be inserted as groups

 

ungroup them

 

Use the texture tool to change the image for the surface inside each frame.

 

Depending on the frame size vs the texture dimensions you may need to alter some of the mapping using the mapping tool, but that ought to do it.

[Kevin K]

I have found making an image prop of the image is a good way to go.

Very tweakable to get the correct proportions for the image. Place it Inside the frame and away you go!  

[Ben3B]

On 3/15/2023 at 3:15 AM, michaelk said:

Check out Andrea Facchinello's plug in.  It does exactly what you're talking about.  

 

https://plugins.andreafacchinello.it/frames/

often external plugins are solution... i dont understand why this solution are not nativ ... 

they could be integrated inside vectorworks... when you know the licence price ... I cant pay too add plugs...

but maybe its cheaper to let exterior people develop plugin , instead of have more vectorworks employee...

[michaelk]

10 hours ago, Ben59 said:

often external plugins are solution... i dont understand why this solution are not nativ ... 

they could be integrated inside vectorworks... when you know the licence price ... I cant pay too add plugs...

but maybe its cheaper to let exterior people develop plugin , instead of have more vectorworks employee...

 

[Removing ceremonial moderator hat and decorative sash.]

 

I understand why you feel that way.  But allow me to present a different perspective.

 

A lot of the plug-ins you probably already use started out that way.  From your signature I see that you're a Spotlight and ConnectCad user.  Many Spotlight tools and all of ConnectCad were initially developed by people outside Vectorworks and then adopted by VW.

 

I should point out that the picture tool, and several of @AFDesign's tools (including his fantastic gutter tool), are free.

 

It's pretty amazing to me that VW maintains 2(!) scripting languages with Vectorworks specific functions so that any knucklehead with a high school computer class can make plug-ins  (I'm one of those knuckleheads) in addition to a full on SDK for people who actually know how to code.  

 

It's a good strategy for VW.  Any user who took the right class in high school can turn his/her insight working with VW every day into a new tool that can be shared with any other user, making VW even more valuable and useful.  I get that VW is expensive and many people don't want to pay even more for extra plug-ins.  But most people who make plug-ins aren't charging very much.  And VW is an overly flexible program.  There are several ways you can make art to hang on walls without Andrea's plug-in.

 

There is no way someone who made a career in computer programming will have the insight into a design problem or workflow problem the same way as someone who designs every day.  They will write much better code with fewer errors than a knucklehead like me 🙂 , but a computer programmer won't see the need for a picture tool, and won't know the best workflow.  

 

But VW can't just absorb any random outside plug-in.  Speaking for myself, my plug-ins aren't written well enough, don't test enough for potential user errors or bad values (division by zero, etc), don't export any ifc data, don't play well with brace works….  They are good enough to be a huge productivity boost for me and a few others, but I don't think they could just be handed off to hundreds of thousand of users in a dozen different languages.  VW is an ENORMOUS application with hundreds of thousands of users, and the integration of new tools and workflows into an environment with thousands of dependencies has to be done very carefully.

 

Eventually, good ideas like the curtain tool or the speaker array tool or connectcad, do get merged into the main program. 

 

Until then, I'm happy to spend a few dollars for a few small plug-ins.  @AFDesignisn't charging very much.  But his beam, downspout, and gutter plug-ins save me hours on every project.

 

[Ben3B]

30 minutes ago, michaelk said:

but a computer programmer won't see the need for a picture tool, and won't know the best workflow.  

Totally agree with you !!!

 

I understand your explanation, and knew it 😉 (I suspected it.)

But it's frustrating to have 'problem" search solutions and find it (that is cool), what is frustrating is to "loose" time, I feel like I'm wasting as much time as I'm gaining...

Of course seaching help me to understood deeper in VW, but it's frustrating to finally discover that the solution exist outside of VW and not inside 😉

40 minutes ago, michaelk said:

 VW is an ENORMOUS application with hundreds of thousands of users, and the integration of new tools and workflows into an environment with thousands of dependencies has to be done very carefully.

Hope you take your time and done very carefully. 

I took look to external plugs such as https://benghiatlighting.com/software/store/ https://www.landrudesign.com/DefaultFrameSet.htm?index.htm~LandruMnFrm ...

But I don't want to use it not for the price but more for the service... I don't no how it will be and nor how longer.

 

VW is an ENORMOUS application so I know(hope) that if a plug is inside, I will have explication and Development

 

thanks for your work 🙂 you change my life since 2 years 🙂 

 

[Sam Jones]

Scripting is a lot easier than most people think, but it is not as easy as Michael makes it out to be.  It was for him, but if you did not have any computer class that introduced you to programming, you're screwed.  OK, it's not that bad, but learning about variable types and assignment, flow of control, and conditional testing can be daunting without a guiding hand.  As I said at the beginning, it is easier than most people think, but the entrance requirements are usually a big need for simplifying a repetitive simple task, and someone to point the way.  BTW, if you find such a often performed, simple task, the "Customization" forum is filled with people who will help guide you to creating your first command or tool.  Spending way more time in helping you than you thought would ever happen. 

All the above being said, many of us that script in VW look at the work of other scripters, and decide that reinventing the wheel is not worth it, and we purchase the work of others.  Some reinvent the wheel, and sometimes make a better wheel.  In that way better defining both the task and the workflow to attack it.  Sometimes they do that with existing VW commands improving the workflow VW attempted to simplify.

 

 

39 minutes ago, michaelk said:

There is no way someone who made a career in computer programming will have the insight into a design problem or workflow problem the same way as someone who designs every day.

This statement is crucial.  There are going to be times that users create tools that the people at VW never imagined or imagined wrong.  The scripting environment that has been provided by VW is the most important tool it has provided to any user.  If you don't script, you have benefited from the work of someone who has no matter what your industry focus is.  Embrace that, and your life with VW will be much more pleasant.  Nobody, wants to spend more money, but how badly (how much time or mental effort is saved) do you need the functionality that VW failed to provide in the shipping program?  Understand that by providing a scripting environment, they kind have covered all the bases.

[Ben3B]

One last things (or two) 

Because I'm new on VW (2years and before 10years with wysiwyg and sketchup) , it 's lik with MAO there is a lot of plugins, but if you use too many you don't go deeper enough the main software to understand how it works... I need experience in VW to know what I need 😉 

second, I always have to find the good ratio between time consume to find a quicker solution (and don't know if I will find it, if not I'm still at he begining) or use VW internal solution...

Even it's quicker to put a simple note than to edit a datatag, with correct geometry, correct formula, correct records based on it ...
At the end taking time to build/find our plug/ script will be a gain time but I never know when it will be a gain , after 10 project , 100 ...
And I never have time client "always " want something for the day before 🙂

 

"The snake bits its  tail" (le serpent se mort la queue (in french in the text)) : I never have time to work, i need quicker way to work, but develop quicker way take time ...

 

So I need a tool to work effectively, I don't have time too develop tools, I don't want to loose time with malfunction tools, and don't wan't to setup a workflow who will maybe obsolete because of external tools  who are stopped ...

 

But I 'm maybe at the point where external tools are needed, I maybe know enough VW to know what is not optimal and what I need 🙂