Lost ability to use image props for sky reflections in windows?

[Christiaan]

We've previously been able to create environmental/sky reflections in the windows of our elevation drawings by using an Image Props behind the Section Line of a Section Viewport.

 

We seem to have lost this ability at some point between now and the middle of last year. Image props are no longer reflected in the windows. I'm assuming it's a bug because I can't make it work and nor can Stephan Mönninghoff.

 

But I'd I wanted to check if anybody else had some ideas on solving this or using another method.

 

Test file attached:  test-file.vwx 2.zip

 

 

 

VB-148280

[zoomer]

1st, you may already know,

there is a setting in Viewports if hidden geometry will be shown in Reflections or not.

 

2nd, very unlikely,

but I had problems in C4D R19, that Reflections were not shown at all (!)

for my (simple non IOR Arch-) Glass - until I activated some Refraction.

 

And that R19 CineEngine should found its way into VW with VW 2019.

[Christiaan]

5 minutes ago, zoomer said:

1st, you may already know,

there is a setting in Viewports if hidden geometry will be shown in Reflections or not.

 

Yes, I think you're talking about the "Cast Shadows of Objects Removed by Section" aren't you? I have that checked (but this little nuance did stump me last year when I started using this method).

 

5 minutes ago, zoomer said:

2nd, very unlikely,

but I had problems in C4D R19, that Reflections were not shown at all (!)

for my (simple non IOR Arch-) Glass - until I activated some Refraction.

 

And that R19 CineEngine should found its way into VW with VW 2019.

 

I like your thinking. Am I "activating" refraction by using these settings? If so it's already active:

 

Edited September 28, 2018 by Christiaan

[zoomer]

1. Yes, that setting.

 

2. Refraction active :

You don't need (time consuming) blurryness.

Transmission is ok if you want to slightly darken the glass.

Important to activate Refraction is that you set "Index of Refraction" (IOR)

to a value grater than 1,0 (Vacuum), like 1,517 for a typical Building Glass.

 

 

For standard flat + parallel Window Glass Panels, in reality there will be some

IOR Refraction and Ray bending of course. But you will not notice that in a

Rendering that the Ray behind the panel may have jumped 2-3 mm parallel

to the original direction (opposed to a curvy Object like a Bottle).

Therefor in ARchViz you often use a fake simple Arch Glass without Refraction,

to save some Render Time.

Edited September 28, 2018 by zoomer

[Christiaan]

Well I've learnt something today, thanks. Didn't resolve problem unfortunately.

[zoomer]

Yes, sorry, it was unlikely.

As I see by the brighter color, there is a Reflection on the Glass.

Just not the one you like ....

 

As far as I remember, image props had their own problems.

Would it work as expected if you temporarily put some real geometry there ?

[PVA - Admin]

Definitely something to do with the section viewport. Taking a look now. When I render out on the design layer I can see the reflections just fine.

Do you recall the last time you had this work successfully for you? 

[Christiaan]

14 minutes ago, Jim Wilson said:

Do you recall the last time you had this work successfully for you? 

 

May 2017 Jim.

[Christiaan]

37 minutes ago, zoomer said:

Would it work as expected if you temporarily put some real geometry there ?

 

Yeah tried that. No cigar.

[zoomer]

Found that there is a file attached.

Tried in VW 2019 but get an empty Viewport after updating.

And the Geometry on DL appears sometimes only too.

But I am Mojave 😉

 

Will restart.

[Christiaan]

Just updated the test file to use the correct glazing. Not that it makes any difference.

[PVA - Admin]

Confirmed, it is indeed a bug that cropped up somewhere between 2018 and 2019, will bump. VB-148280

[Christiaan]

Thanks Jim. I need to come up with some other solution for my deadline on Monday then.

[zoomer]

12 hours ago, Christiaan said:

I need to come up with some other solution for my deadline on Monday then.

 

You can use a separate special VW Background for Material Reflections.

Like from an image that looks similar to your Things in front of your Section.

(You could just render your Image Props for that)

[Gadzooks]

12 hours ago, Christiaan said:

I need to come up with some other solution for my deadline on Monday then

 

Appears to work in 2017 Christiaan. The small area you've provided as a test gives subtle clouds that I would assume will fill the whole elevation as you were expecting. Its certainly making a difference.

 

Testfile 2

 

Opened in 2017

 

 

Assuming you are only after visuals for Monday, maybe this will work?

[Christiaan]

Scholar and a gentleman, thank you, that should do just fine. I'll try it on Monday 🙂

Edited September 30, 2018 by Christiaan

[Christiaan]

Pretty sure this technique doesn't work again anymore, at least as of v2024.

[Gadzooks]

On 12/18/2023 at 5:35 AM, Christiaan said:

Pretty sure this technique doesn't work again anymore

 

Brocken again?? Hey - are we stuck on a fairground ride and the VW staff have left for the evening?

 

Assuming you want to use the old technique mainly for clouds/atmosphere and something broke it again, could you use a different texture for the glass? More of a fiddle, but once you've achieved a pleasing effect you can use on all projects - controlled by class (as I know your glazing is) you then have the option to switch on/off with a different look for construction detail.

 

This is a (maybe not so subtle) example................

 

 

The texture uses noise....(was resizing attachments ever fixed and I never saw how?)

 

 

This uses Turbulence.....

 

 

 

Others also create 'clouds' given a tweak here and there.

 

 

I'm on VW2018 so you may have better options.