How can you rotate hybrid objects that can't be edited?

[Bad Machines]

This is insanely frustrating. I can find no help on this topic in relation to the object I am using.

 

I am using HVAC Elbow Duct Round 90 from the Resource Manager. I can place this object on the 2D Top/Plan and this object is also represented in the 3D plane too. I understand there is both 2D symbol and 3D object combined. But, how the hell do I rotate this object beyond the z level?

 

I've seen multiple threads that say to remove the 2D symbol to leave it 3D only, but I cannot edit this object. I don't see a way to delete the 2D object from the 3D object to rotate this on a number of objects I am working on that are hybrid. It's very annoying the complexity to rotate a 3D object and also have 2D representation.

[michaelk]

The reason it doesn't work the way it seems like it should is that the symbol you are using is a red symbol.  (If you look at it in the Resource Manager you will see the name of the symbol is in red).  This means that it's actually a group of settings for a plug in object.  It's like a Marvin door.  It's still using the door tool.  But the symbol contains all the settings to configure it to be a specific door.

 

To get what you need:

 

Place the elbow in the drawing.  

Go to any 3D view.  

Select the object.  

Modify>Convert>Convert to Group (Command-K on a Mac/Control-K on Windows)

In the next dialog box choose Don't convert sub-objects to groups

 

This will give you a group.  Ungroup it and you will have the sweep.

 

Then make the symbol you want:

Select the sweep.  

Modify>Create Symbol

In Other Options make sure that Convert to Group is NOT selected.

 

Now you will have a symbol that can rotate any way you want.

 

Keep an eye on the colors of symbol names.

 

Black - normal everyday symbol you meet walking down the street

Red - A parametric object (like a door, window, plant, etc) with a specific set of parametric values

Blue - A symbol that stops being a symbol when inserted.  If more than one object is in the symbol it converts to a group.  If only one object, then it converts to just that object.  The link to the symbol is broken when the symbol is inserted.

Green - A symbol that ignores scale.  It's alway at it's page size.

[michaelk]

PS iF you use the HVAC Elbow Duct Tool in the MEP toolset and set the values to be Type: Round and the angle to be 90 you will get the same object.

 

In the OIP go to Style and choose New Plug-in Style from Unstyled Plug-in…

 

Give it a name and it will save it as a red symbol!  That's where this symbol comes from.  That's why it resists being edited.

[michaelk]

If you still need a 2D representation, once you get the 3D symbol rotated in to place you can use AEC > Create Auto Hybrid.

[Mark Aceto]

For clarification, it's not a hybrid symbol; it's an auto-hybrid plugin object. That means VW is drawing the 2D in real time parametrically based on the... parameters... entered in the OIP.

 

For the vertical members, users are limited to right angles. For horizontal members, there's a little more control with elbow angles.

 

 

To work around this, I've used extrude along path objects with custom data records for each Shai-hulud:

 

 

 

 

 

You could even attach the stock Duct record if it suits you:

 

There's also a third party plugin called VectorMEP to address all of this.

 

BTW Michael helped me out with this.

 

[michaelk]

1 hour ago, Mark Aceto said:

For clarification, it's not a hybrid symbol; it's an auto-hybrid plugin object. That means VW is drawing the 2D in real time parametrically based on the... parameters... entered in the OIP.

 

Good point, Mark.

 

It's confusing because they both live in the same place in the resource manager and only the color of the name sets them apart.  

[Mark Aceto]

What's more confusing is that I believe the "politically correct" workflow is to select those resources through the PIO resource selector rather than dragging them from the RM but VW really need to put out a PSA because I'm working with more and more "Draggers" who don't realize that PIO's exist, so half the time it's a "dumb" symbol (speaker, truss, whatever) instead of the parametric goodness unique to VW.

 

Also, look at that gorgeous Unstyled button at the top of the pane!

 

 

 

[Bad Machines]

Thanks guys, I was able to get it working.