Trouble getting an imported base layer in the same location

[Viper x]

When I am importing a new base layer I am having trouble getting it to "land" in the same location on the drawing so I can just turn the old base layer off and the new layer on and a third layer will match exactly.

The new base layer is coming in to the side and I am having to turn the old layer off then select all of the third layer and drag it across to the new base layer, it is then hard to get it to line up exactly each time and I am sure this is not a clever way to achieve this.

What am I doing wrong please ?

[ 06-01-2005, 07:19 AM: Message edited by: Viper x ]

[CipesDesign]

From where are you importing it? From an ACAD file? From another VW's file?

[Kevin]

I have this or a similar problem and have been unable to see what the cause is.

I find that if I cut or copy and paste between sheets, I often have the items land in a different location using Paste in Place.

[PeterT]

Sounds like an "Origin" issue to me.

The drawing origin must be in the same location of both files if you want objects to "land" in the same place when pasted from one file to another.

Go to Page/Set Origin... and set the origin to "Drawing Center" in both files before cutting and pasting.

[Viper x]

quote:

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Originally posted by CipesDesign:

From where are you importing it? From an ACAD file? From another VW's file?

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I am importing an autocad file, which means I guess that I can not change the origin setting of the imported drawing.

My drawing has "set origin to drawing center" is this how it should be ?

[ 06-01-2005, 05:10 PM: Message edited by: Viper x ]

[CipesDesign]

Hey Viper, it's funny - I asked hoping you wouldn't say ACAD, becasue I have absolutely no idea how in the *$%# some of those files end up 100 miles off the page!!! But, I do have a pretty easy workaround (you may already have figured it out): Create a dummy VW's file to import the ACAD file into. Select the entire plan (in the dummy file) and group it. Then copy it into the "real" VW's file and drag it to exactly where it needs to be. Yes it's a pain, but it will work...

[matto]

Here is where Work group references can be really useful, instead of copy pasting the info out of the dummy file.

1.Set your origin to a known location (building or boundary corner) in your main file.

2.Then import the ACAD file into a new file, and set the origin of that file to the same location.

3.(add steps here- like clean up the mess of classes that seem to come with every ACAD file)

4.Now go back to your Main file and add the dummy file as a Workgroup Reference.

If you set it manual update it will only update when you tell it to, which would probably be a good thing in your situation.

[Kevin]

quote:

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Originally posted by iboymatt:

...3.(add steps here- like clean up the mess of classes that seem to come with every ACAD file)...

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How do you "clean up" the classes. My preference would be to add a prefix to them such as A-, S-, etc. However I see no way to do this globally.

[Marietta]

Viper

The only time I ever have problems with a file not coming in at hte right spot or origin, is if the cad operator you are getting the file from changes thier origin point. Normally, they don't change and it is very convenient to get in the right spot. Iboymatt's sol;oution seems to be the best when this happens, but then you may need to manually insert each time.

[IanH]

quote:

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Originally posted by iboymatt:

3.(add steps here- like clean up the mess of classes that seem to come with every ACAD file)

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Can you do this only for a particular layer, ie the one that I imported autocad file into? Purge unused objects seeps to do it for all layers.

Is there also a way in object info of having only the classes used in the current layer appear under the class dropdown?

-Ian

[jan15]

quote:

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Originally posted by Kevin:

How do you "clean up" the classes.

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Sometimes purging is all you need. Most Autocad files I've imported have had at least 80 classes with nothing on them (or with nothing on them except an object in some also-unused symbol). Most Autocad users seem to think their template file should contain all the classes and symbols they'll ever need.

So you could try importing into a new file, purging symbols and classes, and then pasting the Autocad drawing into your working file.

Or set class visibility to Show Active Only, and then use your arrow-key combination to cycle through and quickly see what's in each class. Usually among the non-empty classes you find 30 or 40 with only one or two objects in them.

[Kevin]

Thanks Jan15, good advice.

[Kevin]

On the paste-in-place issue, I believe that what I am experiencing is indeed centered on origins.

But now I can't seem to get some sheets to change their origin. When I use the command to set origin to drawing center, nothing happens.

Is drawing center, the center of the image or center of the page?

[jan15]

quote:

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Originally posted by Kevin:

I find that if I cut or copy and paste between sheets, I often have the items land in a different location using Paste in Place.

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This sounds suspicious. I use Paste-in-Place all day long. I have a Function key macro'd to do it. When I want to move objects from one layer to another, I use PiP, not the Obj Info palette. And I Paste-in-place from one file to another all the time. I even like saying it. It rhymes, and it's alliterative.

The only way I can imagine the paste not landing in the right place is if the target layer is at a different scale than the source layer, in which case it will certainly paste in a different place, because "in place" to a computer means the same X and Y coordinates with respect to the origin. Wherever that is. I've never known where the origin of any VW file is. Never wondered where it is. The computer takes care of all that.

But you can still use PiP to a layer at a different scale. Only you'd have to have pasted everything else in place from the same source scale to that target scale. When I paste from one scale to another, I don't use PiP. I just pick a control point and drag the newly pasted stuff into place by grabbing that point and dragging it to the corresponding point of the stuff that's already there.

[Kevin]

Thanks Jan, but the problem is actually with my title block. My block is a symbol. I paste it into the first sheet and align it to my liking, then copy and paste in place on subsequent sheets.

Since all sheets are 1:1 scale, the title block should fall exactly in the same place on each sheet. But in my case, not always.

[Delmer]

I moved some sheets one time when I wanted different page layouts on some. When trying to realign I discovered you can't grey one or view more than one, they can be at different zoom factors or panned to different locations, though paste in place will locate objects according to the grid on design layers, this is not so on sheets.

You CAN however snap to the corners of a sheet with the move page tool. The rest is obvious; just snap a line or rectange or locus to a corner of a sheet you are happy with, make sure all other sheets have the same page setup and paste this in place throughout. Then with the move page tool snap the corner of the sheet and drag it to where it needs to be.

Which reminds me of a wish list item . . .

[ 06-08-2005, 07:43 PM: Message edited by: Delmer ]

[matto]

Kevin,

I think you'll find that each sheet layer can have it's own origin, which is independant of the file origin. Unless all the sheets have the same origin the paste in place won't work as expected.

You can set these orgins either from the sheet layer dialog box or with the move origin tool while the sheet layer is active. (not that I've found a reason to move them, would be curious if anyone has).

As for cleaning up classes, well Jan15 pretty much covered it, mostly it needs to be done by hand, just manually working out what is of value whats not so valuable. As you said it's good to prefix all the class names as well just so it won't effect your other work. I'm pretty sure there is a tool at www.vectordepot.com that can rename all the classes with a prefix.

Matt

[jan15]

Sheet Layer?

Must be something new with v11. One of the new Autocadophile features.

It used to be that you would just put the title block on one layer, and use that layer in all sheets, and just paste-in-place the sheet number and title for each sheet on its main layer.

[Kevin]

quote:

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Originally posted by jan15:

Sheet Layer?

Must be something new with v11...

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Yes, it is a brave new world. VW11 does work differently than previous versions.You can no longer do what you describe.

[Kevin]

quote:

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Originally posted by iboymatt:

Kevin,

I think you'll find that each sheet layer can have it's own origin, which is independant of the file origin...

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I think that you are on to something here. I believe this must be the issue. Trouble is, that I am having difficulty changing the origin. Will have to look at this further.

Thanks for the help.

[Delmer]

iboymatt,

Do coinciding origins on sheet layers work for you? Though I've found the origin & grid govern location on drawing layers, they have no influince on PiP for my sheets.

jan15,

You can still do exactly what you presently are doing as far as TBs on design layers, you would just ignore the new sheet altogether. That can even be tempting till you see all the conveniences they offer.

[Kevin]

Thanks for all your help. My paste in place issue revolved around my pages being in different locations. The program was pasting in place, but because my pages were not all centered, the images were falling in different locations on the pages.

[matto]

quote:

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Originally posted by Delmer:

iboymatt,

Do coinciding origins on sheet layers work for you? Though I've found the origin & grid govern location on drawing layers, they have no influince on PiP for my sheets.

---

The easiest answer would be...

Mostly, oh wait just reread your question...

No

If I create a whole bunch of sheets set one up with title-block and viewport of say a plan. copy and PiP to the others it works everytime.

Things from design layers won't work on sheets as all sheets are 1:1 scale. Design Layers are still multi-scale. so pastes between them tend to go crazy, just like an two layers of different scales.

Sometimes thou PiP doesn't seem to work right between Sheets but normally after the file has been in production for a while.

It was only Kevin's original question that made me think it was odd.

Jan15,

I to resisted all the joy the new system had to offer, starting out using just those bit which suited me, It's a very nice flexible system like that. Just forgive the AutoCADish naming and the features tend to make a whole lot of sense.

(if it makes you feel better sheet layers are referred to as Presentation layers in the VectorScript docs, not sure why the name didn't stick)

They show a lot of promise for future improvements as well.