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Structural Member usability improvements


LarryO

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  • Vectorworks, Inc Employee
On 12/13/2021 at 7:40 PM, LarryO said:

8. This is a very useful one and should be a wishlist item of its own. Have a Viewport type which can generate a beam or symbol from the definition. (for placement on sheet layers) Talking 3d here and all the various views that the basic Viewport can display. This creates an easy means to annotate each beam and symbol. Avoids possibly hundreds of classes and or layers being required to control visibility. The current process of laying out beams for a structure is still required but all the layout of each beam would be tremendously simplified and can utilize templates for annotation. One only needs to remember that all symbols and beams be created at their internal origin for best functionality.

 

9. Having the Viewport mentioned above being able to tap into the member id and or symbol name to facilitate automatic labeling. Or would that be the other way around where labels in the Viewport tap into those ids and names?

 

Would it be possible to PM me examples of drawings sheets you usually create like this?

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1 hour ago, Mark Aceto said:

 

I would like to upvote this VE but I don't see it.


I believe that VE reference number is an internal Enhancement tracking number for Vectorworks staff, tying their internal tracking system back to the Wishlist request item on the user forum.
 

All we end users see on the forum is just that number which refers to this thread. If you upvoted this thread at the upper left, then you have already upvoted it.

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On 12/13/2021 at 4:40 PM, LarryO said:

10. Profile size should be editable as a pull down at the root level of the OI, not embedded behind a shape selection button.

 

Not to mention the complete workflow:

  1. Copy VW Library folder/file to User Library
  2. Open library file
  3. Duplicate Wide Flange symbol, and rename
  4. Edit Wide Flange (PIO)
  5. Save library file
  6. Refresh libraries
  7. Then... select that file from the OIP Settings

image.gif.7b14d9107743166ee7813e29551d229e.gif

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I would suspect that this is just a matter that they have not yet coded in the ability of the joining member to select/remember which axis that it will be aligning with in the other member. In the case of joining to a ridge or valley the top centre axis of the joining member would need to switch to alignment with the top edge axis of the valley or ridge member. Which is really just incorporating an offset from the bearing member's primary axis; in this case half the member width. In the case of a steel member this would of course be further impacted by the connection node design, that node could also impact the offset or wind up being an intermediary object between the two elements. In the obvious sense that would be one or two steel angles bolted or welded between the members or a less obvious modeled construct that is solid subtracted or added into the junction, like a knife plate and flange coping with holes for bolting.

 

I am simply happy that after more than ten years to finally witness development to the structural steel components. It will take a bit of trial and error on the part of the programmers to code this effectively. I don't imagine that any of them have assembled steel to gain grades for their C+ coding classes. Autodesk has always had the upper hand because engineers could only turn to products other than VWs to do their design work. VW users would have to import or redraw everything. And we all know the joys of importing other file formats. Try importing something from Tekla.

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2 hours ago, LarryO said:

I would suspect that this is just a matter that they have not yet coded in the ability of the joining member to select/remember which axis that it will be aligning with in the other member.

 

Yes, it feels like it's not something that would be too complicated to add so perhaps we will see it some day.

 

On the other hand, the unpredictable behaviour of auto-connected members shown in my video in the post above, is more problematic and I would describe as a bug. I think this tool may now be usable for me but only with auto-connect mostly turned off. Definitely an improvement compared to a couple of years ago though.

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I've just revisited this in 2023 SP3 and I don't think anything has changed from my comments above, based on testing in SP2.

 

@Matt Panzer are you able to give us any hints on whether we will see any further improvements soon - and also, I think there are some bugs that need to be addressed. Downloading the file I attached to the post further up should make it easy to replicate some of the things you can see happening in my screen recording.

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  • Vectorworks, Inc Employee
2 hours ago, line-weight said:

I've just revisited this in 2023 SP3 and I don't think anything has changed from my comments above, based on testing in SP2.

 

@Matt Panzer are you able to give us any hints on whether we will see any further improvements soon - and also, I think there are some bugs that need to be addressed. Downloading the file I attached to the post further up should make it easy to replicate some of the things you can see happening in my screen recording.

 

We are actively looking at other usability improvements to the Structural Member but it's unlikely we'll see anything until the next major version.

As for the bug shown in the video.  While I did find some similar bugs on this, I went ahead and submitted another (VB-193909) with your file and video.

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39 minutes ago, Matt Panzer said:

 

We are actively looking at other usability improvements to the Structural Member but it's unlikely we'll see anything until the next major version.

As for the bug shown in the video.  While I did find some similar bugs on this, I went ahead and submitted another (VB-193909) with your file and video.

 

Thanks for the response.

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...and I'm also having loads of problems trying to use "custom" member types where I choose a custom 2d symbol for the shape. Editing the 2d symbol doesn't seem to change the structural members that use it, unless you switch to another symbol and then back again. And it refuses to let me select certain symbols. I can't reliably replicate this in a clean file, and haven't currently got time to pin down something replicable. For now I'm considering the custom shapes unusable.

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  • Vectorworks, Inc Employee
On 3/10/2023 at 5:34 AM, line-weight said:

Another bug for you @Matt Panzer.

 

Combining a longways "start" offset with a negative Z offset for the axis creates this:

 

1053358621_Screenshot2023-03-10at10_31_37.jpg.dc398e8ab8ca98b48458bd3d1b5f211f.jpg

 

File attached.

 

 

SMoffset.vwx 2.56 MB · 1 download

 

Bug reported (VB-193955).

 

Thank you for the file and explanation!

I still need to look at the custom shape issue...

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Some more structural member odd behaviour.

 

Two things shown in the video. Firstly, I just want to snap the end point of one SM exactly in line with the face of the other. It won't let me do this - in each attempt, I find the point I want to move the end point to, and click on it but it refuses to move. If I resize it by a larger amount and then try again, it seems to work, although I don't feel this is very consistent. In this case I am viewing in top/plan. I am not using auto-join.

 

Secondly, I move to shaded view, 3d perspective. Note how the blue handle for the end of the structural member moves all over the place depending on my viewing position.

 

Usually when this kind of thing is happening with SMs I do eventually get things where I want them, but the process is frustrating and leaves me feeling a little insecure that things really are where I want them.

 

I have attached the file if anyone wants to replicate.

 

 

 

structmemberssnap.vwx

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