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jay_rhp

UNICLASS 2015

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The deadline for BIM level 2 is coming fast!

Some of you won't care, and some of you will. I for one, do.

Whilst I understand Uniclass 2015's purpose, what i don't fully understand is the most effective way to integrate it into Vectorworks.

It seems to me, that our own easily navigated classes are being pushed out of the boat and replaced with a string of numbers. This would be all very well if there were only 100 variants of this new class system but the fact is there are 1000's of different classes now published by the NBS that define what an object is.

So while the class i would choose for a door is....Door

NBS have called it Ss-25-30-20-30 this allows computers and us (apparently) to know that any object with this string of numbers as the class means its a "Frame and door leaf system"

My question is, can this new coding not be embedded into objects without us having to look at it?

My door class can then remain as Door and when i make a door I can add in the NBS code somewhere within the actual door itself, just like you can with U-values.

If Not,

Can I still have my class as Door but just add the code after the word to make it easier to navigate, like this:

Door_Ss-25-30-20-30

will this still work as a uni-class?

Please help!

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I found this PDF titled New BIM Templates in Vectorworks 2015 which might be somewhat relevant to your question, even though it is now one product version update old.

It says that:

There are three different “flavors” of BIM template: Imperial, Metric and UK Metric (which is organized according to the UniClass naming system and provides UK National Building Library wall and slab styles.)

Not sure what version of Uniclass the BIM templates in Vw2015 are based on.

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@rdesign

i know this paper (actually a great description of the storeys' levels), but it's not about the classing system in general in vw. if you want to implement some national construction naming convention then you have to do it with a specific classing system.

to be frank the most clear one for me is the us-imperial system in vw (like 'wall-exterior-insulation' a.s.o.), but it contains no coding appearance whatsoever.

that's why the initial question in this thread is justified.

rob

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that's why the initial question in this thread is justified.

rob

I completely agree. This question absolutely needs to be answered for Vw users in the UK, especially since as the original poster noted, we are now weeks away from the UK government's April 2016 mandate requiring Level 2 BIM on centrally-procured public projects.

That Vw document was all I could find that addressed UK BIM standards, and admittedly it was lacking at best.

It appears that other BIM software packages (such as ArchiCAD) have a more robust implementation of Uniclass 2015 standards.

Maybe someone from Vw can chime in on how this is presently being addressed.

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i've thought about it once again, and i don't think that we should mess up with uniclass strings in the table entries' names.

imho way better would be to set up some user-friendly names for the classing system (like 'door-interior' or the likes) and to make either a button, or a pull-down menu in the class dialog to make a link to the proper uniclass name (which consists mostly of digits)...

what do you guys think?

rob

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Hello

I just return from Light &Building in Frankfurt and asked the manufacturers about BIM and IFC concerning their lighting products (like tracks) and fixtures. Not one has given suitable answer: “they are working on it”.

Before even getting to code numbers, I dream of IFC given by the manufacturers in their tech sheets. This would solve lots of future problems in BIM 2, one could use the BIM file or draw some similar objects and be sure the IFC is equal to the manufacturers one. Therefore export in IFC would be simple and not lotto concerning communication between the different users. At this time a light designer invents, picking up from what exists, at the end the project is loaded with useless IFC copying one another without being accurate.

The second step in vw is just a Marionette node dragging from an Excel or library file and added in the OIP to the design object.

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before ifc may be used as an ubiquitous communication format there should be:

1) a common language for the bom (building object models) parameters throughout the whole process, enabling passing the information from the designers to the builders and giving the feedback back to the computers and bim authoring tools

2) an understanding, that native formats are not a good way to give information on somebody's own work, because the working on the same model by everybody is not likely to come (copy rights, professional insurance, a base for liability waivers in case of ipd contracts, security to use the outcome for decades etc., let alone the freedom to use any software tool any party may choose)

frog, you've addresses the second issue, but we're dealing here with the first one.

besides, the germans seem to wait for the norms and standards first, then to use them in a qualified process.

rob

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Not sure what version of Uniclass the BIM templates in Vw2015 are based on.

It seems that when opening this BIM template on Vectorworks, they are still using Uniclass 1.4 or similar.

The NBS have and are in the process of publishing Uniclass 2015 which is uniclass 2's Successor, and after changing their mind 3 times already, uniclass 2015 seems to be the format of Uniclass that is going to dominate and stick around.

My question however still stands, how do we effectively use Uniclass?

I personally think it will be counter-productive if we change our templates to host Uniclass 2015. It will take far to long to control and navigate through our classes when they are named so confusingly.

Don't get me wrong, I am in total support of the BIM movement and Im keen to start utilising Uniclass 2015, I just feel that there must be a way to assign this classification to an object without having to change the way humans view it.

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The truth is there's really no reason to use Uniclass 2015 as a Class template with regard to IFC. There are other reasons, such as becoming knowledgeable with an industry standard classification system, new employees who may know the classification already and for outside parties who send your DWGs to.

If you don't want to use Uniclass 2015 as it is you could modify your own Class template to match its structure as closely as possible and then if you want to make the switch in the future it'll be as painless as possible.

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Currently there's no reason to use Uniclass 2015 as a Class template with regard to IFC. There are other reasons, such as becoming knowledgeable with an industry standard classification system, new employees who may know the classification already and for outside parties who send your DWGs to.

The incentive with regard to IFC will come when/if Vectorworks is able to add Classes to the IfcClassificationReference field of IFC exports.

If you don't want to use Uniclass 2015 as it is you could modify your own Class template to match its structure as closely as possible and then if you want to make the switch in the future it'll be as painless as possible.

Perhaps Im misinterpreting the whole BIM level 2 then?

As far as I was aware Uniclasses are a vital part of being BIM level 2 compliant. If I am wrong please correct me as Id love some feedback on my understandings of BIM level 2.

Also, again, correct me if I'm wrong but Vectorworks IS able to to add classes to the IFC classification reference field isn't it? There are 3 separate available fields for classification within the IFC data window.

I would be more than grateful for a response to this @christiaan as you seem to know what your talking about.

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(..)There are 3 separate available fields for classification within the IFC data window.(..)

you mean the psets for classification, classification 2 and 3? i think we have to specify the assignment much earlier, along with the classing system mapping.

and i don't agree that we don't need it. sooner or later the construction site will require the linking of the models and their parts to physical objects (that is, if the latter ones are a part of the classification system, too).

rob

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btw, the whole direction of 4d is going to use ifc entities for the process analysis (ifcworkschedule, ifcworktask, ifcrelsequence a.s.o.).

the 5d future is also connected with the likes of ifccostitem and ifccostschedule.

we will _have_ to use ifc for the construction processes...

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I must have removed that second paragraph while you were responding. Having discussed this a bit with Martyn Horne of CU Unlimited the ability to put the Class in the IFC classification field is probably not useful either, because Classes and classification aren't necessary the same thing. That is to say we generally want to organise our Classes at the element level (e.g. "Door") whereas classification is more at a specific product level (e.g. "Wooden Door")

Also, again, correct me if I'm wrong but Vectorworks IS able to to add classes to the IFC classification reference field isn't it? There are 3 separate available fields for classification within the IFC data window.

Yes you probably can, but what I was suggesting is the idea that VW could be made to populate those fields automatically with the VW Class. But as subsequently noted this is probably not useful.

Do your Classes need to be based on Uniclass 2015 to be Level 2 BIM compliant? No. To collaborate on Level 2 BIM projects with Vectorworks you'll be doing so largely through IFC models, and IFC models are independent of VW Classes.

You'll want to ensure any other data you collaborate with is Uniclass 2015 compliant though, such as your specifications.

I think we'll be switching from our long form Class template to Uniclass 2015 at some point, the main reason simply being to learn it inside out.

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you mean the psets for classification, classification 2 and 3? i think we have to specify the assignment much earlier, along with the classing system mapping

Yes Those classifications are empty and ready to be updated.

As I understand it then Christiaan, Uniclass 2015 is a classification rather than a class , and it would be in the IFC data tab that we can add the Uniclass Classifications?

Thus, we can continue using our own class names as, when we do export IFC objects, none of the native documents classes are exported anyway?

Edited by jay_rhp

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Just to make myself crystal clear,

Lets take a wall object as an example:

It is in my Vectorworks class named Building_Wall External.

(Now I want to start using Uniclass 2015 as it is a multi-discipline nationally recognised Classification system.)

I open my IFC tab on my 'object info' palette, tick 'Classification' and then add the uniclass code to the 'Classification Name' or Item reference as shown in the picture attached.

https://www.cloud.kendallkingscott.com/index.php/s/InUEKGtKqHBdwep

This Uniclass Classification will now be exported when i export an IFC model and will be recognised when imported by for example Revit.

Is this correct Christiaan?

Edited by jay_rhp

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i'd rather edit the mapping from the pull-down menu in the oip, the ifc pset value would be the result. but it's just my view, it'd be a question to the programmers.

from my perspective the architects are not willing to go too deep into the parameters, so the oip window would be a more obvious location.

rob

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I think it is important to note that the use of BS1192 class naming does extend to BIM.

In the CPix Post-Contract BEP, you will note, in section 5.4, it says:

"Each discipline should provide the Design Manager and the CAD manager with a full list of all layer names to be used on the project. This list should be published to all members of the project team for information.

Table 25 Layer naming convention

Discipline - Classification - Presentation - Description

e.g.

A-G23-M_Stairs

[using Uniclass 1.4, I should add]

Some software solutions suggest that layer names are not necessary but it has been found that the convention shall be used when sharing or exchanging information."

Whether you include this section in your BEP is of course up to you.

The work Martyn Horne and I have been doing as part of the AEC UK CAD and BIM Standards initiative, and in order to assist Vectorworks users, in Vectorworks 2015 and 2016 you will find Class Standards Libraries containing AEC UK CAD Standards classes. Object libraries for Walls, Slabs, Roofs, Doors and Windows using Uniclass 2015 could also be provided. Uniclass 1.4 could also be provided if that was of interest.

Anyone viewing an IFC file will note that 'layers' can be used for viewing

the model.

And, of course, you probably still export DWG...

Classes and other Library content should adopt BS1192 naming conventions.

The question of adding Uniclass classification to IFC fields, is separate, and should be done when creating your own content, in a similar fashion to inserting 'T-Sheet' or NBS references. Hopefully Vectorworks, Inc. will work on ways to make it easier to add information to IFC fields, and custom property sets in future releases.

Let us know if you have any (useful) comments on the content provided with Vectorworks, by the way.

Regards

Steven

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Hi All,

 

A resurrection for this topic, as we are just getting into BIM (Rapidly, as of course implementation was left to the last minute and now we are trying to deliver a project using it..).

 

Now that it is 2 years later and BIM is much more established, how have people been finding dealing with these classes? They look like a nightmare to me, and its slowing me down significantly. Any advice on the best way to deal with these would be greatly appreciated!

 

Also - any idea if there are plans for Vectorworks as a software to help us out a little more in dealing with these codes in the future?

 

A

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It slows us all down... Without a search function and I dont understand why the "Product" PR Uniclass section has been ommitted in VW  2018, as actually labelling components in walls etc, in order to create a BIM library is a pain, as you have to manually input the correct uniclass class! 

Edited by ptoner
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How are you finding using the classes now that you finally have filtering...?

 

In order to be 'BIM Ready', and to be able to claim compliance, you need to adopt some sort of recognised classificaton system and CAD Standard or wait for one to be imposed upon you (and the one most likely to be imposed in the UK will be Uniclass 2015...)

 

I am sure you will all be thrilled to know that we will be issuing fully BS compliant classes in the New Year.

 

So 'Walls' will be classes 'A-EF_25_10-M_Wall', which of course, if you have your filtering set up correctly will present no bigger a problem to you than search for any class with the word 'Wall' in it's name, or for that matter '-EF_' etc.

 

Also, in answer to the initial question, you should definitely embed the Uniclass code into your BIM objects.

 

If you are not already, you should be building content for the office that is fully classified, because if there is one thing I have learned applying various CAD standards since being told in 2002 to use the AEC UK CAD Standards, is that no-one bothers to look up the correct code when they create new content.  They need to be assisted with ratified office content libraries.

 

Takes time but it's worth the investment.

 

Of course, you could always employ the services of a Vectorworks BIM Manager...;-)

 

Regards

 

Steven Shorter

Architect and Vectorworks BIM Manager...

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