Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
BrendanFella

Tutorial CD's

Recommended Posts

As a new user of Vectorworks v12 I would like some opinions on the Tutorial CD's, specifically the Vectorworks and Renderworks.

Anybody that has used these what is your opinion of them. Are they a good investment and will they help more than the manuals?

As a user of AutoCad up till now and trying to convert over completely to Vectorworks I am having a lot of trouble converting and need the fastest way to get up to speed .

Thanks for your help and advice,

BrendanFella

Share this post


Link to post

Brendan, becoming familiar with VW and its way of working is essential if you are going to become proficient with the program, and enjoy working with it. Any aids which help you familiarise yourself with VW and adapt to it's paradigm wil help.

I think the NNA CD's are very good, with one rider. They will only help if you use them. If you are prepared to use them then buy them. You won't regret it.

The reason I say this is that over the years I've seen many users just blunder on working inneficiently, ignoring the many training resources available. Even the 'free' Quicktime movies and tutorials that are available on this site. Success by and large comes down to attitude. Those that are not prepared to help themself will never get to high levels of proficiency.

Share this post


Link to post

Ok, hold on.

I got the "Super Bundle" (student) specifically because of the training CDs, and more importantly, for the architectural ones.

The first one is ok, but the second - at least, as far as I got into it - is riddled with errors.

If you call NNA they will confirm the errors/discrepancies and tell you they will be re-released in September.

As far as helping yourself, well, that's also something one can do with manuals and forums [Wink]

Based on the errors in the tutorials and the "odd things" v12 is currently doing, I'm considering a return until things are smoothed out.

cheers,

Andrew

Share this post


Link to post

Turner,

Our company produces the training CDs, so your comment of them being "riddled with errors" naturally gets my attention.

We provide tech support for our Canadian customers and get occasional requests from NNA tech support for answers to customer questions on the CDs.

I take it your comments are about the Architect CDs. No one has reported problems to us that would cause us to come to your drastic conclusions. The reports we've had have fallen into one of three categories:

1. Error on our part - for example, one of the provided files, Project 04 Finished.mcd was unfortunately corrupted on the CD. The fix - Project 05 A.mcd is identical, use that one instead. There are only three known issues on the Architect CDs and we can provide people with fixes.

2. Customer misunderstanding - some people haven't understood what is and isn't provided. One customer was angry because the training CDs didn't include a full working copy of VectorWorks for the $100 price. Another felt there were missing files when in fact he was looking at a chapter that wasn't a tutorial and wasn't intended to be provided with files.

3. Changes in the program. The CDs were made with either 12.0.0 or a beta version. There have been some functional changes in 12.0.1, especially in Architect. They are mostly minor and that's beyond our control.

If you've seen problems to which you have not been able to get a resolution, then contact us at training@resolve.ca and we'll have someone help you sort them out.

Share this post


Link to post

Hi.. ah... "G".

Ok - I'll go with #1, then.

I don't remember the specific errors but one was a procedure in which we are instructed to copy an element from a provided file and paste it into place; however, the scales are different, and the procedure doesn't work.

I'm guessing that's one of them?

The next few errors were also basically right in the beginning of CD #2 (Architect) and I gave up after a few, and being told that they would be replaced in September.

I'll go back and try again, and take your word for now that the three errors I experienced are indeed the only ones.

One other functional note - the player is kinda awful, at least on a Mac. Pausing and then playing sections often resulted in audio drop-out; I'm thinking that while the interactivity is nice, a quicktime video would work much more smoothly.

Thanks,

Andrew

Share this post


Link to post

Beginning with version 8 of VectorWorks I?ve had the training CDs sent with the upgrade. When the upgrade arrives, I?ve methodically worked through each CD making notes of what is different and which lessons I want to understand better. When I?m finished I usually have an outline of the changes I want to try again and go back and replay the associated videos while I try different models using the approach used in the video.

My CD exposure has shown they are good videos for getting a general sense of how to work with VW. Each year there isn?t much change in the videos so if I missed a year I?m not sure it would hurt much. If I hadn?t had previous VW experience, then the videos certainly wouldn?t be enough to learn VW as they are far too general and limited in scope to give anyone a good understanding of how to work with VW, but I still recommend them because if you don?t know VW, you need some place to start and they do provide that level of understanding.

Because you are coming from AutoCAD, they?ll give you some insights on how VW is different in how it works with models. Most notably is VW?s use of Classes for group segregation and Layers for Class grouping, which is significantly different for an AutoCAD user.

What these videos don?t show is how to do specific modeling task that are most often the basis of my questions. This is unfortunate because understanding various approaches for laying out a foundation, building floors, aligning wall, modifying doors and windows, designing out sprinkler zones, cut and fill, terrain layout, etc. go unanswered until you ask the question on the forum, and then you only get a problem limited approach that often leaves a lot of information out.

As for accuracy, there are some places where the video is misleading and the information needed to approach a topic has changed, and there is a missing file that is necessary, and a corrupt file that can be worked around. There are also some areas where topics are covered quickly that should have been provided as tutorial lessons, but in general the video lessons flow fine. For the missing file, send Katie a message, or drop me note and the file will appear.

If I could dream, the VW video collection would expand beyond being general introduction movies, to being real a tutorial resource on how to approach the various challenges that each industry faces. The videos would be organized into short learning sessions that would be designed so that chapter topics could easily be identified and accessed through a digital table of contents a user could easily double-click to look up something quickly. Another CAD developer has used topic based training videos and I find it so easy to go and review information that I?ve copied all of the CDs onto my computer so they?ll always be available.

Learning VW is a process that takes patience because training material is so limited, and because the program is so capable and extensive in its ability that a handful of videos just don?t do it justice, but they are better than nothing.

Share this post


Link to post

Hello Bruce,

I'm not sure if you're referencing my post, but I have the VW-12 CDs.

I really wish the training CDs were intended to provide a solid training foundation by covering a broad range of topics, but that hasn't happened yet and it isn?t possible with one or two CD disk trying to cover an industry. Click on this link to get a glimpse of what I think would give VW a significant boost in sales and customer satisfaction: Training by Topic Categories This topic list covers a lot of ground in how to layout a design in residential construction drafting and 3D illustration. In all there are 9-CD disk providing 30-hours of training just for this one industry. To get a sense of how I use the other CAD program?s CDs, this morning I needed to look up some information for dealing with a terrain issue. To get there I double-click on the terrain topic and a video appears explaining various details for me to consider in solving my issue. This on-demand training ability provides a tremendous resource of information and only cost $395 from the CAD developer.

It is my belief that VW hasn?t had the internal talent to focus on user education and this is really unfortunate because VW is a great CAD program that is important here. However, in the field of residential architecture, and all of its other industry based approaches, it doesn't provide enough training support to drive it sales because VW is so extensive in its abilities, there isn't anyone internal driving education or management hasn't listened, that new and migrating users find learning to be overly error prone and slow. This lack of training is so obvious from the questions that are being asked by the new and existing users on this forum that I hope VW finds the resources and interest necessary to get serious about helping new, migrating and current customers become really proficient in VW.

Share this post


Link to post
Guest

I agree with Roger. The available resources to learn VW are there and some of them are excellent. However when working with the software and hitting a particular wall sometimes you have to scratch your head and just try to work it out. This takes time and energy. It would be much better if online tutorials were available in the format shown in Roger's post. Support here in Oz is excellent however the software would be much easier to learn if you could go online access a tute on a particular process and go from there. Such a resource I believe would certainly over time lift sales and justify the costs of putting the resource together.

Share this post


Link to post

I've personally found the Training CDs to be extremely helpful. Have you used the new ones for version 12? They are changed significantly from earlier versions in that they do present projects in a tutorial fashion. I couldn't see myself nearly as productive if I hadn't gone through them and done the exercises.

Share this post


Link to post

I?m a 3rd Party manual writer and trainer, I'm not here to turn you away from the Nemetschek North America training CD?s, they have their place. My manuals are written froma different point of view, form the idea that you need to learn certain fundamental concepts before you can move on in VectorWorks.

maybe Nemetschek North America should include all the training you need (they already do), but then other programs like Photoshop have a lot of 3rd party books and manuals for people, autocad has lots, microstation has lots... finding the same topic written in a different way can help you to understand it better.

Share this post


Link to post

When we hire new people with CAD experience, we have them work through Jonathan's manuals for the first three days together with a couple of "canned" projects. Nearly always, that's enough to bring someone up to speed on VW and absorb enough of our inhouse protocol to start being genuinely productive within a week.

Occasionally we move someone without CAD experience (but still very computer savvy) toward drafting. For those individuals, we have them start with the NNA materials and then through the ArchonCad manuals. LIke Jonathan says, they each provide a different perspective, but if I had to settle for only one I'd take the ones from down under.

Good luck,

Share this post


Link to post

Jonathan-

I took a look at the demo on your site -

Though the text says V12, the cover of the demo text says v11...

Please advise-

thx

Andrew

Share this post


Link to post

it appears as though the VectorWorks 12 demo is not correctly linked on the web site. I will have to correct it later this week. In the meantime, you could use the demo as an indication of the way the manual is constructed and how the movies are embedded.

You could also check out the web log and podcasts to see if you like my training ideas.

Share this post


Link to post

maybe Nemetschek North America should include all the training you need (they already do),

I have purchased The Essential Tutorial Manual and 3D Modelling Tutorial Manual from Archoncad and would like to agree and disagree with some of the above comments.

I had a terrible time trying to understand The Vectorworks Manuals and for me I find The Archoncad manuals so much easier to follow. I have progressed more in a few weeks with these than I did in Months with The Vectorworks manuals.

Jonathan's quote above is good for those of you lucky enough to have the New Version 2008.

To my amazement I found out that Vectorworks NO LONGER has ANY training material for v12.5. This is disturbing considering that v12.5 is not THAT OLD. Those of us using v12.5 can no longer rely on Nemetschek for ANY training manuals or CD's. This to me shows a lack of concern for users who still use this version.

As Jonathan points out we can purchase Photoshop and AutoCad manuals dating way back but when the supplier of the sofware discontinues ALL training Manuals and CD's for a pretty recent version it makes one wonder what's in the future. When and if v2009 comes out will they discontinue all support for v2008?.

As stated above I personally find The Archoncad manuals much easier anyway but it still shows what we can expect from Nemetschek.

I am still looking for The 3D Rendering CD from Nemetschek so if anyone out there has a copy for sale please E-mail me.

My thanks to Jonathan for his help. If Nemetschek offered the support and advise he has shown me I would be one very happy user.

Share this post


Link to post

it means that you haven't posted to the list very often. i'm in the 100 club because i have posted more often. it's nothing to do with quality, just quantity... :-)

Share this post


Link to post

DUH!...Sometimes I feel like a real idiot.

I am using Vectorworks Fundamentals v12.5

I am having problems importing a photo or logo into a 3-D rendering. They are appearing as 2-D. I have also tried importing in to my 3D view and into a front elevation view. The reason for importing the image would be to hang a photo on my wall or put a clients logo in to my 3D rendering.

Am I just missing the part of my tutorials and HELP menu that deals with this?

I have been successful bringing my image in as a "texture" but even here I have trouble making it the right size or even a single image. It also comes in as upside down. Come to think of it most of the textures do. Maybe I'm trying to read the tutorials too fast. Am I missing something?

If this is covered in the Help or manuals I don't expect detailed instructions from you just...where is the info?

I have the wrong version of Vectorworks Fundamentals Training manual but I also have the correct Archoncad Fundamentals and The 3D modelling manuals....v12.5

I am still looking for a copy of The Renderworks v12.5 Rendering CD or manual which Nemetschek no longer has.

Thanks ALL for any help in finding where this info is.

Share this post


Link to post

You say you have Fundamentals 12.5. Do you have RenderWorks? If not, you will not be able to apply textures.

Pat

Share this post


Link to post

BrendanFella,

i have a few tricks for creating and making textures. My online user group covered this last year and if you are a subscriber you can download the back issues. Email me direct

Share this post


Link to post

Hi ALL,

Thanks for your comments. I will be sure to try all and report back.

However I was misunderstood a little.

I have been OK with the textures (Still need improvement though)

My question was...Can I bring in an image to place on a wall without bringing it in as a texture? I need to be able to import a photo, corp logo etc into my 3D rendering and have it in 3D. In other programs I was able to import a photo ie. place it on a wall and it kept it's correct size etc. (I sized it before importing it). If I had a perspective dwg on my screen it showed up in perspective...If I had a front view it showed up as a front view but when I view it as a perspective it showed as a perspective.

So do I have to import as a texture or can I import as a seperate component. All my tutorials explain how to use an image as a texture but that is not my goal. I need my one single image to import as such.

I do have Fundamentals v12.5 w RW.

Share this post


Link to post

Sorry for taking so long to reply to your help.

Thanks Ray. The "Image prop" worked. I would have never thought of looking for that terminology. I had been looking up "Image import"..."File Import", etc.

As a user of AutoCad my biggest problem is the different terminology.

With the help of The ArchonCad manuals and all you people in here I have actually been successful in creating a 3D color rendering. However my lighting and perspective (Camera position) still leaves a lot to be desired but I am finally getting somewhere.

One more question....Do most of you create your graphics in Vectorworks or do you do it in Photoshop/Illustrator?

Again, thanks to ALL and I'll be baaaaak with more questions...LOL

Just so you know the reason I'm taking so long to learn this is because I am still using AutoCad for rush jobs where somebody without AC would have to learn Vectorworks faster to function.

Edited by BrendanFella

Share this post


Link to post

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

 

7150 Riverwood Drive, Columbia, Maryland 21046, USA   |   Contact Us:   410-290-5114

 

© 2018 Vectorworks, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Vectorworks, Inc. is part of the Nemetschek Group.

×
×
  • Create New...