lighting instrument symbols and class visibilities

[Jeff B]

I remain confused about the relationship between objects' class visibility behavior, and the class assignments of symbols (and symbols' component parts).

I understand that symbols themselves (and their components) are assigned to classes. What I don't understand is whether I need to re-edit the symbols if I want to put objects in different classes than the symbol definitions (and I want to use class options to control visibilities).

For example, I want to use a "Lighting Instruments" class to control visibility for all lighting instruments. I assigned all lighting instruments to the Lighting Instruments class, and when I went to "Active Only" in class options, they all disappeared.

I then edited all the individual lighting instrument symbols to make sure each component of every symbol/embedded symbol was in the Lighting Instruments class. (They hadn't been - some bits had been in that class and some in the None class.) But once I put them all in the Ltg Inst class it worked like I thought it should: under "Active Only" in class options I see only the lighting instruments. So in that sense, problem solved!

However I remain confused. When I try to move a lighting instrument (in the document) into (for example) the None class, as soon as I select None class in the instrument's OIP, the light becomes de-selected and its class doesn't change.

So is the only way to use class options to control visibilities, to edit every symbol, placing all the symbol's components into the class you want to put the objects in? Then create a different set of symbols if you want the same objects in other classes? I can't quite believe that would be the case, but I am baffled.

Sorry for the really long question, and thanks for any clarification of what I'm sure is a simple basic principle.

[michaelk]

Hi Jeff!

You're on the right track.

Symbols behave like clear glass boxes. The objects inside have class attributes and visibilities that we can see, and the box (symbol) itself has its class visibility.

For example almost all instruments will have a clamp in the clamp class that can be turned off if you find it too cluttered in a 3D view.

Likewise all the labels from the label legend manager will have their own class, so you can "turn off" the dimmer label, for example. So you will quickly find out that you need to edit all of your label legends to not have separate classes for each label.

Good news: If you edit the symbol from the Resource Browser, and choose "Symbol Options" you can set what class you want that symbol to be in when inserted. (This just started working for lighting instruments, I believe, in 2014. Or maybe the last SP of 2013 - It had always worked for regular symbols).

You might find it better to

1. set up a saved view that has all the label classes and the instrument class on and nothing else.

or

2. Leave all your instruments in the None class (or any other class) and put them on their own layer. This assures that nothing gets inserted higher in the stacking order than a lighting instrument, and getting a look at light fixtures only is a keyboard short cut away (option-command 3) to set the layer option to active only. This gets around the problem of having to edit every single lighting instrument symbol and all your label legends.

hth

mk

Edited October 23, 2013 by michaelk

[Jeff B]

Thanks Michael.

I've been experimenting with putting each system (sides, bax, etc; as well as rep vs non-rep) on its own layer. I have found it overall quite helpful to be able to look at each system by itself. Which is why I was trying to use class options to control all the instruments more globally.

I'm sure that if I ever figure out Vectorscripts it'll be easy to write custom selection scripts to do all this, but I'm trying to pick my battles. In the meantime it sounds like I can use class options for this purpose as long as I do so fairly carefully.

Thanks for pointing out the "Symbol Options" button in Edit Symbol; I'll play around with that.

Thanks again, and all my best,

Jeff

[michaelk]

Almost every time I think I'm going to write a script for something in Spotlight, I find that Sam Jones has already done it.

I really recommend his Spotlight tools. (and his cable and chain hoist tools.) http://autoplotvw.com

MK

[michaelk]

Also, take a look at File > Document Settings > Spotlight Preferences...

You can automatically set the class of a lighting device by any field from the OIP.

I use the Mark field (because I don't know what else it could be for!) to name systems [and then run a custom script to fill in the purpose field with the name of the system followed by the focus point.]

But you could also use it to create system classes.

[C. Andrew Dunning]

Jeff -

I'm probably hopping into this a little late and might be muddying the waters, but here are a couple of comments:

1) Michael used the analogy of a "glass box." Another word you'll see thrown around when referring to entities like Groups and Symbols is "container." Containers can be nested inside of other containers - multiple levels deep if you like - just like the truss bolts that live in the ammo can that lives in the utility case that lives in the semi...

2) This nesting can get VERY confusing VERY quickly, but can also be pretty powerful. For example:

- A Lighting Device Symbol uses can have "simple" geometry (a square or an extruded rectangle) and "complex" geometry (the actual fixture shape, yoke, clamp, etc.) in the same "container."

- Along the same lines, truss Symbols can contain simple and complex geometry, rigging guidelines, connection and hanging snap points, different notes, etc. - all or part of which can be displayed or hidden at-will.

This level of complexity is all doable, even if the Lighting Device is assigned to the "Front Light" Class or the truss to the "Over-Stage" Class.

Just my 2?...