Rendering Elevations

[ErichR]

To render a line elevation, which all architects have to do, and to have the rendering be portable, one has to use the Convert Copy to Lines or Convert Copy to polygons.

Interesting that these commands arent within the Renderworks menu, since these are really rendering options.

More importantly, I just created an elevation by using Convert Copy to Polygons, and there ended up being 18,500 objects! Multiply that by four, for a minimum number of elevations, and the file gets fat fast. This results from a super simple box of a building with a minimum of partitions in the interior.

When you hide hidden lines, why not delete the hidden lines??? If you don't want to see them why save them?

[Guest]

Erich,

The convert to lines or polygons is a geometric action, not a rendering action.

You are copying the 3d objects and converting the 3d objects to a new, 2d object.

While it is try that you had to use this behavior in earlier versions of VW to have multiple elevations lay out on one sheet, you no longer need to do that with Viewports in VW 11.

(You didn't have to do it in earlier versions either if you could stand one elevation per sheet or had Architect and used the Model View Tool)

In VW 11, create separate viewports and put them all on one page, each with the designated view - right, left, front, iso, etc.

Then simply select Hidden Line Rendering as the rendering option.

[Andrew Bell@NV]

quote:

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Originally posted by ErichR:

When you hide hidden lines, why not delete the hidden lines??? If you don't want to see them why save them?

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The lines are deleted, the many objects you see are polygons. The hidden line code trims the lines, not the polygons, so it never computes what polygons are visible, partially visible, or completely hidden.

To reduce the number of polygons to only those visible, and to remove their invisible parts, would require writing a completely new rendering algorithm to do so, and it probably would be intolerably slow.

[Kevin]

In my experience, using hidden line rendering produces unwanted lines and leaves out some needed lines. My solution was to "Convert Copy to Lines", Ungroup, and then edit the image.

How do we handle this now with viewports?

[alanmac]

quote:

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Originally posted by Kevin:

In my experience, using hidden line rendering produces unwanted lines and leaves out some needed lines. My solution was to "Convert Copy to Lines", Ungroup, and then edit the image.

How do we handle this now with viewports?

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I agree. I've never been fortunate enough to have the hidden line render in any view show exactly what I want or need to show without change. Some editing is always required, and have always relied on the method Kevin describes.

[Guest]

When you do a convert to polygons/lines, you are using the hidden line technology.

Do you have example files that show a hidden line rendering producing something different than the convert copy to polys/lines?

If you do, are you selecting the wireframe or hidden line option in the conversion dialog box?

[Kevin]

With all due respect Katie, this is not new news. The behaviour that I describe is known by many. Robert Anderson's solution for VW9 and earlier was to draw a white line over the offending lines. I simply chose to delete them.

Katie, is it really your experience that Convert Copy to Lines using Hidden Line Option always produces the expected results?

[mike m oz]

I have just spent days (and most of the night as well) converting hidden line renderings into useable elevations and sections.

Having built a fairly good model of the building for presentation and DA purposes I stupidly thought I could use it to produce the working drawing elevations and sections

In the end I gave up on trying to edit the results from the hidden line renderings of the elevations and 3D section cuts and resorted to tracing over them. There are just too many problems:

- fragments of lines all over the place (zillions of them)

- duplicate lines everywhere

- lines that aren't actually there: plus

- the lines that are missing of course

I even purchase the Vectorbits OPTIMISE DRAWING plug-in and tried that to see if it would get rid of some of the crap. It was only partially successful - there was still a lot left. And of course it can't remove the erroneous lines or add in the missing ones.

Generating useable elevations and sections from models is essential if the BIM concept is to have legs. ArchiCad and BOA manage it so why can't you guys?

[ 11-30-2004, 01:52 AM: Message edited by: mike m oz ]

[Kevin]

Mike;

I feel your pain. I spent all of yesterday trying to find an optimal way of presenting elevations. I tried using the Artistic Renderworks settings using RenderBitmap. The results were good except that the rendering times were far too long. The renderings also had too much black shadow which did not make for good working drawings.

In the end, it is the Convert Copy to Lines that I used. As usual there were lines missing, and lines appearing that I did not want. It seems ironic to me that the Renderworks renderings are quite beautiful and accurate. Yet for the mundane task of producing 2d exterior elevations, Vectorworks falls so short.

What really worries me is that Katie does not know this! Do other software programs require this much user intervention to produce exterior elevations?

VWA11.0.1 + Renderworks

[mike m oz]

Kevin

I used the RenderWorks BitMap tool to get the design elevations and everyone was pleased with the result.

It is the next step that bugs me - I have tried using Hidden Line Elevations for working drawings but they are just not accurate enough - lines which shouldn't be there and lines that should be there that are not. The line weights also become an issue, particularly with elements you traditionally give a heavy lineweight like walls. The other problem with this method is that they don't export real well and the dreaded AutoCAD consultants get a little bit testy as a result!

As for sections....

[ 12-01-2004, 05:56 AM: Message edited by: mike m oz ]