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Phil hunt

Vectorworks 2017

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but there are a lot of "strange" workarounds in the background of objects like Doors and Windows that have component classing to make things work, and it isnt guaranteed that something will break, but that it presents a high enough risk factor for it to be over a certain threshold.

Isn't the advantage of projection mappings that they ignore all possible UVs

or dependencies and overwrite everything as they happen from outside in the

renderer. The C4D engine dose not know if there is a window or door.

Just a mesh like any else that has applied that material.

Aren't those mapping dependancies in BIM objects related to hatches and those

things only in that case ?

I'ld be happy with cubic mapping only, even planar only.

But be able to edit U and V independently. In position, scale and rotation.

And no problem with adding that globally to the material only, like it is done now.

The need for a rotated version needs a material duplicate which has to be done

as it is also.

Nicer of course, similar to C4D, to be able to overwrite that on object or class base.

(C4D does by object only, which not cool at all, as you have to always select all

assignments when you need to edit them)

useful in Vectorworks alone without needing external software unless the user REALLY wants to take it elsewhere.

1.

this

and

2.

Just because of that Exchange.

Which does not work if things are not exactly the same type and settings

on both sides. So I wish to get the complete Material settings like Archicad

got and that there is no need redo mapping.

The typical synchronization problem when editing things on both sides.

It has to somehow work like VW multiuser project. Both connected and

checking parts out and lock them on the other side.

Currently,

if you do edits in C4D, which marks things edited to prevent them from

being overwritten, you loose synchronization for more and more parts as

more often you synchronize. If you do some class rearrangements in C4D

because it can't sort by name. Delete it later in VW but it will stay in C4D.

And it is not oversee able what will happen with geometry.

It is not a big problem to keep cameras, lighting and render settings separate.

Of course you need to change both manually in some cases.

And you can face the strange material and texture duplication and renaming

by an optimized class setup to bring it to an acceptable level.

But Geometry, Material, Class compatibility should be at a level that will allow

to do all these changes in VW only, to keep the update function over time.

Of course, if both would use the same synchronized file data base and it doesn't

matter where to edit things would be much cooler.

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I've played with a demo version of Archicad 20 over the last two days. VW on steroids!

Hmmh,

have not installed the App so far but watched the keynote video.

Can't get rid of the feeling that both VW and AC try to get exactly the same

feature set. Energy calculation in AC, VW brings Energos some years later,

Marionette in VW, AC 20 brings Grasshopper one year later, ....

While Marionette inside VW sounds to work well on the forums,

that real time AC-Rhino connection looks absolutely great when you can

use Rhino geometry in AC and even get BIM objects from it in AC.

I am most jealous about the optical work on their UI.

The german critics about AC was that they never updated their old wall tools

and still have no story levels. But I think I have to look in the App if that is

really worse. As I'm not quite happy with these in VW too.

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Hi Jim,

Do you know if the different sections (ie. symbols, hatches, textures etc.) in the new Resource Browser can be re-ordered? Right now they are alphabetical which isn't particularly intuitive. I wish that symbols and folders were always shown first....

Kevin

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Not the list of resource types next to the search bar no, but honestly I find myself leaving that at "All" and then using Search and not even thinking about the category, or when using the resource selector UI from the various tools more often, they auto-filter to the expected resource type so you don't need to keep navigating around it over and over.

It's kinda odd, so much work was done on the resource manager palette and actually a lot of that work was so that you don't even need to use most of it on a regular basis anymore, lol.

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Release of 2017 must not be too far away..... as I just noticed that VW YouTube channel has uploaded few new videos on rendering tips using 2017...! looks exciting... hoping to see the much discussed 2.0 version tools to aid us to design (or rather help us and clients to visualise our designs)...!

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@JIM: There once had been talked about not releasing yearly anymore, but releasing each feature when it was finished, so that VW would be more a continual updating program, which would benefit both the development team and the users, as users would have the chance to learn the new/improved tools in a timely manner, and not all at once, etc.... Are there still plans for this, as I would really love to see this, as I believe this will also open up the transparency to the users about the direction VW is going.

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There is still talk of it, but no official plans. For now it looks like the same cycle will stay for the main software package, though we do release Vision updates in a rolling release style rather than tying them to yearly versions.

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Release of 2017 must not be too far away.....

4 and a half weeks I would say.

(or rather help us and clients to visualise our designs)...!

I hope.

Meanwhile I played with that other family member's demo App.

And have to see that their built in RW :

Does not rename my materials or textures.

Has a 2 point or architectural perspective for cameras (that don't get corrupt)

Has the complete C4D material system so full compatibility and synchronization.

Brings geometry perfect (component walls !), with correct face orientation into C4D.

Has sharp lines in OpenGL.

Lets me render and save at a given pixel resolution.

Has all texture mapping options needed in architecture.

While for Architecture it gives me :

A global universal building material system with all data and rendering info.

(Thought I invented this here on the forums - too late)

A part connection system that works beautifully, by priorities, even between

vertical and horizontal Elements, so sections fit out of the box.

Generated 2D is synchronized, there isn't even any difference in which 2D/3D

mode you currently work and manipulate.

Architectural objects have unlimited settings for creation and final appearance.

And all in a functional, hierarchical and (now) beautiful interface.

Of course it doesn't allow to layout a book and those 2D things, landscape or spotlight

use and mass modeling isn't that intuitive.

But I see there quite some gap between that solution and my VW.

Hope 2017 will close most parts of that gap.

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as long as there are no slanted walls we'll always be handicapped when it comes to designing free-form buildings. we still can't impress anybody with it, and having it for floor plan generation from the free-form massing model would give us an enormous edge in modelling for macro bim, everything in one and the same software.

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Really looking forward to new version. the fascinating feature of VW is 'one-stop' design tool, which is the most attractive function to me.

Although, some basic functions still need to be fixed---personal preference.

For example,

Control XREF files class visibility from viewport,

or issue grey PDF files,

or Text Finding(the best one still is CAD-again, personal opinion)

and basic adjustment for images colour,stature...(PS function)-now in order to make my plan better, I have to use 5-10 same images but different statures/color.

I mean, all these functions would change VW a lot, but they are powerful functions to my daily work, making my life really easy.

Really hope VW can inherit these advantages from other programs, and also develop the feature itself.

Thanks

Edited by aozhouyyq1982

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Will VW 2017 be macOS 10.12 Sierra ready ?

Depends if we get their release build soon enough, but most likely that will come in SP1, it's been that way a few years now. I have not had time to test it personally yet this year, but from what I have heard 2016 does NOT run properly on the current MacOS 10.12 beta however, so I do not recommend it on any production machines for the time being.

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Each year this happens, I always wonder why the release of Vectorworks is not pushed back by six months so that it is off-cycle from the new OS X release.

I don't know if Windows releases updates on a set calendar schedule, but since OS X updates do seem to have a set schedule (mid-September to mid-October), this insistence on releasing Vw in mid-September baffles me. I imagine it makes things more difficult on engineering as well.

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Well ORIGINALLY Apple's OS schedule wasn't so rigid when we established our cycle. However in the past few years they've become very reliable.

This whole schedule was explained to me by accounting here, when I asked something similar; Apparently it boils down to how our release rolls out globally. For instance, we want to release in the US just before the fourth quarter (When companies are going to be spending their budgets as fast as possible), a few other financial events in between but the other major one so that we release in Japan right near a similar point in their fiscal year, which I believe starts in April.

Effectively, the bureaucratic/financial benefits of keeping it in September outweigh the technological issues that arise keeping it in September. I am not saying I fully understand the intricacies of their decisions, but they were able to satisfy my concerns that our release date was not just blindly picked regardless of the tech industry repercussions.

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Thanks JimW for the info, I figured that was probably the reason.

It also helps explain why I never install a new version of Vectorworks until the release of SP1. (I also wait to install a new OS version until at least the first .X update)

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Will VW 2017 be macOS 10.12 Sierra ready ?

Depends if we get their release build soon enough, but most likely that will come in SP1, it's been that way a few years now. I have not had time to test it personally yet this year, but from what I have heard 2016 does NOT run properly on the current MacOS 10.12 beta however, so I do not recommend it on any production machines for the time being.

Ah, ok.

Forgot that could influence 2016 too.

Nevertheless,

as an early adopter I couldn't hold myself from OS X updating more than 2 days

after release. I rather risk a VW pause :)

That worked ok the last years beside some smaller things.

No guarantee of course.

Each year this happens, I always wonder why the release of Vectorworks is not pushed back by six months so that it is off-cycle from the new OS X release.

That would not work with the year number in the name.

Now one would buy an outdated VW.

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i'm also an early adopter, but there is a rule of thumb: never update/upgrade the software during the project. sometimes it can be highly advisable.

Edited by gester

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I very much agree with delaying a file upgrade until after a project is over, or only starting out with a new software version after it gets its first patch. These are both extremely sound practices and I encourage them fully. My thanks to everyone here who promotes the same.

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That makes much sense.

But users don't.

For me,

as soon as the new version is downloaded there will be a project copy opened.

They stay beside each other until it works. Sometimes I even keep both versions

in sync for months.

;)

Some projects started in the VW 2014 area,

I don't want to work in VW 2014 anymore.

And there was often a lot of work to do to to bring older projects in a new VW version.

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I very much agree with delaying a file upgrade until after a project is over, or only starting out with a new software version after it gets its first patch. These are both extremely sound practices and I encourage them fully. My thanks to everyone here who promotes the same.

I am a fan of delaying until SP1 before deploying, but not upgrading an existing project is just not feasible. We have 30+ active projects and it is a logistical quagmire to try and run dual versions of the software. If you are strict about not upgrading existing projects, considering that projects can take multiple years to complete, you are actually talking about running 3 versions of the software at the same time - just a nightmare.

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I mean if it isn't possible it isn't possible. The advice is mainly for when you CAN wrap up a project in 3-6 months in an older version while starting new ones in the new version. It is of course specific to each shop, but where possible it's wise.

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It is wise and professional to keep projects in their original software version and

it is wise to not even use a software or OS before SP2.

But less thrilling and emotional.

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There's a big difference between a new version of a program and a new version of the file format. Doing a VW 2017 without changing the file format would be more like a service pack, even if it requires loading a whole new executable file and associated utilities and resources. Doing a VW 2017 with a new file format, the usual practice, requires that we convert all files with previous formats if we want to work on that project in the new version. I have requested that file formats change only every 3 years, so we don't have this kind of problem. There are a lot of technical reasons this is difficult, particularly if the new version requires new object types. But new features don't always require new object types, and planning to implement that kind of feature only every other or every third year seems like a reasonable way to bring more stability to the program and less hassle for users.

BTW, I have not noticed any issues with translating files to the new format in several years now. 2008 to 2009 was, if I recall, a big problem, but for the work I do conversion has become more problem-free.

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Jim - To pick your brain - what are the potential pitfalls of upgrading files to the new version? Are there certain upgrades that are more dangerous than others? Certain objects that are more likely to get corrupted?

You provide such a nice upgrading tool, I had no idea that the party line was to NOT upgrade existing projects.

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The logic is mainly this, same rule as when working with printers:

"Is it working just fine? Then don't mess with it."

However, this attitude comes mostly from over-concern about encountering issues. It's been a pretty long time since we had wide ranging file upgrade problems, I think as mentioned earlier the last really problematic transition was between 2008 and 2010, where we introduced a new solids modeling engine that had to recalculate all the 3D solids geometry within a file and in some cases, wouldn't allow impossible (self-intersecting) geometry like the old engine did, which led to alteration of user's files in an invasive manner.

Eventually, and I know the first portion of this comes in 2017 but won't majorly affect users for another version or two, our file format rework will be complete and we won't need to have a new VWX version for each year. We will be able to only upgrade the format once every 4-5 years or only as needed. This will eventually mean that you won't need to export back to older versions within a range, only if the format handling was different. This isn't just important for version compatibility, but will also let us add the ability for multiple users to work with the same project concurrently, add automatic compression, as well as other things like that.

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