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2021 - Teaser Tuesday: Work Smarter with User Interface Improvements


JuanP

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45 minutes ago, zoomer said:

But if VW has ordered its Icons and Menus in a proper sorting and context sensitive,

there may be no more need to customize it manually.

That's true if it is purely context based - but it sounds as if it is more previous user behavior based.  Not sure where that behavior data is stored - but it must be stored somewhere - so should be possible for it to be migrated.

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  • Vectorworks, Inc Employee
2 hours ago, Travis.Designer said:

Hi

Anyone try Smart Options Display?

 

It work not as expected, sometime I press space bar it will show. then i press again it not. again it's still not.

 

 

Hi Travis,

 

Have you tried assigning a different key to launch Smart Options Display in the workspace editor?  You can do this under the Keys tab in the Workspace Editor.

 

We have found that some people's natural workflow involves moving the mouse too quickly and this can invoke the pan tool when they press the spacebar instead of the Smart Options Display.  Using a different key can be a little easier for some people rather than the spacebar.

 

Best Regards,

Ian

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52 minutes ago, Ian Lane said:

 

Hi Travis,

 

Have you tried assigning a different key to launch Smart Options Display in the workspace editor?  You can do this under the Keys tab in the Workspace Editor.

 

We have found that some people's natural workflow involves moving the mouse too quickly and this can invoke the pan tool when they press the spacebar instead of the Smart Options Display.  Using a different key can be a little easier for some people rather than the spacebar.

 

Best Regards,

Ian

Hi Ian

I set hotkey as below:

image.thumb.png.b5050426e779b7fd4b326cc6f65fe186.png

It work stable if I use hotkey. 

I think there're something wrong because I try space bar and MMB, they are not stable.

By the way, I use Wacom intuos with stylus. 

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55 minutes ago, Travis.Designer said:

By the way, I use Wacom intuos with stylus. 

 

 

1 hour ago, Ian Lane said:

We have found that some people's natural workflow involves moving the mouse too quickly and this can invoke the pan tool when they press the spacebar instead of the Smart Options Display.

 

OK, I have not yet tried with the Wacom Pen.

But from my experience, it is not possible to click with a Pen

without any dragging.

 

(I have an App that even crashes when I click on certain Icons

with the Pen, because of the unexpected cursor dragging.

You have to heavily shake your Mouse to provoke the same behavior)

 

 

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8 hours ago, Travis.Designer said:

It work not as expected, sometime I press space bar it will show. then i press again it not. again it's still not.

 

 

OK,

I looked a little bit closer.

I tried with my (set a bit fast*) 3DConnexion CADMouse.

And I see too that MMB mostly fails and even SPACEBAR.

I really have to press my Mouse down or left my hand to

make SOD appear.

 

(* means that is so fast and shaky that also many of my RMB

Clicks in Windows get ignored because I am (accidentally)

dragging while clicking)

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  • Vectorworks, Inc Employee

Because of the integration with the spacebar for SOD and the pan tool, the interaction is a little tricky.  As the spacebar is pressed we are waiting on user input to try and determine if the user intends to pan or launch SOD.  If the mouse is moved while the spacebar is down it will invoke the pan tool.  It is tricky for us to get the SOD to appear easily while also supporting the normal workflows of spacebar to pan that so many people are used to.

 

We will experiment some more and perhaps we can add a little dead zone around the cursor before the pan tool is invoked.

 

But at least setting a different hot key is working well for you, and that will definitely be the best option in the meantime, especially if you are using the stylus.

 

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4 minutes ago, Ian Lane said:

We will experiment some more and perhaps we can add a little dead zone around the cursor before the pan tool is invoked.

 

That would be very nice.

 

As for Pan by SPACEBAR, it is needed to press and "hold" Space bar anyway.

So if there is a way to recognize a short press of Space bar, while ignoring

any cursor drag actions, it should work.

Basically it should work for a short MMB click the same way too.

 

While I am generally very happy that our Pan options still work as before.

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6 hours ago, zoomer said:

 

 

OK,

I looked a little bit closer.

I tried with my (set a bit fast*) 3DConnexion CADMouse.

And I see too that MMB mostly fails and even SPACEBAR.

I really have to press my Mouse down or left my hand to

make SOD appear.

 

(* means that is so fast and shaky that also many of my RMB

Clicks in Windows get ignored because I am (accidentally)

dragging while clicking)

Hi @zoomer; @Ian Lane

1/I replace hotkey "A" snap grid with Smart Option Display.

It's convenient for me.

2/ Full Expanded will reduce 1 click. It make scene with me.

image.thumb.png.32a76134e37aa74ce7f7e4fd993d425f.png

 

image.thumb.png.84179b0be8f14c85c53f7e47d737b713.png

 

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I am not sure if I will really need a new Key for SOD or just

get used to keep my Mouse fixed when clicking for now.

(Or lift the Pen before hitting SPACEBAR)

It is an option though.

 

BTW

I didn't find a setting for SODs display Transparency,

is there any setting ?

For me it looks too shy as it is and is hardly noticeable

in collapsed mode, if it is already there or not.

 

(BTW2

same for environment Transparency in Edit Modes with OpenGL.

I can't see/recognize my environment, I just see some white fog)

Edited by zoomer
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Like @zoomer I had to think of the BricsCAD quad cursor when I saw this, though the VW version seems to be missing context sensitivity the way it has in BricsCAD. But a welcome improvement nonetheless. I'll be trying it out one of these days.

 

Seems like there is now space on the wish list for new things to ask 😁

3D parametrics?

Edited by Art V
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12 minutes ago, Art V said:

the VW version seems to be missing context sensitivity

 

Pity, yes.

But the bottom left "last used commands" helps.

 

I think it is up to us to customize our Workspaces.

I use a pimped Standard Palette at the bottom below

the drawing area since years.

(Added some 3D and BIM PIOs, still too much 2D Tools

which I never use)

Also a pimped RMB Option Menu when Selected.

 

I think it would be better to just create a new Palette with

the most used Tool Icons and add this to SOD instead.

 

 

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3 hours ago, zoomer said:

BTW

I didn't find a setting for SODs display Transparency,

is there any setting ?

For me it looks too shy as it is and is hardly noticeable

in collapsed mode, if it is already there or not.

 

There is not currently any setting for this in the preferences.  We debated adding this but ultimately decided against it.  We worried it could be preference overload.

 

But perhaps in the future if others think this would be useful!

 

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Sometimes it is a bit of a surprise how quickly one gets used to something. Went into VW2020 approx. half an hour ago and wondered why the SOD didn't come up and then realised I was in 2020, duh.🙂

 

Though I am used to using the quad cursor in BricsCAD so already used to work that way, so that makes it a bit of  an automatism. Having it in 2021 does work nicely in general though it could benefit from some optimization (e.g. the 3D views icons in the SOD could be better, the icons are not distinctive enough in my opinion without having to read the descriptions).

 

Having contextual responsiveness like the quad tool in BricsCAD would be really useful to have and would make the SOD improve workflo, so please put that on the wish list for VW2022.

 

Edit: clarified the text about icons to make clear it related to the 3D views

Edited by Art V
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On 9/18/2020 at 12:26 PM, Ian Lane said:

Because of the integration with the spacebar for SOD and the pan tool, the interaction is a little tricky.  As the spacebar is pressed we are waiting on user input to try and determine if the user intends to pan or launch SOD.  If the mouse is moved while the spacebar is down it will invoke the pan tool.  It is tricky for us to get the SOD to appear easily while also supporting the normal workflows of spacebar to pan that so many people are used to.

 

We will experiment some more and perhaps we can add a little dead zone around the cursor before the pan tool is invoked.

 

But at least setting a different hot key is working well for you, and that will definitely be the best option in the meantime, especially if you are using the stylus.

 

 

EDIT: just realized these options already exist in VW prefs (and it's even simpler lol)

 

How about VW prefs where users can pick what they want for spacebar and MMB independently:

  • Space bar
    • Pan
    • SOD
    • Pan / SOD
  • MMB
    • Pan
    • SOD
    • Pan / SOD

BTW on a Mac, any Menu item can be mapped through Sys Prefs:

 

Screen Shot 2020-09-19 at 9.46.17 AM.png

Screen Shot 2020-09-19 at 9.47.59 AM.png

Edited by Mark Aceto
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On 9/18/2020 at 6:30 PM, Travis.Designer said:

2/ Full Expanded will reduce 1 click. It make scene with me.

 

 

@Travis.Designer thank you for pointing (pardon the pun) this out, and sharing a screenshot. So much better!

 

I haven't taken a deep dive into this yet but here's my current config with a 3Dconnexion CadMouse (that has a MMB that I use for panning instead of the space bar).

 

The must-haves for me are:

  • Intentionally activate it (vs getting incessantly distracted by it when I'm looking at complex geometry and it turns my view into mud)
    • Unchecked "Show after mouse idles"
  • Fewest mouse clicks possible
    • Unchecked "Show with MMB

Screen Shot 2020-09-20 at 8.36.21 AM.png

Edited by Mark Aceto
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On 9/19/2020 at 7:34 AM, Ian Lane said:

We debated adding this but ultimately decided against it.  We worried it could be preference overload.

 

@Ian Lane speaking of "preference overload", let's say I want to change the hotkey for Launch Quick Search to "Command-F". I have to do that in every single workspace (I'm currently up to 9 "stock" workspaces), which will duplicate (modified versions of) every single workspace. Then when I inevitable have to dump my user folder as a troubleshooting step, I have to reimport them. Et cetera et cetera et cetera... 

 

There has to be some common denominator efficiency built into switching between workspaces. 80% of the palettes and settings do not change for us. And that's not to mention that creating or modifying a workspace, we can only drag 1 tool / menu item at time. There's waaaaaaaaaaaay too much fiddling with redundant settings.

 

Screen Shot 2020-09-20 at 8.47.30 AM.png

Edited by Mark Aceto
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20 minutes ago, Mark Aceto said:

 

@Ian Lane speaking of "preference overload", let's say I want to change the hotkey for Launch Quick Search to "Command-F". I have to do that in every single workspace (I'm currently up to 9 "stock" workspaces), which will duplicate (modified versions of) every single workspace. Then when I inevitable have to dump my user folder as a troubleshooting step, I have to reimport them. Et cetera et cetera et cetera... 

 

There has to be some common denominator efficiency built into switching between workspaces. 80% of the palettes and settings do not change for us. And that's not to mention that creating or modifying a workspace, we can only drag 1 tool / menu item at time. There's waaaaaaaaaaaay too much fiddling with redundant settings.

 

The UI/UX should not be "additive" for Designer licenses. It should be "subtractive" for a la carte licenses. And honestly it's not even about a Designer license. If I have a Spotlight license, and then install Landru and AutoPlot tools, customize the Spotlight workspace... here comes the workspace parade!

 

Screen Shot 2020-09-20 at 8.47.30 AM.png

 

@Ian Lanehere's my thought-starter solution (screenshot attach for reference):

 

When I'm in the Braceworks workspace *, there are also Spotlight and Event Design menus (both native to the Spotlight workspace). We're already halfway there with this solution BTW... 

  • Event Design doesn't need its own dedicated menu. Make it a sub-menu of the Spotlight menu.
  • Continue adding "module" menus to the menu bar (Arch, Landmark, ConnectCAD)
  • Consolidate BIM-Arch with Arch

You can see where I'm going with this... 

 

If I'm in danger of running out of menu bar real estate, let me choose which modules to display in the menu bar. Dump the rest in a workspaces sub-menu that contains all of the same menu commands vs taking me to a different workspace. Honestly, if this was the only change, it would be a pain-point game-changer.

 

* If I'm working in Braceworks, are there any Spotlight features/menus/tools...  missing? Can I just ignore the Spotlight workspace altogether? How would I know? This is like that game at the bar where I have to spot what's missing between 2 similar photos. Except that I can't see both workspaces at the same time, so I have to screenshot them to compare them... 

 

Screen Shot 2020-09-20 at 9.11.43 AM.png

Edited by Mark Aceto
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@Ian Lane

 

1 hour ago, Mark Aceto said:

There has to be some common denominator efficiency built into switching between workspaces. 80% of the palettes and settings do not change for us. And that's not to mention that creating or modifying a workspace, we can only drag 1 tool / menu item at time. There's waaaaaaaaaaaay too much fiddling with redundant settings.

Yes, creating/changing workspaces could definitely be more efficient.

 

It would also be useful if one could copy/paste a custom toolset from one workspace to another, not to mention being able to even simply drag a complete existing toolset from from the left into the toolsets section on the right instead of having to create a new toolset first and then drag all the items one by one into the new toolset as you mentioned.

 

Another option could be to have a master workspace editor window with a layout similar to the visibilities setting of the organization window where you can see all tools etc. on the left and all workspaces on the right and then be able to select multiple workspaces that you want to update with the  same new/customized toolset shown in the middle column. Sort of, I'm sure it will need some further thought and fine-tuning but you probably get the idea.

 

There are quite a few things that could be optimized in VW by removing unnecessary redundancy or by grouping relating things into fewer tools/menu options to make it more streamlined.

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11 hours ago, Art V said:

@Ian Lane

 

Yes, creating/changing workspaces could definitely be more efficient.

 

It would also be useful if one could copy/paste a custom toolset from one workspace to another, not to mention being able to even simply drag a complete existing toolset from from the left into the toolsets section on the right instead of having to create a new toolset first and then drag all the items one by one into the new toolset as you mentioned.

 

Another option could be to have a master workspace editor window with a layout similar to the visibilities setting of the organization window where you can see all tools etc. on the left and all workspaces on the right and then be able to select multiple workspaces that you want to update with the  same new/customized toolset shown in the middle column. Sort of, I'm sure it will need some further thought and fine-tuning but you probably get the idea.

 

There are quite a few things that could be optimized in VW by removing unnecessary redundancy or by grouping relating things into fewer tools/menu options to make it more streamlined.

 

All of that sounds wonderful!

 

Especially now that I can do this (which I would obviously want the same in every workspace)...

 

Btw anybody else have the shrunken "Exit Edit" button? Assuming this is a bug to report... 

 

Screen Shot 2020-09-20 at 9.38.03 PM.png

Edited by Mark Aceto
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