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Horizontal Viewport Issues


BobS_50

Question

Hi

I am having some challenges with these...on frequent occasions I have set one up and the viewport does not cover the full area of what I intended.

 

To resolve the issue I would expect to find a horizontal section marker line that i could adjust to ensure the section covered is what I am looking, however it seems these are not visible unless they created in another viewport. Is this case? and if it is the case why doesn't the Viewport OIP allow you to manage instances of it, as it does standard Section VPs? 

 

Now I have a file in which the viewport "lost" the area of view after I moved its location on the sheet ( and this was the second attempt to create the viewport over the relevant area.... how could that just happen?

 

Anyone point out what i am missing here?

 

TIA

 

 

image.png.4383e9fab420f603af904b1757b7d424.png

 

viewport position on the sheet

 

image.png.d57a97ae13a50f6814b36bc3e31a8937.png

 

view port clip object....note area of view/interest not showing in spite of correct layer/class set ups.

 

Thanks

Bob S

 

VW Architect 2019 on a Win10  pc

 

 

 

 

 

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14 hours ago, Matt Panzer said:

Edit the crop of the viewport and see if there's a crop object.

Horizontal Section Viewports have no X, Y extents but they can be cropped.  This is similar to how Top/Plan viewports work.

Thanks Matt

 

I hoped the screen dumps (SD)  would be sufficient to show that the crop object is unable to view the relevant area. Also the issue can arise when the viewport is first made, the third viewport seems to have been constrained at a section line! 

 

In this case I was able to get another HSVP to work, and to crop it successfully.

 

I am still puzzling how  the "instance" option works (esp for HSVP)...  

Edited by BobS_50
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  • Vectorworks, Inc Employee
6 hours ago, BobS_50 said:

I hoped the screen dumps (SD)  would be sufficient to show that the crop object is unable to view the relevant area. Also the issue can arise when the viewport is first made, the third viewport seems to have been constrained at a section line! 


Are you creating the Horizontal Section via the “Create Horizontal Section” menu command or the Clip Cube?

 

 

 

6 hours ago, BobS_50 said:

 

I am still puzzling how  the "instance" option works (esp for HSVP)...  


What “instance” option?  Are you talking about Section Line instances?

If so, it sounds like you’re creating “regular” Section Viewports” from an elevation viewport (using a section line).  Is that the case?

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@Matt Panzer

 

Hi Matt

I am using the  "Create Horizontal Section" so I can see the wall style information....clip cube is working fine for me.

 

I am also using the regular "Section viewports" and do mean "section line instances" ... hence the expectation that I can use the section marker to adjust the HSVP contents.   

 

 

 

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  • Vectorworks, Inc Employee

@BobS_50,

I ask this because creating “regular” section viewports by drawing horizontal section lines creates a different kind of viewport than the other two methods.  The menu and clip cube method create a “true” (internally) horizontal section.  Creating “regular” sections viewports from section lines is not recommended for horizontal sections because their settings are assuming a vertical section.

 

That all said, I recommend submitting a bug report with any problem files you have.

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It's really unhelpful that "horizontal section viewports" are just called "section viewports" in the OIP.

 

So, even if you've understood that they are two different things, it's not easy to see which type you have created. I have learnt to go and look for the "section line instances" control, because if it's not there, then you know you're dealing with a HSVP.

 

The documentation does not help, by having three pages: section viewport, horizontal section viewport, vertical section viewport. In fact there is no such thing as a "vertical section viewport", and it just describes making a section viewport. And in fact a section viewport can be at any angle, and this is sometimes useful for example if you want to take a section perpendicular to a pitched roof plane.

Edited by line-weight
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15 hours ago, Matt Panzer said:

I ask this because creating “regular” section viewports by drawing horizontal section lines creates a different kind of viewport than the other two methods.  The menu and clip cube method create a “true” (internally) horizontal section.  Creating “regular” sections viewports from section lines is not recommended for horizontal sections because their settings are assuming a vertical section.

Well I learnt two things here...that sections from clip cubes can show the wall hatch/fills, and that section lines can be created on a non vertical plane!

 

While neither of these two methods were in the HSVP's that failed, when I did use the clip-cube method, I experienced the same issue !!! 

 

Bug report to be filed!
 

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4 minutes ago, BobS_50 said:

Thanks LW

Just posted a bug report

Its not just one file...but this is the test file one...with screen shots of issues.

 

 

be3droom design 5 v6 .vwx 95.33 MB · 0 downloads HSVP issues .docx 1.97 MB · 0 downloads

 

Well I can see this is in the UK due to the very familiar floorplan layout!

 

This probably isn't much help to you, but I've tried opening it in VW2021 and I think it's displaying as you probably want it (ie it doesn't look like your screenshots)

 

Here is Sht-3[cabinet detail]

 

972395427_Screenshot2021-09-03at11_25_22.jpg.ab6765fb567e66811714d98293e1a9ea.jpg

 

 

And here's that horizontal section viewport if I go to edit the crop

 

1930070364_Screenshot2021-09-03at11_25_36.thumb.jpg.0eaad9e427d7a5c3cff3ded7ee418d06.jpg

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@line-weight

 

Checkout Sht-4 Clip cube section test !

 

Even thought I've used VW since the minicad days my work has meant its only now I've really dived into the 3d modelling, sheet views and wall styles etc 

Checking out the threads on this forum revealed have revealed to me how inconsistent and hard to fathom various elements of VW is!

So while I have gotten HSVPs to work after a fashion, its understanding what to do when they don't and that it isn't just me!

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7 minutes ago, BobS_50 said:

@line-weight

 

Checkout Sht-4 Clip cube section test !

 

Even thought I've used VW since the minicad days my work has meant its only now I've really dived into the 3d modelling, sheet views and wall styles etc 

Checking out the threads on this forum revealed have revealed to me how inconsistent and hard to fathom various elements of VW is!

So while I have gotten HSVPs to work after a fashion, its understanding what to do when they don't and that it isn't just me!

 

Yes, I am seeing the bug in that one, viewed in VW2021. So it looks like it exists in a HSVP created by clip cube but not by menu command?

 

1099242604_Screenshot2021-09-03at11_44_07.thumb.jpg.4a710b3d2c339cc2914f60ec7ce4c658.jpg

 

I have a vague memory about there being something different but not made obvious, about 'normal' sections according to whether they were created by the clip cube or not, in the past. I can't remember exactly what it was though.

 

I feel your pain, trying to understand how things work. I made the same transition from 2d to 3d a few years ago and went through exactly the same. VW is a disaster when it comes to UI and terminology and all the inconsistencies in it, and these all become more apparent when you are trying to make things work in 3d. I pity any new user. At least if you are already familiar with it for 2d work, you have a bit of a headstart.

 

Seeing your test viewports, noted up with the different settings - I have to do the exact same thing at times. When intuition and the VW documentation can't help you - this is what you have to resort to; time consuming detective work. I currently have an 11-page document with all my own notes on how to make VW work. Effectively, writing my own user manual.

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29 minutes ago, line-weight said:

 

Yes, I am seeing the bug in that one, viewed in VW2021. So it looks like it exists in a HSVP created by clip cube but not by menu command?

 

I have a vague memory about there being something different but not made obvious, about 'normal' sections according to whether they were created by the clip cube or not, in the past. I can't remember exactly what it was though.

 

...

 

Seeing your test viewports, noted up with the different settings - I have to do the exact same thing at times. When intuition and the VW documentation can't help you - this is what you have to resort to; time consuming detective work. I currently have an 11-page document with all my own notes on how to make VW work. Effectively, writing my own user manual.

 

In this instance the fail was from a clip cube...elsewhere its been from the menu command ... I found another issue when I tried to amend the view from orthographic to perspective!

 

Your last paragraph sums up our dependency on tech companies... whether its Nemetschek, Microsoft Adobe Apple or Google !!!

 

 

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Other than being able to create orthogonal or perspective views for illustrative purposes, are there any benefits to generating floor plans via the Clip Cube and/or Horizontal Section Viewports, as opposed to creating a "standard" top/plan viewport?  Asked another way, If I just want to generate permit & working drawings, should I stick with the standard plan viewport (draw a rectangle on the DL of the area I want in my SLVP -> "View" menu ->"Create Viewport...")?

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17 hours ago, E|FA said:

Other than being able to create orthogonal or perspective views for illustrative purposes, are there any benefits to generating floor plans via the Clip Cube and/or Horizontal Section Viewports, as opposed to creating a "standard" top/plan viewport?  Asked another way, If I just want to generate permit & working drawings, should I stick with the standard plan viewport (draw a rectangle on the DL of the area I want in my SLVP -> "View" menu ->"Create Viewport...")?

 

A horizontal section creates a "true" horizontal slice through the geometry whereas a top/plan viewport doesn't. If you don't need to represent pitched roof spaces, and don't have a lot of custom 3d modelled geometry then you might be ok with top/plan.

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