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Create Floor Marionette Node


ericjhberg

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There are a number of nodes for creating Slab objects and there are also a fair number of VS commands related to slabs. You may find that you get pushed in that direction as its been mentioned before in the forums that the Floor object is being phased out. It may be possible to create a floor node but the one VS command for floors defines them as a series of points.

 

Kevin

 

Edited by Kevin McAllister
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25 minutes ago, Kevin McAllister said:

the Floor object is being phased out

 

That is what I was afraid of and I am bummed that they are phasing this tool out.

 

As I have mentioned on here before regarding the Floor, very few objects in VW operate as simply, yet effectively as floors. They are the perfect HYBRID OBJECT for quick flat slab/hardscape modeling, mainly because they dramatically outperform hardscapes and slab objects.

 

Just some of the benefits of floors over the others.

  1. Simple Hybrid Objects - Working in Plan and 3D separates them from extrudes and other solid geometries.
  2. 1:1 Object to Plug-in Relationship - After creating a Floor from an object it is very easy to go back to the original polyline/polygon. This is great for problem solving/simplifying bad drafting or complex linework because a simple ungroup command will yield the unmodified single original object. When doing this with floors or hardscapes, they will yield at least 3 different redundant objects, making cleanup a nightmare.
  3. Texture Orientation - The floor responds simply to the directional editing of textures in the OIP, allowing for multiple directional variations of one texture on several objects. Hardscapes STILL don't have this functionality and slabs are difficult as well. THIS IS A BIG REASON WHY FLOORS ARE JUST BETTER!

Either keep floors around or improve the other objects.

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@ericjhberg Funny that you use this as well. One of my clients uses this almost exclusively, and often to my dismay, because you loose the functionality of the hardscape as a site modifier and as a way to create takeoffs. With that add on top the data tag options and you really can't beat it.

 

How are you guys getting along with the fires? Our thoughts are with you. Oh! It's 40 degrees as a high today and windy as heck!

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27 minutes ago, rowbear97 said:

@ericjhberg Funny that you use this as well. One of my clients uses this almost exclusively, and often to my dismay, because you loose the functionality of the hardscape as a site modifier and as a way to create takeoffs. With that add on top the data tag options and you really can't beat it.

 

How are you guys getting along with the fires? Our thoughts are with you. Oh! It's 40 degrees as a high today and windy as heck!

Not to derail the thread, but holy crap, California!!! With unbelievable timing, my sister moved from Ventura two weeks ago. I have family up north as well. Hoping things don't become as crazy in the greater Oakland area.

 

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@rowbear97 & @mjm Thank's for asking. We're fine here in Ventura. The SoCal fires this year so far have been about 30 miles south of us and moved further south...not like last year's Thomas Fire, which swept right through Ventura. We've been lucky...so far!

 

Regarding FLOORS...I completely disagree with your assessment @rowbear97. Floor are actually extremely useful in quick studies and 2D/3D integration. You are correct that we cannot use them as site modifiers; however, flat planed hardscapes with directional slopes are very uncommon in the grading world anyway. They are often complex with varied pitches which requires you to break up your hardscapes into little chunks for each pitch...oh yeah...and they can't technically touch either...not very practical if you ask me. I'd rather use actual site modifiers to do my grading than hardscapes with site modifiers.

 

Take offs are always by area anyway, which can be done with floors, 2d linework, hardscape alike. With the addition of slab settings and profiles to hardscapes I am more compelled to give it a go, but the other functionalities are so lacking that we are caught in the middle.

 

As for the data tags...we still will have to add a custom record field to hardscapes/floors/2d anyway to get the data tag to work as intended. Hardscape objects do not contain the necessary fields to adequately describe the object without adding an additional record to it, so what does it matter that it is a hardscape to begin with.

 

Additionally, they have not figured out Hardscape Styles yet. You can save a slab style that is applied to a hardscape object and modify the slab style in one location, but you cannot save a Hardscape Style that when modified, makes universal changes throughout the design. Right now, the best you can do is use the match properties tool (eyedropper), which is often inaccurate, slow and can cause crashes. 

 

All of this is in combination to the 3 problems I expressed above. My experience with the hardscape tool is that it is just powerful enough to trick you into using it, but after you do, you quickly will find instances where it doesn't work or causes problems. It is not a completely thought out tool to handle all applications and unfortunately the Floor isn't either...it's just easier to use, manipulate, and go back and forth with. Until they completely rethink hardscapes and how they work, I'm not convinced.

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1 hour ago, ericjhberg said:

Regarding FLOORS...I completely disagree with your assessment @rowbear97. Floor are actually extremely useful in quick studies and 2D/3D integration. You are correct that we cannot use them as site modifiers; however, flat planed hardscapes with directional slopes are very uncommon in the grading world anyway. They are often complex with varied pitches which requires you to break up your hardscapes into little chunks for each pitch...oh yeah...and they can't technically touch either...not very practical if you ask me. I'd rather use actual site modifiers to do my grading than hardscapes with site modifiers.

You left out the part about curving walking paths or driveways and how annoying it is that they only grade in a straight line between two points and not along the arc. But you can't do this with a roof either.

 

Did you try using the "Save Hardscape" which saves it under hardscapes which you can then drag and drop onto the hardscape you want to change?

 

Of course while testing this out it appears I have something wonky happening with rendering in top/plan where hatches are not showing up correctly.

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11 minutes ago, rowbear97 said:

You left out the part about curving walking paths or driveways and how annoying it is that they only grade in a straight line between two points and not along the arc.

This is where I use the Nurbs Roadway tool to create a vertical and horizontal curve framework that I explode into 3D polygon site modifiers. Much easier, but a weird workflow.

 

12 minutes ago, rowbear97 said:

Did you try using the "Save Hardscape" which saves it under hardscapes which you can then drag and drop onto the hardscape you want to change?

Yes, but again, you have to then physically re-apply it to all of the corresponding hardscape objects if any changes need to be made. This again requires a select similar command and reapplication which is cumbersome, inaccurate, and can often cause crashes. We need HARDSCAPE STYLES that control all aspects of the hardscape, not just the slab style.

 

For every reason there is to use a hardscape, I can easily come up with a reason not to. It's almost like a no sum political argument. If it works for you, great, but for us, we have too many issues with the overall workflow at this point to completely adopt them.

 

I will say, the one time I use hardscapes is...when I need texture bed modifiers on my site model. Even  this is a flawed process because technically they cannot touch one another without causing errors in the site model. There is just NO perfect solution currently in the software.

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On 11/15/2018 at 10:58 AM, ericjhberg said:

@rowbear97 & @mjm Thank's for asking. We're fine here in Ventura. The SoCal fires this year so far have been about 30 miles south of us and moved further south...not like last year's Thomas Fire, which swept right through Ventura. We've been lucky...so far!

 

Regarding FLOORS...I completely disagree with your assessment @rowbear97. Floor are actually extremely useful in quick studies and 2D/3D integration. You are correct that we cannot use them as site modifiers; however, flat planed hardscapes with directional slopes are very uncommon in the grading world anyway. They are often complex with varied pitches which requires you to break up your hardscapes into little chunks for each pitch...oh yeah...and they can't technically touch either...not very practical if you ask me. I'd rather use actual site modifiers to do my grading than hardscapes with site modifiers.

 

Take offs are always by area anyway, which can be done with floors, 2d linework, hardscape alike. With the addition of slab settings and profiles to hardscapes I am more compelled to give it a go, but the other functionalities are so lacking that we are caught in the middle.

 

As for the data tags...we still will have to add a custom record field to hardscapes/floors/2d anyway to get the data tag to work as intended. Hardscape objects do not contain the necessary fields to adequately describe the object without adding an additional record to it, so what does it matter that it is a hardscape to begin with.

 

Additionally, they have not figured out Hardscape Styles yet. You can save a slab style that is applied to a hardscape object and modify the slab style in one location, but you cannot save a Hardscape Style that when modified, makes universal changes throughout the design. Right now, the best you can do is use the match properties tool (eyedropper), which is often inaccurate, slow and can cause crashes. 

 

All of this is in combination to the 3 problems I expressed above. My experience with the hardscape tool is that it is just powerful enough to trick you into using it, but after you do, you quickly will find instances where it doesn't work or causes problems. It is not a completely thought out tool to handle all applications and unfortunately the Floor isn't either...it's just easier to use, manipulate, and go back and forth with. Until they completely rethink hardscapes and how they work, I'm not convinced.

Glad you're safe, sorry for those who are not so lucky. 

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