Zoom function

[Heather Fagans]

Is there a way to set the zoom to the scroll wheel on a two button or three button mouse intsead of having it tied to the keyboard?

Mac G4

OS10.3.5

VW Arch. 10.5

[JHEarcht]

Heather,

I'm on a PC, but VW will zoom interactively when you hold the Command button and scroll the wheel. No setup is required. See page 2-47 in the VW User's Guide.

Another way to quickly zoom-in ( CC ) or out ( VV ) by double or half is to hit the "C" or "V" key twice.

JHE

[G-Pang]

Hold down Option key on MacOSX

[cberg]

I have been following the discussion about using the mouse scroll wheel to zoom in and out in Vector Works drawings. I too find it clunky and irritating to have to hold down the option key to use the scroll wheel. (I am using Mac OSX) It would be a lot more natural not to have to fumble over the keyboard to use this function. Sadly my mouse a Logitech 310 4-Button Mouse does not allow me to program holding down the option key while scrolling. It may seem a trivial matter to Vectorworks tech folks, but it makes a big difference to the day to day use of the program.

Thanks,

cberg

[alanmac]

The standard set up on my wireless Microsoft mouse is probably the same as most others mice with scroll wheel.

The scroll wheel when not used with any keyboard combination scrolls the drawing page up and down. If you have the tilt wheel like mine it will also scroll from side to side in the PC version of VW. Don't know if this is the same on a Mac.

Can't see how you'd work the zoom just using the scroll wheel without losing the page scroll function if it didn't need a keyboard key with it.

Maybe a multibutton mouse will allow you to assign this to one of the mouse buttons instead of the keyboard, but that may prove awkward when trying to scroll the wheel with the same hand and cause aches and pains to develop, increasing the risk of RSI.

My opinion is that many program use the keyboard and mouse together for commands so it's not just this function and VW, and I find the compliants to have to use a keyboard key in conjuction for this function nitpicking in the extreme.

After all it's not like some programs commands, where you have to use three keys held down to achieve something.

Also, it's a whole lot better than relying on just having the zoom functions in the palettes, drawing an area zoom selection etc.

I've just done a search and the last post in this thread describes an option with the intellimouse which may work if you have one to just use the scroll wheel. It's an old thread so may not be relevant to VW today. The link is http://techboard.nemetschek.net/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=12;t=001348

[ 11-22-2004, 05:23 PM: Message edited by: alanmac ]

[cberg]

Alan,

I'll have to look more closely at that last post. Settings are different for the mac.

My question for you and for the Nemetschek team is this. The function of zooming in and out of any architectural drawing seems far more important than being able to scroll up and down the page, which I find to be a relatively useless function when I can just hold down the space bar and pan around, and when you need to hold down a separate key to move right or left. Why not allow the wheel to default to zoom in and out, or better yet, give us the option to do this. If we were to take a poll, I bet most people would prefer using the wheel without keyboard intervention to zoom in and out, than the current arrangement.

I know other programs require mouse and keyboard commands together, sometimes in even more awkward combinations. This does not make them good either.

I dunno, maybe this is technically very difficult to do. I can't imagine how it could be as other programs seem to do this. But then again, I'm not a software engineer. Is this something the Nemetschek folks are working on?

cberg

[kingram]

This topic has come up several times, so I hope the folks at NNA are tracking this request. It really is not nitpicking to request this feature; I use other programs that incorporate wheel zoom and just find them more intuitive and less intrusive into the drawing process. SketchUp is a great example of how to incorporate flexible zoom, pan, and orbit using the wheel mouse. I have stated before and firmly believe that this simple change to the user interface would right now be one of the most effective in terms of attracting users to switch to VW.

[alanmac]

Hi cberg

When you pan how do you achieve this? As you said by holding down the space bar (a keyboard key) and moving the mouse, which to me is the same effort as holding a key and scrolling to get zooming. No offence, but if one is acceptable useage why not the other.

Whilst I accept and agree it would be nice to have the option to change and it may well be possible I don't think that it's in any way difficult, awkward or time consuming or would make a tremendous difference to my working day to do so, considering this combination of actions is used frequently in all programs.

I'm a great believer in using as many keyboard combinations, short cuts as possible or you can remember in my case !!.

Anybody using these to there full extent, (I've seen people brought up with the old DOS programs/keyboard used to this way of working) are much quicker at production than somebody using the mouse for the majority of actions.

Pressing two keys to achieve an action is a whole lot quicker and I'd say healthier than "mousing" all the time.

In my opinion we seem to rely too heavily on the mouse to perform actions these days and should be encouraged to use the keys more.

[cberg]

Alan,

I would prefer being able to pan by just holding down the mouse wheel button, but that is possible but clunky for other reasons. Moreover, the space bar is much easier to find than the option key which unless I put a piece of tape over it, is impossible to find. I always have to think about this option key, and moving through a drawing, I would much prefer to think about something else, like, say, my design...

I guess I would like the mouse to be able to do all the maneuvering through the drawing, and the keyboard commands to do all the drawing/modeling operations. Seems logical, time efficient and intuitive at the same time. It also frees up your non-mouse hand for keyboard commands, which, believe me, I do make much use of.

That's just my opinion, and I know we all approach programs differently.

[alanmac]

Hi cberg.

Although I did use macs for the last two years I started on Windows PC and am back on them again.

As you may know the main function combination key is the control one, Ctrl, for actions in Windows e.g. Ctrl+A to "select all" for example. The same as on macs but a different first key.

If you don't use or have not used Windows this is the last key in the bottom left of the keyboard, larger than the others and easy to find. With your fingers lightly resting near the left edge of the keyboard the key is always easily found with the forefinger.

See how superior Windows is ;~)

Only joking, don't want to start an OS war, just a little joke.

As you say we all look at things differently, including design, which is why it's great to be involved in it.

all the best

Alan

[alanmac]

Hi Chris D

Does it come up that often? I must admit I don't remember it and when I did a search only about five threads came up, most not very current.

So what you are saying is that in these programs the scroll wheel does not scroll the page at all anymore. This function subsituted by the fact you can pan by depressing the wheel and moving the mouse instead of scrolling.

Do these work regardless of what tool is selected at the time of scrolling the mouse wheel or do you have to select say the zoom tool?

I must admit I like the sound of what you describe. Just don't ask me to switch to Autocad to use it. I'd suffer the Vectorworks alternative forever, rather than that!!

This of course assumes you have a scroll wheel mouse, which most of us have I'm sure, what do you do in these programs if you don't have one?

With that in mind, you mention Macs, which of course does not apply to Autocad and Revit, so how do diehard users of the lovely made Apple mouse get on without scroll wheel to do this in Archicad?

Alan

[ 11-23-2004, 01:47 PM: Message edited by: alanmac ]

[Chris D]

Alan,

Every time this comes up I have to have my say. The reason it comes up so often is that NNA have got it wrong. Zooming/Panning is what you do all day - so when it's cumbersome, it's infuriating.

AutoCAD, ArchiCAD and Revit all work the same. They use the wheel to zoom, and a depressed wheel (with mouse move) to pan. Dead simple, dead good. You don't hear users of these programs moaning - because they've got it right.

VW uses (on a Mac) the alt button to copy, so trying to use it to copy, while also using it to zoom to hit on a difficult snap, requires great dexterity. New users complain to me constantly about this

NNA could give us the functioanlity we want as an option. If you like it the way it is, fine, stick with it, but don't call us nitpickers for wanting improvements.

[Chris D]

Alan,

Yes - that's how they work, and that's what everyone is suggesting when they ask for wheel-zooming. You don't need to select a tool to use it - it works transparently and doesn't interfere with the command you are using, or the change Undo sequence.

Like you suggest, the scroll function is irrelevant - pan is much more usable to CAD users.

I love Apple's hardware design by the way, but they can't design a mouse for toffee. I've got fingers, not a paddle at the end of my arm. We've got an office full of gleaming iMacs, eMacs, G5s and Cinema Displays....but with rag bag of Microsoft and Logitech mouses....

[alanmac]

Chris

Sounds good to me. Count my vote in for the change please.

By the way, what does happen if you don't have a scroll wheel at all like the apple etc? Apart from joining this century and going out and buying one that is. Or a trackball type arrangement, as some like to use.

Alan

[ 11-24-2004, 04:21 AM: Message edited by: alanmac ]

[Chris D]

Never seen it working with a trackball.

If you like the soap-dish style of the mac mouse, there is now a 2 button mouse that looks exactly like it, which I think is available with a scroll wheel.

[jan15]

In the past I've posted in several forums in praise of Autocad's wheel zoom-and-pan combination, but after using it for the last few months, I have to say that the wheel panning is not as great as I originally thought. Pressing down on the wheel and holding it while panning gets to be very painful if you do it all day long. Unfortunately it's the only good panning method Autocad has, so you have to use it a lot.

I still think it would be good for Vectorworks to incorporate the same system, but only if the other fast panning methods, such as Arrow key and Pan-by-dragging, are kept.