Hardware recommendations for BIM projects - many DLVPs

[HebHeb]

Hey there,

 

i've read a lot about hardware recommendations. "should perform well", "is okay",.. aren't really constructive in my case.

 

actual machine:

• i7 6700
• 16GB RAM 2133 DDR4 (4x 4GB: not the same Models, voltage is the same,  but not sure about timings, but propably the same)
• GTX 1050ti 4GB VRAM
• standard SSD
• Win 7 - Vectorworks 2017 SP3

 

the complex file scenario:

• huge, detailed site model (we are landscapearchitects)
• about five ifc-Models referenced as DLVP from project partners, each about 350MB - 750MB sized, visibility while modelling needed, a decreasing of geometry is too time-consuming cause of weekly update of files
• own construction Layers with 'simple' 3D geometry with about 200-300 MB when exported as ifc
• many! of plan view illustrations as DLVP, really often needed -  i guess this is where i max out the 1050ti... - mostly clean 2D files with up to 150MB size

 

actually the PC can handle erverthing quite well, especially if not needed things are invisible and you are always aware of things you shouldn't do at once. This is the first project where i think more power could speed up workflow. From time to time the performance isn't really as i would expect from a 2016 hardware configuration.

some tasks that are really slow,  time-consuming and kill the workflow:

• importing ifc files
• refresh site model
• refresh sections
• slope-ground plot tool
• activate layers with complex 3D geometry
• refresh references - really slow with complex files - imo the biggest workflow killer

 

Compared to another machine (Mac OS X - see signature) everything is much more fluent compared to the machine described above.

 

So we might plan on replacing the system with a new one if things could speed up with an upgrade.

I think a really fast M.2 SSD is a good thing to invest in.

But also there are some decisions that aren't easy to make:

• 6-core processor vs higher rated 4-core processor - so whats more important: high clocked or better multicore performance?
• GTX 1060 vs GTX 1070
• 32GB RAM vs 64GB RAM - I max out the 16GB I have right now especially while multitasking and importing files - but most of the time there is like 1-2GB headroom
• is there any profit of fast RAM modules?

 

does the GPU do more than just render the Viewport? because there is always the general advise to invest in a fast GPU... watching my 1050ti with gpu-z shows me it is  running at highest clock 90% of the time while using VW, no matter what I do (2D or 3D), expect of doing nothing than the core clock throttles down. Also I see that the 4GB VRAM are 100% in use sometimes, eascpecially during 3D modelling.

 

So maybe someone can give us some more detailed advice on what a solid system should look like. - I'm aware of the actual hardware recommendations for the 2018 release, but im sceptical cause it is to gerneral.

 

Cheers!

 

 

Edited November 12, 2017 by Heblon

[Art V]

For now I would go for a higher clock speed per core over two more cores at lower clock speed, Vectorworks itself is mostly single core though rendering is multi-core but I guess it is the part before the rendering where you need to have the maximum performance in your case, so higher speed for the processor will matter more. 32GB of RAM should be fine, unless you are also running other software with memory demanding requirements alongside VW, then depending on the other software 64GB might be an option to consider.

 

The GPU is also used for the VGM (which also does 2D display). Regarding graphics card, speed and GPU RAM do matter, the higher the speed and the more GPU RAM the better but only up to a certain point. I've had a similar situation where my laptop would slow down to a crawl but a noticeably higher specced laptop turned out to be equally slow, so at some point things will simply be slow anyway.

 

Given the configuration your machine should be plenty powerful, but.... your RAM is clocked at 1333 MHz. If you could have a custom machine and you can get the RAM speed optimized to maximum performance then higher speed memory could have more impact on operating speed than just a more powerful CPU. But you would need memory that can run at eg. 2600 or higher MHz to get that performance as well as a motherboard that can handle it etc. I don't know if such a RAM upgrade is even possible with your Mac. Ideally, if you would switch to Windows 10 you could get one of the 4+ GHZ processors coupled with 2600MHz or higher speed RAM and a fast SSD drive (NVMe/PCIE) for both system and data storage. But that will cost you quite a bit of money. Someone on this forum created a virtual setup for an AMD Threadripper machine and that came to approx. 4500 USD for just the components.

 

That being said, VW2018 is having some speed issues with several people compared to e.g. VW2017, not just start-up time but also lags with normal operations like pan, zoom, moving objects etc.. I don't know if this is also affecting you.

[HebHeb]

Thanks for your reply,

 

my Mac machine was just for comparison, I tested the project there to have a reference , so I guess the amount of RAM and the faster GPU give me the more fluent user experience. Unfortunately this machine is 7 years old, so be patient with my power machine

 

For sure the operating system will be Win 10.

 

So i think a proper system could look like this:

 

• CPU: i7 8700K - will be aviable in December - the 7700K doen't support RAM faster than DDR4-2400
• RAM: 32 GB DDR4-2666
• GPU: 1060 GTX 6GB VRAM
• the fastest M.2 Flash Blade for the system
• a fast M.2 Flash Blade as scratch disk

 

I aldready supected that VW is mostly single Thread, i hope that will change in future.

 

Edited November 16, 2017 by Heblon

[Art V]

You are mostly on the right track with your system, the i7 8xxx series is supposed to be a bit more noticably better than the 7xxx series in performance, i.e. the increase is more than was the case with the previous series "upgrade"

 

For the GPU, if the 9xx series relative performance differences still hold up for the 10xx series you may want to consider getting a 1070 GTX instead of a 1060 GTX.  If possible I'd go for Display Port over HDMI at the moment, especially with 4K monitors or two 2K or higher resolution monitors. If you go for HDMI make sure it is at least HDMI 2.0 but preferably the very latest HDMI specification, as anything less than that will most likely not support 2x 2K or up.

 

For a data storage working drive (for active projects) you may also want to consider the Transcend SSD370S 1TB drive as it has a quite high write endurance (better than almost all other SSD drives) and is supposedly among the fastest "normal" SSD cards and the next best thing besides a M.2 PCIE SSD.  If you are going to consider this one then make sure it is the 370S  and not the 370 (without S) as the latter is an different SSD drive series performance and endurance wise.

 

Regarding the flash blades, if they are on PCIE cards the please do check the motherboard specs for which PCIE lanes are used for that as they may take use the same PCIE lanes that are also used for the GPU and could then reduce the available bandwith for your GPU and reduce overall graphics performance. Also make sure you get good cooling, as those very fast blades can get quite a bit warmer than regular SSD drives under load.