Normal File Size

[Amelia S]

Hey Guys.

Is 200 MB large for a VW file?

Thanks,

Amelia

27" iMac

3.4 gHz intel core i7

16 GB memory

VW 2015 sp4

Here's some background if you have time:

We work mainly on single family houses, but our files often get clunky as the design gets developed. We're getting into the habit of modelling everything in 3D - standing seam roofs (with seams modeled), a couple of VB visual trees, some mild custom trim work, a heliodon. Pretty simple I think. I purge the file once in a while.

Say we have a file that's got a site plan sheet, 2 floor plan sheets, 2 elevation sheets, 5 wall section viewports, 5 rendered viewports (mostly low quality white shaded renderings). Any reason viewport updates would get very significantly slower as the file is used over the course of a project?

This thing happens where VW seems to freeze immediately after you press update, the mouse thing spins, and 20 minutes later the viewport is updated, but you can't do anything in the meantime and sometimes it never finishes. It's just hard to figure out what's going on.

[rDesign]

This thing happens where VW seems to freeze immediately after you press update, the mouse thing spins, and 20 minutes later the viewport is updated, but you can't do anything in the meantime and sometimes it never finishes. It's just hard to figure out what's going on.

A 200mb file is not unheard of. I think mine are usually in the 100-150mb range. Having a lot of textures in the file and VB trees will definitely add to your filesize footprint.

I have not had my computer 'freeze up' for 20 minutes after updating a VP, that seems unusual to me. When I update one render SLVP in a 125mb file, it pauses for about 20 seconds where I can't use Vw ('Rendering' progress bar) but then the 'blue teapot' appears in the lower right corner of the window I can keep working while the render finishes in the background.

• Was this file started in an older version of Vw?
  
• Are the rendered VPs on a Sheet Layer or Design Layer? (Design Layer VPs render at very high resolution).
  
• If they're on a Sheet Layer, what is the DPI of the Sheet Layer? 144dpi should be sufficient.
  
• Does turning off the VB trees in your render VP make any difference?
  

[zoomer]

Having a lot of textures in the file and VB trees will definitely add to your filesize footprint.

Why does VW save texture images in the vwx File at all ???

Why not leave them where they are ?

(And why at all does it rename the images with the class name ?)

:crazy:

[AlanW]

The trees will usually increase the file size considerably, I always like to keep mine to below 100mb.

Purge to get rid of rubbish will help also.

By the way with images you have the option to import them of reference them so they are not in the file.

Edited September 4, 2015 by Alan Woodwell

[PVA - Admin]

200MB is not unusual for a file with many textures, but make sure you have Purged the file as suggested above and explained here:

http://kbase.vectorworks.net/questions/1224/Purging+Your+Document

Why does VW save texture images in the vwx File at all ???

Why not leave them where they are ?

We like to keep everything all in one file in order to make things simple to transfer. However you CAN reference resources if you like, it just adds a layer of complexity, but if it saves you significant space in your workflow then its worth the effort.

[michaelk]

Is 200 MB large for a VW file?

Not necessarily. I find 300 to 500 MB pretty common.

Your render times should be faster than that. In addition to rDesign's excellent suggestions, here are a couple of things I've found to keep VW snappy:

1. Don't use multiple extrude objects. Many times I've had a laggy file that got faster when all the multiple extrudes were changed other types of objects.

2. Don't use large mesh objects from other applications. It's much faster to rebuild mesh objects in native VW objects than it is to deal with the lag.

3. In the render settings for a viewport, make sure your detail isn't High or Very High. I keep it set at Low unless the model has a lot of curvy craziness.

4. Sweep objects with small segment angles cause longer render times. Crank those angles up as high as you can stand it. You can turn up the smoothing angle in the hidden line viewport to compensate.

hth

mk

[PVA - Admin]

This thing happens where VW seems to freeze immediately after you press update, the mouse thing spins, and 20 minutes later the viewport is updated, but you can't do anything in the meantime and sometimes it never finishes. It's just hard to figure out what's going on.

Shaded Polygon and the other shaded render modes are REALLY slow recently, I haven't tracked it down but they seem to have gotten significantly slower than it should be. How long does it take in Fast Renderworks and Final Quality Renderworks?

[Andy Broomell]

Another thing that may be affecting file size (but not rendering time) is whether your file is set to Save Viewport Cache (Display tab under Document Preferences), meaning when you close and reopen a file you don't have to re-render a viewport. But that means it's saving those images in the file, taking up space.

This probably doesn't have THAT significant of an impact though...

Also, to echo a previous comment, one of the biggest perpetrators for me has been image-based textures. I've learned to never create a texture from an image without first opening the image in Photoshop and using the 'Save for Web and Devices' function to reduce filesize to as small as possible. Then I create the texture from the optimized image.

[zoomer]

We like to keep everything all in one file in order to make things simple to transfer. However you CAN reference resources if you like, it just adds a layer of complexity, but if it saves you significant space in your workflow then its worth the effort.

I like it as simple as possible too.

Having all data in one file that opens the same way on each machine is nice,

for smaller projects.

Not nice if you need to share your resources with other software in a larger

project. If the file gets corrupt the whole data may be lost.

Time Machine makes a backup every hour of my 800+ MB VW files although

the whole day I changed/created some geometry worth 163 kb only.

If a VW file would be like an App file with subfolders an experienced user

could at least access to the data. A project structure with customizable path

would more flexible.

[Benjamin Weill]

Purge. It'll (potentially) get rid of tons of things that you're not using.

Make as many repeated objects as you can symbols. 10 instances of one symbol is Vastly smaller than 10 instances of the same group.

Another trick is to convert and solid-additions or subtraction into generic solids. They are a much smaller "thing" for the program to process. Be SURE you're happy with how they look, though, because once you've converted them you lose the ability to edit them.

hope that helps.

[Kevin McAllister]

Not necessarily. I find 300 to 500 MB pretty common.

Your render times should be faster than that. In addition to rDesign's excellent suggestions, here are a couple of things I've found to keep VW snappy:

1. Don't use multiple extrude objects. Many times I've had a laggy file that got faster when all the multiple extrudes were changed other types of objects.

2. Don't use large mesh objects from other applications. It's much faster to rebuild mesh objects in native VW objects than it is to deal with the lag.

3. In the render settings for a viewport, make sure your detail isn't High or Very High. I keep it set at Low unless the model has a lot of curvy craziness.

4. Sweep objects with small segment angles cause longer render times. Crank those angles up as high as you can stand it. You can turn up the smoothing angle in the hidden line viewport to compensate.

hth

mk

This is very good advice. Also watch the resolution (dpi) of your sheet layer viewports. As AEB says this can have an affect, especially with higher sheet resolutions.

KM

[Amelia S]

The file was started with a template I created in VW 2014 I think. Sounds like that could be one of the issues? So much good advice in this thread.

I mostly use textures from the VW subscription libraries, but if I make some from scratch I'll be sure to save the image really small. And look there if I experience a jump in file size.

MK: Follow-up question about this one:

Is 200 MB large for a VW file?

1. Don't use multiple extrude objects. Many times I've had a laggy file that got faster when all the multiple extrudes were changed other types of objects.

Take for example my standing seams. Would you just convert them to Generic Solids?

Jim, my specific trouble on this is with a realistic colors white axonometric viewport with hidden line foreground (not sure if that's the same as shaded polygon). It had been updating in reasonable time (6 minutes or so, while the perspective projections of the same model in the same render style took only about 2, and still do.) Now it takes about 40, with lots of time spent on Indirect Lighting. It's just this one viewport. The other axon from the other side, on the same sheet with the same size and settings, takes 6 minutes.

When I change to Fast Renderworks with hidden line foreground, it takes less than 2 minutes.

[michaelk]

Amelia

I can't imagine that you are using multiple extrude objects for a standing seam roof. By Multiple Extrude, I don't mean more than one extrude. I mean the kind of object you get when selecting 2 or more lines, loci, or surfaces and clicking Model > Multiple Extrude…

Can you post a file with just one or two roof faces?

I usually use a texture with an attached hatch for standing seam roofs. But most of my projects don't use them extensively. Just a couple small gables or sheds while the rest of the building is something else.

I'll grab one and post it here. Might not work for your needs, but maybe you can adapt it.

It won't render in Artistic Renderworks modes. But it works in Final, Custom, and Fast Renderworks, Open GL, and Hidden Line.

hth

mk