2021 'Find and Modify' Lighting Accessories

[DKLX]

Greetings, all. I've posted before about the revamp to the Lighting Accessory tool (which I'm not wild about for reasons explained in my other post), and now I need confirmation from the community on what might be another flaw. I can't seem to use the 'Find and Modify' command on accessories. I'm trying to select all of the different flavors of top hats in my drawing and make some changes, and while they are all proper "Static Accessories" and were drawn using the Lighting Accessory tool, when I choose "Static Accessories" and, for example, "Selection Status = False" in the 'Find and Modify' command window, the command reports that 0 objects will be modified. 

 

Is anyone else having this problem or is it just me?

 

Thanks in advance!

[Kevin Allen]

v2021 or v2022? I don't think the legacy accessory tool works in v2022?

[DKLX]

This is in v2021, which has the new accessory tool/editor.

[Kevin Allen]

not sure if in 2021 you can shift select multiple units, and edit/change the accessory from the OIP?

[Sam Jones]

I don't think you can select by accessory type in 2021.  Maybe Kevin Linzey or Jesse Cogdell can enlighten us.

 

You can do it with AutoPlot Tools for Spotlight.  It has a 2 month fully functional trial, so if you can get your task done in 2 months it's a free solution.  Let me know if you want to Zoom and I'll demo it.

[JBenghiat]

2022 restores find and modify functionality to accessories, though the pull down menus aren’t working correctly (you need to manually type in names)

 

Another alternative solution: Savvy Select Similar Instrument works with accessories and cells. 

[Sam Jones]

The find and modify functionality seems to exist, but I find it very difficult to use, and I have not find a way to select with it unless I want to modify.  I'm willing to admit that I am very set in my ways, and maybe a little dull, but I can't figure out how to do any useful work with accessories and the Spotlight Find and Modify... functionality.  But then, I don't have to; I made my own.

 

BTW, I heartily recommend the Savvy Select Similar Instrument  tool.

[TomWhiteLight]

I had a play with this issue this morning. The criteria to select accessories is in the dialogue but it only shows Lighting devices.

 

I think the original post is a bug. I will report it.

 

 

[JBenghiat]

2 hours ago, TomWhiteLight said:

 

I had a play with this issue this morning. The criteria to select accessories is in the dialogue but it only shows Lighting devices.

 

I think the original post is a bug. I will report it.

 

 

 

 

This is the issue I alluded to. The pull downs don’t populate. Already been reported…hoping it gets fixed for SP3. 

[JBenghiat]

Though more importantly, every time Vectorworks adds an enhancement (or even a tweak) to Spotlight, they need to consider every component that gets affected by that change. That just hasn’t been happening— in my eyes things like this are a regression. I’ve had difficulty making the case that they are NOT enhancement requests. 

[TomWhiteLight]

Thanks Josh.

 

I have reported them as VB not VE, They are a regression, absolutely.

 

I agree we do need to consider every tweak and the knock on implications. I would also hope that the Beta testers whom are on this thread will also understand the importance of testing these tools at a most crucial stage in the softwares development.

 

I will endeavour to get this resolved as quickly as possible.

 

 

[Kevin Allen]

16 minutes ago, TomWhiteLight said:

I agree we do need to consider every tweak and the knock on implications. I would also hope that the Beta testers whom are on this thread will also understand the importance of testing these tools at a most crucial stage in the softwares development.

 

 

While I appreciate this, it seems all too often too late when we see the implications. Accessories is a great example. I think we're talking 2021 here. The Lighting Device was complexly rebuilt for speed. That was great. However, troubles rippled through Spotlight.

The accessory tool was brought back in the middle of the beta cycle, it remains, in v2022. a bit of a mess.

I'm sure I'm not the only one who find C-Clamps as an accessory a weird choice. I wonder if there needs to be some other identification (worked out with Lightwright) for 'attaching' hardware, what do we do with various type of clamps, trunions, bases and the like? How about a side arm with three T mounts? 

I think alpha testing is required for many new features and tweaks.

Edited January 25, 2022 by Kevin Allen

[MrTemplate]

5 minutes ago, Kevin Allen said:

 I wonder if there needs to be some other donation, what do we do with various type of clamps, trunions, bases and the like? How about a side arm with three T mounts?

Excellent thought, Kevin Lee Allen. There's all sorts of clamps and stands and sidearms and stuff that aren't hanging positions, but they're not lighting device add-on's, such as gobos or irises, or scrollers. The list could go on and on. it could be said that they should be segmented away from "accessories" and placed in their own category?

[Kevin Allen]

3 minutes ago, MrTemplate said:

There's all sorts of clamps and stands and sidearms and stuff that aren't hanging positions, but they're not lighting device add-on's, such as gobos or irises, or scrollers.

I think of an 'accessory' as something that modifies the beam.

[JBenghiat]

23 minutes ago, Kevin Allen said:

 

While I appreciate this, it seems all too often too late when we see the implications. Accessories is a great example. I think we're talking 2021 here. The Lighting Device was complexly rebuilt for speed. That was great. However, troubles rippled through Spotlight.

The accessory tool was brought back in the middle of the beta cycle, it remains, in v2022. a bit of a mess.

I'm sure I'm not the only one who find C-Clamps as an accessory a weird choice. I wonder if there needs to be some other identification (worked out with Lightwright) for 'attaching' hardware, what do we do with various type of clamps, trunions, bases and the like? How about a side arm with three T mounts? 

I think alpha testing is required for many new features and tweaks.

 

Generally this gets tracked as "iron." It would also require some changes to Lightwight. This is getting off topic, but I think the categories of device type have become obsolete. We need a better way to deal with iron, LED (multi-parameter, but not a moving light), data distributers, and power distributers that show up in the paperwork.

[mjm]

2 hours ago, Kevin Allen said:

 

While I appreciate this, it seems all too often too late when we see the implications. Accessories is a great example. I think we're talking 2021 here. The Lighting Device was complexly rebuilt for speed. That was great. However, troubles rippled through Spotlight.

The accessory tool was brought back in the middle of the beta cycle, it remains, in v2022. a bit of a mess.

I'm sure I'm not the only one who find C-Clamps as an accessory a weird choice. I wonder if there needs to be some other identification (worked out with Lightwright) for 'attaching' hardware, what do we do with various type of clamps, trunions, bases and the like? How about a side arm with three T mounts? 

I think alpha testing is required for many new features and tweaks.

@Kevin Allen And heaven forfend, the fixture needs multiple clamps or fasteners? In my practice, the Accessories tool failed enough early on that I swore off it, but LO & BEHOLD, now the static accessory formerly known as C-Clamp often overrides my FIXTURE data after the file has been in-use for a bit. I see this in VWX 2022. It appears that if I quit the app when I see that issue arise then restart, the fixtures seem to go back to their normal state. But  O my word, the feelings which crop up when work stops because of this occurring multiple times. In my practice, the stopping and starting of VWX to accommodate these kinds of issues, is, beyond the time loss, the loss of inertia; the forward momentum as I burrow deeper and deeper into the project.

Edited January 25, 2022 by mjm

[Kevin Allen]

3 minutes ago, mjm said:

And heaven forfend, the fixture needs multiple clamps or fasteners?

much like my example of three lights on a sidearm?

 

I can't speak for other industries,but I think Vectorworks needs a number of part-time industry specialists and that involvement has to be early enough to affect change.
 

[mjm]

Just now, Kevin Allen said:

much like my example of three lights on a sidearm?

 

I can't speak for other industries,but I think Vectorworks needs a number of part-time industry specialists and that involvement has to be early enough to affect change.
 

@Kevin Allenlol. exactly. Just yesterday I wrestled with attempted to put 2 C-clamps on a lighting device. That did not go well. But maybe someone knows that trick.

[Sam Jones]

I'm sure there is an obvious answer, but I can't think of it.

 

19 minutes ago, mjm said:

Just yesterday I wrestled with attempted to put 2 C-clamps on a lighting device. That did not go well. But maybe someone knows

 

Why would you want to do this?

[markdd]

5 minutes ago, Sam Jones said:

Why would you want to do this?

Moving Lights I guess. I have found that making a separate Accessory symbol with two clamps side by side works pretty well for almost any moving light I need these days.

Edited January 25, 2022 by markdd

[Kevin Allen]

5 minutes ago, Sam Jones said:

Why would you want to do this?

some movers require two clamps

[Sam Jones]

Doh !!

[MrTemplate]

or any number of striplights [regardless of source] that need a clamp at either end?