Requesting advice for 2D drawing of a curved walkway of varying width with cobble-like pavers arranged in running-bond rows roughly perpendicular to the curved edges.

[jmccain8]

Hello - I am working on a 2D plan in Landmark v2022 and trying to create an irregularly curved walkway made of pavers with each row of pavers arranged running bond that is roughly perpendicular to the side of the walkway. These are the steps I thought to take, but with no success:

 

1. 2D Polygon Tool to fill areas defined by the edges of the walkway
2. Select the polyline (created by the above step) and go into the Landmark menu - Create Objects from Shapes - Object Type 'Hardscape' - Show Properties Dialog

• Hardscape Style - Unstyled
• Configuration - Pathway - Width *** not sure what is meant by 'width' and would think it would just read the shape I've highlighted, which has a width that varies along the way ***
• Draw 2D - Joint Pattern - Pavers Curved Path
  • Set Curved Path Pattern Options - entered 9" width across path x 5" length along path x 50% next joint course offset

 

Something tells me I am not understanding some of the terminology being used in these tools or am using the wrong tools to try and achieve my goals.

 

Any ideas? Attached is a screen-clip of the plan. One of the walkway sections is outlined in orange (selected). The photograph is to give you an idea of the orientation of the pavers that I would like to illustrate.

 

Thank you!

James

 

P.S. I also struggled to show pavers in those narrow bands running perpendicular to the length of the driveway and had to completely fudge it. The bands are actually very shallow arcs created from large circles with a distant center point. In this case, I kept receiving the error "The pathway hardscape could not be created because it is self intersecting."

  

  

[Jeff Prince]

Some things are best defined as boundary hardscapes for your BIM / quantification purposes and then embellishing them with 2d graphics to efficiently get the aesthetics you want.  

The hardscape tool doesn’t even know how to miter the border corners on a rectangular patio, what you are asking for is far more challenging/impossible for the software to address.

[jmccain8]

Thanks, Jeff - Is there any way to apply a hatch to the area in a way that orients the rows of pavers perpendicular to the curved edge?

[Jeff Prince]

2 hours ago, jmccain8 said:

Thanks, Jeff - Is there any way to apply a hatch to the area in a way that orients the rows of pavers perpendicular to the curved edge?

Nope.  You would need something with the capability to interpret the curve and adjust accordingly.  There are settings within vectorworks hardscape object that could draw similar to what you desire.  A hardscape configured as a pathway with using curved pattern might get close to what you want.  I draw mine, if they are needed, because it’s faster & better looking.

[jmccain8]

Thanks for the clear answer, however frustrating it is!  

 

I appreciate your help.

James

[Benson Shaw]

@jmccain8 Is this what you are trying to do?  Totally manual workflow, but manageable in this small area.  Although the product produces large gaps, ≈ half paver width, between pavers at outer edge of each course.  Coarse filler gravel? Sliver cuts? Mud? Drawing shows 5x9 units with prox .25" joints in courses. More proof of concept than actual map of paver placement and count.

 

Here, I used Duplicate Along Path. Although individual course placement/rotation could work as well:

• Pathway edges are formed or approximated by tangent arcs.  Decompose to extract the required arcs.
• 2 courses of rectangle "pavers", sufficiently long to extend through widest parts of the pavement.  Extensions facilitate centering during DAP.
• Group each course with a line to center it on the edge curves. A starts at end of line, B is offset by a half paver length.
• Choose the inner arc(s) for each portion of the path edge.  I offset the curve for the DAP, then moved back to position.
• DAP the course A with start offset = 1/2 paver width.
• DAP course B with start offset = 1.5 paver width.
• Group the collection.
• Repeat at each inner arc.
• Rotate each group as necessary to match A/B with group from opposite edge. Delete the extra courses.
• Clip Surface each group with clipping shapes to delete the excess

Unit paver madness!

-B

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Jeff Prince]

Or just make it with a fine grain exposed aggregate with sparing use of some nice radial saw cuts 🙂

[unearthed]

Whatever happened to the small graphical patches we were taught back when pencils were the main tool. Drawings need to leave room for the imagination, if your clients are so lacking in imagination they need literally everything shown you have the wrong clients IME.

[Benson Shaw]

Actually it’s a curse. I love to draw and solve problems for others (and myself). Paver madness is not new to me. OP requested how this could be drawn. Post shows one method, fairly easy and quick, derived from my projects with intricate color schemes and pavement geometry.
 

Post also reveals that this radial arrangement may not work well. Those big gaps may defeat the design intent. Better to discover early and virtually rather than after construction headaches and $ and client disappointment. Mud set might work, or @jeff prince’s CIP with radial cuts, or pave long edge concentric to pathway edges with cuts to meet a center line, or herringbone, or CIP with stamps or trowel lines, or different pavers, or change the pathway shape, or . . .  Designer choices. Draw to test. 

 

I’m down with the idea of things left to imagination, and client ability to visualize. Eg, I don’t try for photo realism which can lock in expectation when some artistic license serves better. Cartoony OGL/Shaded is usually how far I take it. Although I do appreciate others’ realistic renderings. 

-B

 

 

Edited March 6, 2022 by Benson Shaw
images

[jmccain8]

@Benson Shaw WOW. Just WOW. This is amazing. Thanks for taking so much time to so thoroughly work this out, and yes, to reveal that this might not be a good design choice after all!

 

@unearthed Yes, I agree that sometimes it's better and certainly more efficient to use generic hatching to convey an idea rather than being so literal as to show every line, though as Benson noticed, taking the time to render this revealed that this radial arrangement may not work well, which will save me and others a major headache down the road. 

 

 

[unearthed]

On 3/6/2022 at 8:25 PM, Benson Shaw said:

Actually it’s a curse. I love to draw and solve problems for others (and myself). Paver madness is not new to me. OP requested how this could be drawn. Post shows one method, fairly easy and quick, derived from my projects with intricate color schemes and pavement geometry.
 

Post also reveals that this radial arrangement may not work well. Those big gaps may defeat the design intent. Better to discover early and virtually rather than after construction headaches and $ and client disappointment. Mud set might work, or @jeff prince’s CIP with radial cuts, or pave long edge concentric to pathway edges with cuts to meet a center line, or herringbone, or CIP with stamps or trowel lines, or different pavers, or change the pathway shape, or . . .  Designer choices. Draw to test. 

 

I’m down with the idea of things left to imagination, and client ability to visualize. Eg, I don’t try for photo realism which can lock in expectation when some artistic license serves better. Cartoony OGL/Shaded is usually how far I take it. Although I do appreciate others’ realistic renderings. 

-B

 

 

 

@Benson Shaw, that's a beautiful installation and translation from drawing!

[Benson Shaw]

@unearthed thanks for the strokes. Superb pro install crew made the pavers just right. I cut out circles and grouted in the mosaic disks.  The work was fine for 9 years. Then the snow removal crew hit it too hard with a BobCat mounted blade.  Gouged and lifted many pavers, embedded iron bits in the stainless cutouts (rust streaks), lifted out one of the disks, etc.  Local grounds crew tried in vain to repair, big brouhaha among 3 state agencies - No! You pay for it!. We decommissioned the pavement and I remade the discs as a wall hung entry feature.  Another typical day in the cruel world of Public Art!

-B

For additional reading may I suggest Shelley’s Ozymandias:

https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/46565/ozymandias