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Andrew Davies

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Once tried 1:1 but there were problems that made it unusable - unfortunately forgot what they exactly were.

 

I think I am 1:50 or maybe 1:100 with my Layers.

Navigation speed feels ok for me, I even set it higher to 25% now.

 

But often when I switch back to Enterprise after some time navigating with temporary flyover tool,

my model flips over, top to bottom.

 

And somehow, Enterprise feels much smoother and more natural in Modo.

Maybe because of the rotation origin ?

(in C4D feels a bit strange and rough too)

Edited by zoomer

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All my design layers are always 1:1. Never understood why you'd want them at anything other than 1:1 to be honest! (But that's a whole different discussion)

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I think the problem was when switching between Sheet Layers and Construction Layers.

where you always had to zoom in or out. And maybe some other things.

(Annotations and Dimensions on construction Layers ?)

 

I agree, I see absolutely no meaning in scaled construction Layers in 3D.

 

Will try again.

Edited by zoomer

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As mentioned on the other thread, it can be useful to preview line thicknesses/hatch fills etc whilst editing 2D linework that will usually be printed at a certain scale eg 1:50.

Setting to 1:1 removes this.

Again as mentioned on the other thread some kind of "preview at 1:xxx" option whilst in 2D mode would deal with this. I made a wishlist item.

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On 28/03/2017 at 7:53 PM, line-weight said:

The only time I have been using the "switch navigation" button up till now is to get back into helicopter mode when VW throws me into some other mode unexpectedly, which is annoying. Going to see if that bad habit has disappeared with these latest updates.

 

^ unfortunately this still seems to be happening. Often when I activate a saved view I seem to have exited Helicopter mode and been put in some other mode.

 

Am I doing something wrong or is this a bug? Or is there some way to set a certain mode as default?

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20 hours ago, JimW said:

In related news:
 

 

Hi

 

Should we "install plugs ins" once the driver is installed (from the 3Dconnexion preference pane).  What does that do?  Is it necessary?

 

 

Screen Shot 2017-03-30 at 12.26.41.png

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1 hour ago, Andrew Davies said:

Should we "install plugs ins" once the driver is installed (from the 3Dconnexion preference pane).  What does that do?  Is it necessary?


I don't believe so as far as Vectorworks is concerned, I tried it both with and without them and it behaved the same, but the support site recommends doing so. I'll add it to the instructions, it certainly doesn't seem to be detrimental. I'm fairly certain we included our version of a 3DConnexion plugin in 2017 sp3.

 

17 hours ago, line-weight said:

 

^ unfortunately this still seems to be happening. Often when I activate a saved view I seem to have exited Helicopter mode and been put in some other mode.

 

Am I doing something wrong or is this a bug? Or is there some way to set a certain mode as default?


Are your saved views Orthogonal or a Perspective? It does seem to default back to rotational view when in ortho. When doing raw 3D work I stay almost exclusively in perspective. 

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21 minutes ago, JimW said:

Are your saved views Orthogonal or a Perspective? It does seem to default back to rotational view when in ortho. When doing raw 3D work I stay almost exclusively in perspective. 

 

Yes, I do everything different than anybody else ;)

 

I normally use orthagonal mode Isometrics only.

(As it is more predictive when navigating than any perspective use,

I think the View Angle/Focal Length is not fixed (?) and everything gets highly distorted easily)

 

And want to use Flyover only

(to not get ill and motion sick)

 

 

And I think in the past, Perspective was defaulted to Flyover, and Isometrics switched back to

Walkthrough.

So in my case that meant to every time switch back to Flyover with "Menu" Button after

I changed my View Mode.

 

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I was having a similar discussion with some of my colleagues over here about modeling on isometric or perspective and we got to the conclusion that when modeling small objects isometrics is the way to go but for larger projects like architectural projects and sites perspective makes more sense. Now, if someone is looking over our shoulder and need some type of report on progress then perspective seems to be normal for none graphical clients. After all, life around us is always in perspective.  So, I guess we'll all choose what makes us comfortable as long as we get the job done right?

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It is funny,

because in all other 3D Apps - I AM ALWAYS in Perspective Mode and it works great.

 

Don't know exactly what the problem was or is for me in VW

(It is not Dolly or the Focal Length)

Maybe because I can't stand Perspective Mode for Top, Front and Side Views,

which VW insists that have to be 3D Views and use same 3D Render Mode - which I strongly disagree.

 

 

And current Walkthrough Only,

can't be fully converted to Flyover Mode, by just flipping the Axes as I did.

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1 hour ago, JimW said:

Are your saved views Orthogonal or a Perspective? It does seem to default back to rotational view when in ortho. When doing raw 3D work I stay almost exclusively in perspective. 

 

All saved "3d" views are in perspective rather than isometric and these are what I use most.

 

I do sometimes switch into "flat" orthogonal views (eg front or top) and into top/plan.

 

As far as I can tell it's usually when switching from these back to a perspective saved view that I get thrown into a navigation mode that is not what I want (ie. I want helicopter, always).

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22 minutes ago, zoomer said:

Maybe because I can't stand Perspective Mode for Top, Front and Side Views,

which VW insists that have to be 3D Views and use same 3D Render Mode - which I strongly disagree.

 

I think I agree with you here...pressing the "f" or "r" buttons on the 3dC device is a nice shortcut except it gives me a front view in perspective - pointless - so I end up doing a cmd-5 shortcut to top/plan to get rid of the perspective before pressing the "f" button.

 

The "f" button should put me straight into an orthogonal front view. Perhaps even a wireframe one too. Would be good if this could be user-configurable if not the default.

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That is why I always criticized the current implementation of the Perspective/Rendermode preselection

from the beginning. Currently there is 1 Setting only for 2 groups of views, Top Plan and the Rest.

 

If I could (2 groups), I would 99,9 % of time :

 

Top Plan (as it is) :

View Mode : Orthogonal (never ever Perspective)

Render Mode : Pseudo Section/Plan Mode

Enterprise : 2D only Pan+Zoom

 

Set Front, Back, Top, Bottom, Left, Right :

View Mode : Orthogonal

Render Mode : Wireframe

Enterprise : 2D only Pan+Zoom

 

Set Isometrics :

View Mode : Perspective

Render Mode : OpenGL

Enterprise : 3D Flyover

Edited by zoomer

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zoomer -

 

Agreed (except I'd have "helicopter" instead of "flyover" for the last one)

Edited by line-weight

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1 hour ago, line-weight said:

 

The "f" button should put me straight into an orthogonal front view. Perhaps even a wireframe one too. Would be good if this could be user-configurable if not the default.

I'm not in front of my Mac now but I am sure you can change this for a keystroke in 3DConnexion preferences

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It seems like it invokes the command in Vectorworks for "Front" view, and then obeys the default projection setting. I agree that when using a device like this a different behavior would be desired. I'm going to eat dogfood with my basic SpaceNavigator for awhile (nerd term for using this specific thing a bunch personally) for my next few projects and get a clear picture of what can be customized via a combination of device and Vectorworks settings and what we need to add more control for.

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18 minutes ago, Andrew Davies said:

I'm not in front of my Mac now but I am sure you can change this for a keystroke in 3DConnexion preferences

 

Yes, but as far as I know there's no keystroke for standard views (except cmd-5 for top/plan) and no keystrokes for projection types either. Let alone a keystroke that will set view *and* projection.

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In the configuration settings, some of the options for the radial menus (Im using the radial menus since my device only has the two buttons and two radial menus gives me the most additional possible options) are linked directly to these commands, so you dont need to daisy chain them to a shortcut key:

58dd2e6b8f89f_ScreenShot2017-03-30at12_11_20PM.png.a9d1597cd3804054c28076c7c4817ab8.png

This doesn't solve the projection AND the view, just the view using whatever the default projection is set to.

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25 minutes ago, JimW said:



This doesn't solve the projection AND the view, just the view using whatever the default projection is set to.

 

Default projection is not something that's user-configurable, is that right?

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That you can set both in QuickPrefs as well as Tools > Options > Vectorworks Preferences > Display but Saved View projections will override this default projection if you change views that way rather than using the Standard Views.

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1 hour ago, JimW said:

That you can set both in QuickPrefs as well as Tools > Options > Vectorworks Preferences > Display but Saved View projections will override this default projection if you change views that way rather than using the Standard Views.

Hm, that lets me set what happens when I go from top/plan to a 3d view... but not what happens when I switch from perspective to one of the pre-assigned "top" "front" views on the 3DC.

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That's different behavior than I'm seeing, to confirm, whats the whole name of the device you're using? Theres a chance they may behave different and I can go grab a test model of the same type you have.

Im used the Wired SpaceNavigator.

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4 hours ago, line-weight said:

zoomer -

 

Agreed (except I'd have "helicopter" instead of "flyover" for the last one)

 

I think everyone beside me loves Helicopter.

I don't want that it will be taken away,

just that we can choose (permanently)

 

 

The Enterprise View buttons do nothing else than the Numblock numbers do.

Before latest VW App settings in Enterprise, I mapped them manually by using the

NumBlock Numbers.

If you are in a Perspective Iso and tap Front, it is like pressing Num+2,

you enter in a "Front Perspective".

 

While Top Plan View has its special illustration Style and abilities,

alle vertical orthogonal Views aren't able to do anything.

No Sections, clipping planes, hard to work with 2D geometry, ....

You just use them in orthogonal wireframe to check some objects heights.

If these vertical Views are in Perspective Mode or OpenGL Mode, they even can't do this.

Therefore I renounce of Perspective Mode everywhere, even in pure 3D or Isometrics.

 

But I understand that people, in rare cases will want to see every View other than Top Plan

as a 3D View (even perspective and shaded mode) - and maybe use these as a start View

for 3D navigation.

Edited by zoomer

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3 hours ago, JimW said:

That's different behavior than I'm seeing, to confirm, whats the whole name of the device you're using? Theres a chance they may behave different and I can go grab a test model of the same type you have.

Im used the Wired SpaceNavigator.

 

Wired Spacemouse Pro.

 

I'm not quite clear where the different behaviour you're seeing is though... the limitation seems to be in the settings available in VW prefs, rather than to do with the device?

 

If I'm in a perspective view, and I press the "F" button on the spacemouse I get a front view but perspective projection. I don't see what settings I could change in prefs to make this come up as an othogonal projection instead.

 

Basically what happens when I press that F button is the same as what happens if I select "front" from the views dropdown.

 

 

Edited by line-weight

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