JoeF Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 Thank You Pete! That's the answer I was looking for! I should have read your previous post more closely. Quote Link to comment
Petri Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 Pete, Where you learn all these tricks? I've used MC/VW for 15 years, but never realised this. (Not the #-trick, either. Do you guys actually RTFM?) Petri Quote Link to comment
P Retondo Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 Petri, it's just hit-or-miss dumb luck. Probably because I seldom read the manual and just do things that I expect will work, and sometimes they do! Quote Link to comment
JoeF Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 Still does not work. I have created a symbol that has three lines of text created with hard (enter) returns. created a record format with a field with a # appended to it. attached the field with the # appended to the 3 line text with the "link text to record" command. exited the symbol creation. selected the symbol and tried to enter multiline text. Text does not wrap. I know I am doing something wrong. Cannot figure out what it is. Too bad the manual is useless. Quote Link to comment
P Retondo Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 Joe, sorry, it seems that something has changed with version 12. My symbol was created in an earlier version, and, as I said, there used to be a "square" symbol where the hard returns were in the string. The symbol still works in version 12.5, but I can't make a new one using the old method. There aren't any "squares" in the string now, but if I step the cursor through the string it takes two taps of the arrow key to move from one character to another where the line breaks are. So the program still recognizes the return, but it won't display it and I can no longer paste a return into the field's default text window - it just won't accept the return. If I paste my old string into Word, it recognizes the invisible return characters. If I recall correctly, I created this symbol in version 11. I can't remember everything clearly - I may have pasted my text with returns into the default textstring when creating the record field. NNA: is there a return character that would still work in record fields in the current version of VW? Speaking of which, it would be handy to have a "paste special character" command from within the text tools (similar to Word). You probably have already thought of this, but what I used to do - before temporarily discovering how to put line breaks into the text - was to have separate fields for each line, separately attached to the symbol. Quote Link to comment
JoeF Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 Thanks again Pete, I'll use separate lines. I wonder why this was changed. I was expecting some expert advice from the "Administrators". Seems odd to express interest in a query and then just go all quiet. Quote Link to comment
P Retondo Posted January 26, 2007 Share Posted January 26, 2007 Joe, update - I was able to cut and paste the invisible line breaks from one instance of a symbol to another using the Data tab in the OIP dialog. Here's the string, which contains 1 invisible return character (creates a visible return in this BB program): LONGITUDINAL SECTIONS Play with this and see if you can get it to work in your data dialog. Copy the text from the "L" through the last "S." I was able to get it to work in a newly created symbol, but the two lines didn't align on the left and I had to add spaces in front of the first word to get them to look right. Quote Link to comment
JoeF Posted January 26, 2007 Share Posted January 26, 2007 I'll give this a try. But not right now. I have a deadline looming and no time for experimentation. I'll let you know how it goes. Quote Link to comment
Petri Posted January 26, 2007 Share Posted January 26, 2007 Right-o. Separate lines are often the appropriate approach: FLOOR PLAN EXISTING CONDITIONS LEVEL 13 and I, for one, would not like to compose such entries in another program, just to be pasted into VW. Nor would I like to lose the ability to generate a list of drawings. Either & both would be a ridiculous exercise with only some 200 to 300 drawings in a project. In a big job, even more so. On the other hand, there are projecs & drawings where drawing titles cannot be reduced to a predefined number of statements. Why can't we have wrapping in linked text? Why can't we insert returns in data records? Could be ASCII 11 (VT) or 10 (LF), I don't care. Quote Link to comment
P Retondo Posted January 26, 2007 Share Posted January 26, 2007 (edited) Petri, agreed, this needs to be fixed and from what I can tell, could be done very easily. With a little further experimentation, I found that if you just paste the string any VW text block that contains hard returns into the data entry window, your symbol will take on the multiline text - the only problem being that the text is centered instead of left-justified! Since this sheet number field was originally centered text when the symbol was constructed, I suspect that a left-justified text block attached as a record would give left-justified results. It seems to me that this might give us a way to do multiline text with no fuss. Edited January 26, 2007 by P Retondo Quote Link to comment
Guest Posted January 26, 2007 Share Posted January 26, 2007 Joe, In order to use a title block with a multi-line field, the title block must be used in a drawing border (by clicking the "Title Block..." button in the OI palette.) To do this you must save the file containing the symbol in the folder "Libraries\Defaults\Drawing Border - Title Blocks." Once you insert the title block into the drawing border and then click on the "Edit Title Block..." button in the OI palette, the multi-line fields will contain a multi-line text box in the dialog that opens. The text won't automatically wrap in these fields, but these fields will accept carriage returns and the multiple lines will appear in the title block as typed. As to symbols with linked text containing multiple lines, as most of you have noted this is difficult, at best. The only way to accomplish this, as far as I know, is to copy and paste a text string that contains carriage returns into the data pane of the OI palette. (The carriage returns show up in the OI palette as squares.) It doesn?t matter if the original text field in the symbol was wrapped or not, multiple lines can only be created by the method described above. If you are planning to place the title block symbol manually, you are probably better off using separate fields for each line of text. I hope this helps. Tom Urie Nemetschek, N.A. Quote Link to comment
Petri Posted January 27, 2007 Share Posted January 27, 2007 Tom, This is (assuming I understand the situation correctly) not acceptable. I have not revisited Drawing Borders and associated stuff since the use- and hopeless ones in VWA 9, so it is of course possible that one can nowadays - define the appearance and layout of the border absolutely freely (instead of the godawful engineery stuff I saw: A-B-C, 1-2-3 etc. Look, I don't even like Little Stevie Wonder doing that!) - use one's own titleblocks in a hassle-free manner - operate the entire thingumabob with one's own data fields (and language) - enable a meaningful revision-tracking system to one's own taste (or client's requirements) and so on and so forth. In short: having been in the business for over 30 years, I don't need any NNA programmer to tell me how to manage my drawings, thank you very much. Drawing borders: In many cases I don't want any. For blueprints from tracing paper, they were of course needed so that the print could be trimmed, but you may be aware that modern "plotters" use paper of the correct width and cut it to correct size. If I choose to have a border, that is then a 0.35 line around the "drawing area" : the title block is outside it. In the Good Old Days, I had a 0.13 border for trimming, but I certainly never liked it. Used red ink for those - just visible in prints, but not distracting. (The print shops hated me, but what's news in that?) Oh, getting back to "one's own title blocks". I have some where certain info is duplicated (or only shown) in very large display type at the top and/or right hand side of the sheet. It could be "Nokia Incorporated Head Office" "Proposal February 2007" "Floor Plan" "Level 13: Game Design Department" artistically arranged around a drawing in various orientations. Quote Link to comment
jbrhwy Posted January 27, 2007 Share Posted January 27, 2007 Petri For a drafting challenged (I wiil blame it on advancing age not mental) road designer the new Drawing Border Tool & custom title block are great especially since the title block size is easily scalable in the viewport. For me they are simple, fast & I like the appearance. Quote Link to comment
Petri Posted January 28, 2007 Share Posted January 28, 2007 I'm sure they are practical, but are they of the graphic design quality architects expect? I guess I have to test. Quote Link to comment
Travis Posted January 29, 2007 Share Posted January 29, 2007 One can also paste a carriage return (CR) into a string of text. Use this procedure: select the text tool and create an entry point somewhere on a sheet; type a CR (only), the cursor will "add" a line; use the Select All command or highlight the CR; Copy; Paste wherever you like. I use this to insert multi-line information in dimensions, title blocks, call-outs, etc. Good luck, Quote Link to comment
P Retondo Posted January 30, 2007 Share Posted January 30, 2007 Travis, the callout tool in v12.5 will accept a carriage return directly from the keyboard. Are you sure that your method works for dimensions? I haven't been able to confirm that. I think it would be a good idea for NNA to change the program a bit so that all tools that accept text work like the text block does - the regular keyboard "Enter" produces a return, the numberpad "Enter" exits or advances to the next item. Quote Link to comment
Travis Posted January 30, 2007 Share Posted January 30, 2007 Good point, Pete. I was thrilled when I didn't have to use this workaround in the callouts anymore. And, yes, I do use the pasted CR method in dimensions frequently. . .even in 12.5.1 Would strongly agree that consistent text entry would be valuable. Do you want to post this to the Wish List? Quote Link to comment
P Retondo Posted January 30, 2007 Share Posted January 30, 2007 Travis, I have posted something to the wishlist. There must be a difference between Mac OS and Windows, because when I attempt to paste a string with a carriage return into the dimensions leader or trailer fields, it pastes text up to and not including the CR - the OIP just won't accept a carriage return character for this object type. Quote Link to comment
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