group of symbols in CCD 21 / save selected ... What is the better way in VWX ?

[Ben3B]

Hello I often use the same symbols pluged in the same way ...

Is a way to export groups of symbols 

In other software, I can save only the selected stuff, and merge that file in new one .

What is the better way tu re-use group of symbols in new file ?

 

For example if i would import all the symbols attached below (ptz+ splitter+wire +...)

Thanks

 

[Nikolay Zhelyazkov]

Hello @Ben59,

 

Do you have these devices saved as symbols? If so, you can select all the symbols in the resource manager that you want to import/export and import/export them.

If you do not have the devices saved as symbols you can easily save them by selecting a device and clicking on the Save as symbol button in the OIP.

 

Best Regards,

Nikolay Zhelyazkov

[Pat Stanford]

If you want the symbols (and connecting lines?) in the same positions, but need them as individual items in the other file, what about saving them as a "Red" symbol by checking the Convert to Group box on the Insertion Options. Then once you place all you have to do is Ungroup and you have all the symbols in the same positions as in the original file.

[Ben3B]

On 10/18/2021 at 5:13 PM, Pat Stanford said:

what about saving them as a "Red" symbol by checking the Convert to Group box on the Insertion Options. Then once you place all you have to do is Ungroup and you have all the symbols in the same positions as in the original file.

Nice this is exactly what I'm looking for !!!

many thanks !!!

[Ben3B]

I have annoter  question :

With that process, if i update one of the symbols, it will be updated in the groupe too ?

For example if in change the ptz symbol, all the ptz in the group will be updated too ?

Thanks

[Dendecko]

1 hour ago, Ben59 said:

I have annoter  question :

With that process, if i update one of the symbols, it will be updated in the groupe too ?

For example if in change the ptz symbol, all the ptz in the group will be updated too ?

Thanks

If you turn them into red symbols (plug in) or use them as devices then they WILL NOT independently update though you can re insert them back into the file and they will insert updated.  If they are regular symbols then they will update.

[Pat Stanford]

2 hours ago, Ben59 said:

For example if in change the ptz symbol, all the ptz in the group will be updated too ?

It depends on how you do it and what you mean.

 

If you have a multiple standard "black" symbol PTZ inside a "red" symbol Assembly, and you place an instance of Assembly on the drawing you will get a Group in the drawing containing the PTZ symbols. If you change the PTZ symbol, then those instances will change also.

 

If you have a single "black" PTZ symbol inside a "red" symbol and you place the red symbol you will just get PTZ on the drawing. The function is smart enough to not make a group of a single object.

 

As @Dendecko says, items that are symbols inside of "red" symbols will automatically update. Items that are PIOs or standard linework inside of "red" symbols won't update after being placed.

 

I think of a "red" symbol as a temporary container. When you place the symbol, it puts all the stuff from inside the "red" symbol into a group on the drawing and then deletes the symbol instance. So a later change to the "red" symbol will not effect previously placed "instances" because they are not instances.  

 

Hope this makes sense and helps.

[Ben3B]

Hello thanks for answer 😉 It make sens now 😉

But I've another question :

I work with shared folder, and build my own library 

So I create a  symbol , convert it to group as you can see below

After that I export it to my shared folder ... the question is: what are the symbols "reference" of the group of symbols ?

That group was made with my symbols from my shared folder but If I modified one of them, and them import back my "group^" of symbol, there are no change ...

May my workflow /organisation isn't good..

For now, when I've chnage to do on my symbol instance , I edit it, , save it, export it and replace the old instance in my sahred folder (for futur use...)

 

But I want that my group of symbol relate that change too ...

 

I don't understand from where comes the instance of symbol in my group of symbols ...

 

Thank you so much  (hope you understand me, if not feel free to ask me 😉 )

Edited November 18, 2021 by Ben59

[Ben3B]

here is a video who lets show my problem 
In the vidéo

I put two wymbols, (internet222)

connect it together ,

creatye a symbol and convert to group (sorry I wasn't sure that the option was ticked so I cancel and do it back ...)

I select taht group of symbool import it, > everything is ok ...

So I modify the symbols (internet 222)

import back the group of symbols made with internet222 symbols but the symbol insid the group wasn't change ...

 

Can you explain me why ?

thanks 

2021-11-26 10-22-31.mkv

Edited November 26, 2021 by Ben59

[Nikolay Zhelyazkov]

Hello @Ben59,

 

In the attached video you create symbols out of connected devices and make the symbol get converted to a group upon insertion/drag&drop. This means that once you place the symbol on the drawing you no longer have a symbol but a group of objects, which are independent from the symbol and have their own graphics. The same applies to the device symbol that you are using to create your devices. once you place it on the drawing you get a device object and not a symbol, since devices can get connected but symbols can't. So, once you place your devices they are no longer symbols and editing the symbol will not change the devices.

 

What you can do is that you can try to make sure that you have the correct layout for your devices before you place them and in the cases where you want to edit them afterwards you can either edit them directly one by one or in VW 2022 you can edit only one of them and then use the Device Tool Eyedropper Mode to apply the same changes to the rest of the devices. - https://app-help.vectorworks.net/2022/eng/VW2022_Guide/ConnectCAD/Transferring_device_properties.htm?rhhlterm=device devices transferring transfer transferred&rhsearch=device transfer

 

Best Regards,

Nikolay Zhelyazkov

[Ben3B]

Hello Nikolay , thanks for Answer ! I understand but have some questions .
So @Pat Stanford isn't totally true, with that method I've "copy of symbols with their own graphics " in the same position

On 10/18/2021 at 5:13 PM, Pat Stanford said:

If you want the symbols (and connecting lines?) in the same positions, but need them as individual items in the other file, what about saving them as a "Red" symbol by checking the Convert to Group box on the Insertion Options. Then once you place all you have to do is Ungroup and you have all the symbols in the same positions as in the original file.

 

And what @Dendecko said isn't true in my case because the symbols are converted in group of object ...

On 10/19/2021 at 7:22 PM, Dendecko said:

If you turn them into red symbols (plug in) or use them as devices then they WILL NOT independently update though you can re insert them back into the file and they will insert updated.  If they are regular symbols then they will update.

 

I don't really understand because , if their was simple object, the links were brokes , and they are not , wire are still wire socket are still socket ... And if they are object where are they ?

On 11/29/2021 at 8:29 AM, Nikolay Zhelyazkov said:

This means that once you place the symbol on the drawing you no longer have a symbol but a group of objects, which are independent from the symbol and have their own graphics.

May I am on the wrong way...

I "only" want to have group of symbols as devise connected with wire (with class, length ...) the ability to use it back in different drawings AND because drawings are in perpetual evolution, AND because I understand som new stuff everytime , and update my device and save them in shared folder , It make sens if the group of connected devices are linked to the devices I used to build them and updated at the next insertion 🙂

I hope you understand what I'm looking for 🙂 

 

Thanks everobody

Ps: I'm in touch with french support , and will report feedback here.

[Ben3B]

On 11/29/2021 at 8:29 AM, Nikolay Zhelyazkov said:

. once you place it on the drawing you get a device object and not a symbol, since devices can get connected but symbols can't. So, once you place your devices they are no longer symbols and editing the symbol will not change the devices.

Ok but why the links doesnt exist just before I place it on the drawing? I understand that device who are already in my drawings are not updated , (and this is not what I want , for that the new option in v22 who you tell me is perfect 😉 ) but If I put it back in my drawing why , they don't take the updated device ...

Writing that words, I think I understand, but I'm affraid that there is no way to do what I want, or maybe another way without pass thru symbol who creat new objects...

[Nikolay Zhelyazkov]

Hello @Ben59,

 

I think that everything that Pat and Dandecko said is correct. Here is a screen recording showing the difference between having the created symbol convert to group or not. Since I cannot really understand what you are looking for, I hope that this video can help you. If not, please take some time to learn more about how symbols work and how to best use connectCAD to get your job done.

 

Best Regards,

Nikolay Zhelyazkov

 

 

 

[Ben3B]

Thanks !!!

I hope I'dont hurt anyone , If i do it, please, put that on language problems and THANKS to everyone ho take time to help me 🙂

Ok I understand the difference between group and symbols 
What i'm looking for is :

in your example :

Before connect the device, save it , eport it in shared folder , do the same for the second one .

Import from shared folder the two device, connect it save as symbol/group 

 

modify device 1 and import the symbol/group, I want that the symbol 1 in symbol/group is the symbol 1 modified ... but it doesn't work ...

 

In french we say : "Je veux le beurre et l'argent du beurre"

I want all the device alone /and connected , and when I modify one device who are saved connected with other, it import the modify device ...

 

thanks for your time 🙂

2021-12-01 11-44-27.mkv

[Nikolay Zhelyazkov]

@Ben59

Thanks for the video and the additional information. Now I think I understand what you are trying to do. Unfortunately, I think that it is not possible to make this happen atm. As I have explained above, once you place the symbol in the drawing, if you have convert to group checked, then you end up with a completely new object created, which has nothing to do with the symbol, it just used its graphics and that is all. Any further changes to the symbol will not affect this object. I do not think that it is possible to have multiple devices created and then edited from one place only. You can do this with regular symbols (convert to group deselected) but then these devices are no longer connectable, as they are wrapped in a symbol.

 

What I can think of something that could help you in faster editing of device data would be to make use of the Current Layer Device Report and make your edits in the worksheet. That way you will have an overview of all the devices in the layer and their data and can easily edit it from the worksheet.

 

Best Regards,

Nikolay Zhelyazkov

[Ben3B]

Thanks , I often use that powerfull feature who is edit device in worksheet 🙂

 

But the reason of that post is :

Because I'm new on VWX and CCD , I constantly learn new stuff and have a better understanding of optimizing workflow ... (and I hope I will learn for a long time 😉 )

So at the begining I drew some stuff of my warehouse, with picture, police colors... and export it 

After few drawings I noticed that I often use device connected in the same way, so I search a way to save it already connected and by the way import they alreday connected ...

But some device wasn't well built (not the same grid settings/ not the same size/ color /picture size ...) So it doesnt really matter and I updated they on the way , when i need it ... 

But when I use connected devices (save as symbols/group) the corrections (update) wasn't there . 

I, now, understand why, And I'm still looking forward to have an organised work and a correlation between drawings 

 

I think the "better" way is to write all the modification I've to do , and one day update all at a time ... But you know what ??? I never have time ... 🙂🤣🙃

 

I also have question about new 2022 feature (linked equiipment and spotlite device) but this is for another post ...

Hope you understand my "vision" and Hope help you to involve that great sofware 😉

 

[Ben3B]

Hello May a buton like as for lighting device : "replace device" would be helpful 😉