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Virtual Reality (VR) & (VRaugmented reality)


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I am interested in discussing using Vectorworks to export to a platform for a VR experience for our clients.

I have in the past before VW had the walkthrough (VW 2008) exported my model to a gaming program called Unity 3D which allowed the clients to experience the walkthrough of their design.

Unity now has VR capabilities so I will be experimenting exporting my 3D VW model to Unity3D and converting it to VR.

Will also be using the current capability of VW web view VR to experiment with the HTC VIVE headset and controllers.

If anyone has had experience and in this area i am keen to start a dialogue.

This is an exciting area and am keen to get into it.

Regards 

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Hi Alan

 

I can't say I have any experience but I am very interested in this area as well.  I have worked on several promotional events for HTV Vive and must say it's an excellent piece of hardware,.

 

The closest I have come is using Google Cardboard with Web View / Sketchfab - which I find excellent - but Vive is a big step up from that.


Please let us know how you get on.


Best,

Andrew

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@Andrew DaviesHi, good to know. What software were they using? Do you know the specs of the  computer that was running the HTV Vive or was it Xbox, playstation???

I want to at least set myself up with good hardware.

Unity 3D is the only software that I know to export from VW easily. Any other you might comment on so i can have a look at also.

Regards Alan

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@mike m ozWithout being critical, Reasonable is the operative word BUT i know its going to get better and I understand the team at VW is working hard on it and i cant wait. 

I went to a display suite for an apartment that i was looking at and they had the apartment and surroundings modelled and i uses a HTC Vive headset and it was so real, you could pick up items, open and close all the cupd doors and drawers, it was so real, only the trees gave it away and even they were dam good. This is the experience I want for our clients.

This was the company that did the work and a selection of their work.

http://www.ivolvestudios.com/animations/

Edited by Alan Woodwell
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Alan, VR is the future and Vectorworks will need to get better at it.

 

The biggest issues for us as architects will be getting clients to pay for the work that is required to produce VR of good quality and having computers with the grunt required to render them in a reasonable timeframe.

 

Personally I would prefer to not have to do that by exporting to another program where once changes are made the model has to be reimported and the texturing and lighting work has to be redone.  I've been there and done that and it is a time consuming pain in the butt.

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@mike m ozI would also love to do it in one program, VW so in the interim i have to explore the workaround.

As for clients to pay for it, that's what they said at our office when i started producing a 3D model. They had a perception of 3D being time wasting and the Client wont pay for all the time it takes to produce it was based on previous experiences. So rather than tell them what i was doing, usual thing i ask is, what do you want and when do you want it? The boss is too busy to even try to understand the process and frankly most don't want to know. As long as it meets their time and budget constraints. So I learnt to do it efficiently and now we do the white 3d model as a matter of course.

Computer hardware. I have a gaming computer which did not cost a lot and to run the HDC VIVE i just need to upgrade my graphics card (See specs below) All runs well in Unity 3D.

Things are not rendered, its real-time motion Its a game engine. I did the original client walkthrough on a real old PC and VW 2008 and ran smoothly. I need to familiarise myself with unity again and play. For me its a hobby and i make a living out of my hobby.

Min Specs.jpg

What i have.jpg

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How easy is it to import the 3ds model and get up and running in unity? I've done a few experiments with Sketchfab (I think I mentioned elsewhere on the forum) which was easy, so may give  unity a go to compare.

 

Maybe a slight aside but I can't help but compare all the vr stuff to mincraft;....my 11 y/o daughter builds things so quickly on it, ok, graphics are basic , not exactly construction detail, but it's very immediate and intuitive, it gives you a feel for form and space, internal lighting is 'atmospheric' but does the job, and as far as she's concerned, it's a 'reality' of sorts. And all this on a 10 year old laptop, no mouse, and on a piece of software that cost under £20!  Ok, so not about to replace vw with minecraft, but food for thought!

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@MRD Mark RidgewellHi, I am certainly mot about to change from Vectorworks anytime soon, but in the intrim while VW get the VR capabilities and the webview fine tuned this is a solution that I will play with.

The difference with VW & Unity from my NOOB knowledge is that Unity is based on a gaming engine (Base program) so you are actually a person within the environment of a game. The models from VW are merely placed as objects into the game, swapped in and out parts turned off and on as desired. you have so much control over the interaction of the user, You  have on-collision (do something) so as the player (Client) walks through an area you can have the lights turn on and off as they leave, doors open as they approach.  walk into a glass lift and select up or down and view the surroundings as you travel.

The site model from VW when imported the user can traverse all the model. as you walk the character follows the terrain., no pushing up or down. you can jump into the pool from the top balcony.

 

So i am not sure how far VW will push the 3d VR experience but only time will tell, but for me its an experience that gets the client so enthused about their design they are hooked. How many times have you presented in hard copy drawings and you can see that someone doesn't really understand the space. Now they can, the technology is here, lets do it. 

 

PS, how easy is it to import a drawing. Back then i simply exported the file as a 3ds and imported it directly into Unity. you they set up your player, it took a bit to learn Unity well but there a heaps of tutorials and the lets get started shows you the interface which is a great start.

Will get back and learn it again and keep you posted. 

 

@JimWHi, certainly not advocating moving away from VW, for me its simply an intrim measure to gauge Client responce to the experience. Will always use VW, too old to change now and will promote VW wherever possible. (Though i should elay any concerns you may have because i am promoting another product. But its not a competitor)

Regards Alan

Edited by Alan Woodwell
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Following on I found the game file where I exported the VW model including the terrain model. This shows how easy it is to navigate around. This was a base model without materials.

The reason I am bringing this up is to show things that i would like to see implemented with VW walkaround and this will flow onto VR.

This was made back in 2012 with VW 2008 and a very early version of Unity.

See video;

https://youtu.be/11kL8NwMYUs

 

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Why not using FBX ?

For me currently the best export into 3D Apps.

Beside alle Extrudes and Derivates in PIOs having one Face flipped,

all Faces have correct face orientation, every CAD Part is correctly welded

and opposed to DXF I have no missing Faces in PIOs like Windows because

some Fills were missing in geometry.

Also Materials, its Assignments and Scale.

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@andrew Davis Hi thanks for this. this is pretty amazing, I think this all came from the pokamon game that was the rage recently. What more do you know about it? software to produce this etc.

Thanks for sharing this.:) More please. So much to learn.

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  • 2 weeks later...

@zoomerHi, the FBX export from VW and import worked a treat as it brought in all the model and materials. See attached, The issue of Normals is still an issue. Any 3D objects have normals facing out from any angle you look at them. But walls, roof, slabs etc all are viewed from one side only. See roof from above and roof from below.

 

Is this to do with parametric objects???? of have i totally misunderstood the issue as am not really fully understanding the issues just guessing.

Can VW export things better or am i missing a step here. thanks for any input.

 

Capture.JPG

Roof.jpg

Edited by Alan Woodwell
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@Alan Woodwell

for me,exported into Modo or C4D,

most PIOs like walls, doors, windows work fine. Faces are correctly aligned.

Also all Meshes and Generic Solids.

It is just Extrudes in general, which have 1 face flipped.

And therefore also all extrude derivates used in stairs, slabs

and potentially roofs (?)

 

Your Geometry looks a bit like a DXF attempt where all faces are flipped.

Not sure why.

 

There are problems in DXF, like parts of windows where some faces

are missing, because some faces had no fill applied.

You can check this if you ungroup such a PIO.

Same happened for me for slabs.

Only the edges of missing faces come in as 2D lines.

 

By C4D and FBX I normally have no missing faces, just these problems

with some flipped faces as I wrote above.

You can repair these in a 3D App like modo reasonably easy.

Not sure if there are those mesh clean up, weld and align tools in a game engine.

 

 

Also FBX brings your lights, cameras and materials.

Theoretically. Normally I do them from scratch in the target App.

Edited by zoomer
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@ZenoThanks for sharing this. This is where I want to be NOW! I am impatient, This is how i saw my apartment at the display suite, the added extra was i was able to open and close doors and pick up things. This was mildly interactive, but i know with a gaming engine like Unity it can be fully interactive. You have triggers that start an event, turn on lights, look at security cameras and see whats outside.

I am NOT promoting Unity here, merely trying to prompt VW in this direction in developing the Webview, or any next thing that we can use.

  

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@JimWI am NOT promoting Unity here, merely trying to prompt VW in this direction in developing the Webview, or any next thing that we can use. You can tell me to not discuss this here and i wont be offended. 

This is where I want to be NOW! I am impatient, the Video Zeno shared is how i saw my apartment at the display suite, the added extra was i was able to open and close doors and pick up things. This was mildly interactive, but i know with a gaming engine like Unity it can be fully interactive. You have triggers that start an event, turn on lights, look at security cameras and see whats outside.

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  • Vectorworks, Inc Employee
14 hours ago, Alan Woodwell said:

I am NOT promoting Unity here, merely trying to prompt VW in this direction in developing the Webview, or any next thing that we can use. You can tell me to not discuss this here and i wont be offended. 


This discussion is perfectly fine, no worries at all. I want people showing examples of what they want and what they currently have to do to get it.

(If you start offering discount passport photos I'll sing a different tune ;) )

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  • 4 months later...

Hi all, So further to this topic i would love to talk to anyone who is toying with exporting VW files as ,fbx or ,obj and importing them int Unity.

I gave myself a Xmas present of a HTC Vive. Using Steam VR plugin with Unity I have imported a VW file via .FBX format and runs well in Vive VR goggles and can walk around.

Issue still arises with he single sided normals from the plugins, solids are not a problem.

So any discussions would be great,

Such amazing technology and the immersion into a design in VR is absolutely amazing.

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