Linked files moving

[RickR]

Just got off the phone with tech support but no good solution. My working theory is that this is SP3 related as it just started happening and am reverting to SP2 to confirm, and maybe get some work done. Anyone else seen this??

 

My current major project has a master file with 6 linked vwx files The linked files are fairly simple DWG imports in the classic shuttle file method for working with AutoCAD users. These files have been moving around between closing the master file and reopening it. Not every time, and they don't all move together or even the same distance or direction. Oddly enough if a DLVP has a crop, the crop element stays but shows a different part of the source file. All DLVPs have "lock position" checked and are also Locked objects. Recreating the link doesn't help. One linked file is 2 months old most are a couple of weeks old and the issue is a few days old.

 

To make matters worse my work is moving as well. Everything (except the linked files) stays together. That includes the crops to the files mentioned, locked items, and even the layer print page.

 

There isn't any trouble with sheet layers. The last time it happened links on a 2nd design layer did not move (most are on a single layer.) Layers without DLVPs are fine.

[Art V]

19 minutes ago, RickR said:

My current major project has a master file with 6 linked vwx files The linked files are fairly simple DWG imports in the classic shuttle file method for working with AutoCAD users. These files have been moving around between closing the master file and reopening it. Not every time, and they don't all move together or even the same distance or direction. Oddly enough if a DLVP has a crop, the crop element stays but shows a different part of the source file.

As far as I can tell the best way to avoid this kind of shifting is to have all drawings have their user origin aligned with the internal origin and to make sure there is rotated plan in the referenced files. This is even more important if you are using georeferencing. The shifting happens when the master file is reloading the referenced files and for some reason the above mentioned solution prevents that shifting.

 

21 minutes ago, RickR said:

All DLVPs have "lock position" checked and are also Locked objects. Recreating the link doesn't help.

This only affects the position of the DLVP, not its content that would still get reloaded. Recreating the link the same way will not solve the issue as technically nothing changed (unless you aligned user origin with the internal origin before recreating the link).

 

22 minutes ago, RickR said:

To make matters worse my work is moving as well. Everything (except the linked files) stays together. That includes the crops to the files mentioned, locked items, and even the layer print page.

What do you mean with "my work is moving as well" ?

[RickR]

Thanks for the response.

 

I'm not quite sure what you mean. (Geo-referencing isn't an issue.) I never move a files origin. In fact one of my first steps is to place a loci at 0,0,0 and lock it. In the theatrical world the stage centerline and proscenium opening form a reference grid. That referencing has been around far longer than CAD of any form, so it becomes a strong habit in theatrical drafting. Though something triggering such a move could be a clue here. FYI One of the key purposes of the shuttle file method is to allow the DWGs (drawn and updated by others) to be placed and rotated to match my needs. I've done this at least dozens if not hundreds of times, over years and never had a problem.

 

My work moving means that all my objects are relocating as if the origin moved. To take a simple case that 0,0,0 loci now reads 41'8", -61'3.25", 0 

Edited March 29, 2018 by RickR

[Art V]

13 minutes ago, RickR said:

My work moving means that all my objects are relocating as if the origin moved. To take a simple case that 0,0,0 lock now reads 41'8", -61'3.25", 0

Did you check if the user origin shifted for some reason? There recently was a discussion on a similar issue where the user and/or colleagues kept accidentally moving the user origin.

 

15 minutes ago, RickR said:

Though something triggering such a move could be a clue here. FYI One of the key purposes of the shuttle file method is to allow the DWGs (drawn and updated by others) to be placed and rotated to match my needs. I've done this at least dozens if not hundreds of times, over years and never had a problem.

Does the shifting take place after you reimport the updated dwg file into the referenced VWX file? If so did the user origin shift in the referenced file (e.g. because the import setting was different or because the UCS in the DWG file has shifted relative to the WCS, as VW imports relative to the WCS).

[RickR]

The origin did move. I'm not sure if I might have done that while trying to fix the first shift. Definitely never before that. And definitely never in between moves. I.e. Yesterday I 'fixed' everything for the 3rd time while waiting for support to call back. This morning it was moved. (and the only other person capable of opening a file is well aware of the issue and generally doesn't do much drafting anyway)

 

No the shift did not line up with DWG imports. As I mentioned one of those is untouched for 2 months. I also worked in a couple and when done they didn't shift.

Edited March 29, 2018 by RickR

[RickR]

New data

 

I cleaned everything up in SP2. Opened, closed, opened all was well.

Today all the DLVPs shifted. There goes the SP2 idea!

[AlanW]

@RickRHi Not sure if this helps but this was my problem a while ago and never happened again after following the steps.

 

Posted February 10, 2017

  On 23/11/2014 at 10:09 PM, Alan Woodwell said:

Hi, I had this issue where one of the xrefed drawing viewports moved and we found that we fixed it by resetting the 0,0 point back on the reference drawing that moved. and reopened the drawing or refreshed the viewport reference and it came back to the original position. Don't try moving the drawing back. Just make sure they all have the same 0,0 point.

Hope this helps.

Hi, try this to fix the problem. No reason was ever found for the reason the files shifted, but this fixed the issue. Also just make sure nothing that is references is a few 100 miles from the VW origin. HTH

[RickR]

Thanks,

 

That sounds a bit like what Art was talking about, but I'm unclear as to the details. Are you saying that the 0,0 of the linked file has to match the 0,0 of the master? Is this the internal origin or the user origin. If so then I would have to move and rotate every DWG import into the shuttle files. Sort of defeats the purpose.

[RickR]

Added thought:

 

The unified origin theory has a problem. The movement has been similar but not uniform among the linked files. Most of these files come from a VERY experience AutoCAD tech and share an origin among themselves. But even when they share this point they move and move almost randomly. It's curious that the distances and angles are somewhat similar but not uniform.

[RickR]

Update

I moved everything in the linked files so that their origin could align with the master file origin.

So far no issues.

If I don't post further, that's the (*##$%@&^$) workaround.

[AlanW]

@RickRhi the Origin is fixed (as I understand) and can’t be moved. Your user origin. (0,0) can be moved. I will often set my user origin to corner of a site plan. If on 5 different files and referenced into one file they all sit neatly on top of each other. Sometimes the (0,0) point of one of the files moves and it won’t line up. TThe temptation is to move the drawing. But you test the (0,0) back to the original spot and save the file and close. Re open you master file and all should be aligned.

Problem occurs if any object in a file is more than a few miles away from the Origin. Survey data files often have a reference node miles away. Will cause issues.

HTH

[RickR]

All true, but shouldn't apply. 

I almost never move the user origin. My files don't have large offsets. End to end is a few hundred feet. These same linked files have been in use for almost a year. 

 

3 things have changed lately. SP3 was installed the day it all went bad. And a month ago the master file got coruppted and had to be rebuilt from layer imports. Naturally the links had to be recreated from scratch. Lastly I have a new computer, same OS just more powerful. Of course bugs shouldn't happen in the first place but they certainly exist.