Horst M. Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 Hallo I'm quite often running in a pretty anoying display issue with VW 2017 when I group 3D objects or create a Symbol, the geometry sometimes becomes inviesible. Snaping and markers still appear. This happens in wireframe and within groups or Symbols. The effect is worse, because it happens more often, within Symbols. SInce updating to SP1 I have the impression that this happens more often. It is almost impossible to edit 3D parts of Symbols. :-( I cant find any reason, workflow or action that causes this, nor does it seem to be related to fIlesize or complexity of geometry. The only way I found to get the objects back on screen is to restart VW. Anybody else seeing this? I couldn't find another thread with this kind of problem best Horst Quote Link to comment
0 zoomer Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 (edited) First you should try a lower OpenGL setting for more compatibility in VW Preferences > Display > at the bottom. The middle mode works reasonably well for me. I would prefer the snapping markers over geometry visibility I see the objects but often no snap marker or snaps at all when in a Sub Object Edit Mode. And yes, I didn't look into Symbols so far, that worked for me in the past. It seems it got worse with 2017 when in Extrude Edit Mode, but things like Slab Edit Mode never showed surrounding geometry for me ever in any VW release. Edited November 2, 2016 by zoomer Quote Link to comment
0 Bas Vellekoop Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 yes i'm seeing this as well. It happens in a file from vw16, editing it in vw17 Tommorow morning i will post some images. Rrtendering opengl or wireframe resolves the problem for a few minutes. Quote Link to comment
0 Pat Stanford Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 This is often a class visibility issue. In order for an object to be visible, the class of the object and the class or any "container" object (groups, symbols, Plug-ins) need to be visible. So if you have an object in Class-A that is inside a group that is assigned Class-B, you will only see the object if BOTH Class-A and Class-B are set to be visible. I normally recommend that "container" objects be left in the None class and that the None class always be left visible. I have seen numerous cases where a user tried to set the Class Visibility to Active Only and then scrolled through the classes and could not find the object they were looking for. Another time this often comes into play is when you have Viewports or Saved views and then create new classes afterward. The default is that these "new" classes will be invisible in the existing Viewports and Views. If you have a Saved View that changes visibilities, it will make the objects disappear each time you activate the view until you edit the Saved view. Quote Link to comment
0 Horst M. Posted November 2, 2016 Author Share Posted November 2, 2016 (edited) thx pat, but that's not the point. is happening in groups and symbols, when i try to edit the geometry within. In one moment its visible and i can work on it, and a click later (and its not a click on Class visibilty ;-) the Objects are invisible. I can select the objects and I see the markers and the orange selection frame but not the geometry. I fought with this last night in a new file with just 4 classes, one design layer and all was set to visible . changing the the render from wireframe to opengl and back brings it sometimes back for a while like bas writes. Edited November 2, 2016 by Horst M. Quote Link to comment
0 Andy Broomell Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 (edited) You're not the only one, Horst. There have been a few other posts recently with people (such as myself) experiencing the same thing in 2017. It's a major issue and hopefully adding your post to the list helps make it clear that it's definitely a bug and not just a fluke or ignorance. Edited November 2, 2016 by Andy Broomell Quote Link to comment
0 Vectorworks, Inc Employee PVA - Admin Posted November 3, 2016 Vectorworks, Inc Employee Share Posted November 3, 2016 It's happening all over the place. This week is a bit nuts here but next week I plan to round up all the various threads and separate bug submits and create a cohesive mega bug report about it. It is easily the most widespread issue in 2017 from what I have seen and I have it pegged as my next mini-crusade-thing. SOME users have had luck by going to Tools > Options > Vectorworks Preferences > Display and changing the Navigation Graphics option to Best Compatibility, but this is not by any means a surefire fix. Quote Link to comment
0 Horst M. Posted November 3, 2016 Author Share Posted November 3, 2016 Hallo I've changed the DIsplay-Prefs as suggested, and for a first test it's working. It didn't happen during the last hour with the File that was almost impossible to edit. Thanks. Quote Link to comment
0 Bas Vellekoop Posted November 3, 2016 Share Posted November 3, 2016 @JimWthanks for looking into it. Can I help by sending the file that doesn't work properly? Quote Link to comment
0 Vectorworks, Inc Employee PVA - Admin Posted November 3, 2016 Vectorworks, Inc Employee Share Posted November 3, 2016 3 hours ago, Bas Vellekoop said: @JimWthanks for looking into it. Can I help by sending the file that doesn't work properly? That and this from your machine please, it isn't looking to be a file specific issue but it will still make the report clearer: http://kbase.vectorworks.net/questions/627/DirectX+Diagnostics+and+System+Profiler Quote Link to comment
0 Bas Vellekoop Posted November 3, 2016 Share Posted November 3, 2016 @JimW Send a pm with the info Quote Link to comment
0 markdd Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 I had this yesterday with a Light object in a symbol. (Display Light objects was turned on). I Couldn't see the Light object but could snap to it and all the grips were available etc... By toggling the "Show Other Objects in Edit" modes on and off again the Light object became visible. Mark Quote Link to comment
0 Horst M. Posted November 17, 2016 Author Share Posted November 17, 2016 a brief update. since I changed the Pref. Setting as suggested by Zoomer and Jim W. The "ivisible objets within groups" problem didn't happen again. The only negative point of the setting that I realised, is, that the spacenavigator is no longer moving the model in the Camera view live. VW shows just the moving ofthe axis and when I stop operating the Spaceanavigator the Model snaps to the axis. When I first saw that I tought it's a problem with the Spacenavigator driver/setup. but its not. And I have the impression, that open GL render time is a bit longer. Quote Link to comment
0 zoomer Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 I think there are indeed some strange things happening. Yesterday my geometry often disappeared when I changed Objects in groups to Symbols and left the group editing mode. It already disappeared while being in the Group. There wasn't any Class/Layer visibility setting problem. But geometry only re-appeared after going in and out of Symbol 3D editing Mode. Maybe because I allowed myself to go from lowest Best Compatibility Mode in OpenGL up to the middle setting (?) Quote Link to comment
0 NakulShah Posted January 11, 2017 Share Posted January 11, 2017 (edited) On 11/2/2016 at 9:30 PM, Horst M. said: Hallo I'm quite often running in a pretty anoying display issue with VW 2017 when I group 3D objects or create a Symbol, the geometry sometimes becomes inviesible. Snaping and markers still appear. This happens in wireframe and within groups or Symbols. The effect is worse, because it happens more often, within Symbols. SInce updating to SP1 I have the impression that this happens more often. It is almost impossible to edit 3D parts of Symbols. :-( I cant find any reason, workflow or action that causes this, nor does it seem to be related to fIlesize or complexity of geometry. The only way I found to get the objects back on screen is to restart VW. Anybody else seeing this? I couldn't find another thread with this kind of problem best Horst Hi, I have had the exact same issue as you. Grouping symbols, turns them invisible, even though the object can be snapped onto and the cube appears around it. Classes and layers are visible, but this still happens. I believe this to be an issue with the software v2017 itself, and has not been resolved as of yet. What I have found that works to make them all visible again, is to ungroup the grouped symbols, and then undo your action, using the undo command. This hasnt failed me yet! Another thing i have realised (has been mentioned before) is to enter the group, and enter the symbol edit window, and then exit. This makes the symbol visible again, but only that symbol. other symbols will still be invisible. PS. lowering the resolution doesn't work. My workplace doesn't have the most powerful computers, so I have to always work in the lowest res, and i've had this issue since upgrading to v2017. Edited January 11, 2017 by NakulShah Extra Information Added Quote Link to comment
0 JimDenaultASC Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 (edited) I had a similar problem with a file I was re-opening from VW2014–no Open GL or Wireframe 3D images, only control points on objects that were selected in Top/Plan. After a lot of restarting and preference changing, I finally was able to get 3D images to render by switching to View>Rendering>Fast Renderworks. After that, images would stay rendered in Open GL. Edited January 24, 2017 by JimDenaultASC Quote Link to comment
0 Bernard E Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 On 1/11/2017 at 10:20 AM, NakulShah said: Hi, I have had the exact same issue as you. Grouping symbols, turns them invisible, even though the object can be snapped onto and the cube appears around it. Classes and layers are visible, but this still happens. I believe this to be an issue with the software v2017 itself, and has not been resolved as of yet. What I have found that works to make them all visible again, is to ungroup the grouped symbols, and then undo your action, using the undo command. This hasnt failed me yet! Another thing i have realised (has been mentioned before) is to enter the group, and enter the symbol edit window, and then exit. This makes the symbol visible again, but only that symbol. other symbols will still be invisible. PS. lowering the resolution doesn't work. My workplace doesn't have the most powerful computers, so I have to always work in the lowest res, and i've had this issue since upgrading to v2017. Same issue for me. My file was initially created in VW2016 but the symbols were made in 2017. Changing display preferences doesn't work for me. Just submitted support request with the file.. for now I can't group symbols, which is pretty major problem.. Quote Link to comment
0 NICKY WAYLO Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 Make sure a clip cube is not in effect as this may cause geometry inside an object to become invisible. Quote Link to comment
0 shamika881 Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 Is there another solution for this apart from display performance? I'm having the same issue in my vectorworks 2019 for mac OS catalina Quote Link to comment
0 DFlores Posted September 17, 2021 Share Posted September 17, 2021 Easy solution that works for me... Go to the pull down menu: Tools > Options > Vectorworks Preferences Then select Display and check the box -Show other objects while in editing modes Best regards, Quote Link to comment
0 EliM Posted December 20, 2023 Share Posted December 20, 2023 @Pat Stanford Hi Pat, hoping to lean on your expertise if you have the time to advise... In regards to your recommendation to put objects within a group in the classes that you want them to be in and then the group itself in the none class, I've noticed something strange: When I class off the objects within the group but leave the none class on, I can't see the objects but I can still select them. This is annoying because it means that I will sometimes inadvertently select them. Stranger still, if these grouped objects are in the screen plane, they are still selectable (but invisible) even in unified view (see screenshot). Is there a best practice I could be following to be able to xturn those grouped objects fully off. (To give you a concrete example, I like to group screen plan annotations in my plan, but then those annotations, while invisible, are "in the way" when I'm trying to select things in my 3d model.) Quote Link to comment
0 Pat Stanford Posted December 20, 2023 Share Posted December 20, 2023 An alternative workflow that might be better for you is to use a specific class instead of None for the groups of annotations. You could then turn them completely off by turning off that class. Or if all the objects in the group are the same class, just use that class instead. The trick is that both the Container (group) and the Contained (annotations) BOTH have to be set to Visible to be able to see them. Quote Link to comment
0 EliM Posted December 21, 2023 Share Posted December 21, 2023 I was wondering if possibly there was some setting I didn't know about that would change the behavior but you are absolutely right--I will alter the workflow as you describe and fix the problem that way. Thank you Pat! Quote Link to comment
Question
Horst M.
Hallo
I'm quite often running in a pretty anoying display issue with VW 2017
when I group 3D objects or create a Symbol, the geometry sometimes becomes inviesible.
Snaping and markers still appear.
This happens in wireframe and within groups or Symbols.
The effect is worse, because it happens more often, within Symbols.
SInce updating to SP1 I have the impression that this happens more often.
It is almost impossible to edit 3D parts of Symbols. :-(
I cant find any reason, workflow or action that causes this, nor does it seem to be related to fIlesize or complexity of geometry.
The only way I found to get the objects back on screen is to restart VW.
Anybody else seeing this?
I couldn't find another thread with this kind of problem
best Horst
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23 answers to this question
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