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Vincent C

Do we really need Nomad?

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Been looking into Nomad a bit seeing I'm a VSS subscriber now and have just ordered an iPad which I aim to use instead of paper drawings while measuring and documenting existing buildings for refurbishing purposes, however I wonder if it is at all necessary?

I found this:

http://www.solidworks.com/sw/products/edrawings-mobile.htm?scid=sm_bl_mar_3_edrawings_ipad

and this:

https://itunes.apple.com/SE/app/id490774625?mt=8&affId=2083459

So I wonder if I really need Nomad?

Why not just take a dwg or pdf with me in the iPad and do the dimensioning/annotating in one or both o these apps using iCloud to syn to my MacBook? Isn't that the same?

Nomad would be so much better and more usable if we could do all that directly in the VWs file instead of having to export all sheets as pdfs and doing it in those?!

Edited by Vincent C

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I fully agree. I tried to work with Nomad when it was first introduced and ended up going back to iBooks as my PDF viewer.

The problem is Nomad isn't two way (ie. your markups in Nomad don't transfer back into your VW file as redlines) so there are still extra steps.....

NV is trying to be in the cloud because everyone else is. Not because they have something new to bring to the table. I would prefer if they concentrated those resources on VW.

(how about implementing Maxon's new Team Render where you can group together all of the machines in the office to help with a render on demand)

Kevin

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Nomad, being a cloud app, is being updated all the time. It is not on a yearly cycle like Vectorworks versions. One of the things that Nomad does (that your standard cloud PDF-viewer does not) is, it updates all your viewports, and creates the PDF export in the cloud. So you don't have to.

Imagine working up to the last minute to make some changes to a project, then just posting your Vectorworks file to the cloud, and when you get to your client's office to make the presentation, everything is ready and you just present on your iPad (or Android tablet.)

Nomad is anything but "half-baked." Like any mobile app, it is undergoing constant change and improvement. I think that some of the 'competing' apps you describe don't even allow markup.

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One of the things that Nomad does (that your standard cloud PDF-viewer does not) is, it updates all your viewports, and creates the PDF export in the cloud. So you don't have to.

Imagine working up to the last minute to make some changes to a project, then just posting your Vectorworks file to the cloud, and when you get to your client's office to make the presentation, everything is ready and you just present on your iPad (or Android tablet.)

Except it doesn't do this either. We continue to be unable to render many of our drawings because your cloud machines just aren't up to the task Robert.

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Nomad, being a cloud app, is being updated all the time. It is not on a yearly cycle like Vectorworks versions. One of the things that Nomad does (that your standard cloud PDF-viewer does not) is, it updates all your viewports, and creates the PDF export in the cloud. So you don't have to.

Imagine working up to the last minute to make some changes to a project, then just posting your Vectorworks file to the cloud, and when you get to your client's office to make the presentation, everything is ready and you just present on your iPad (or Android tablet.)

Nomad is anything but "half-baked." Like any mobile app, it is undergoing constant change and improvement. I think that some of the 'competing' apps you describe don't even allow markup.

As much as I appreciate a response and as much as I like to be optimistic and constructive when critical:

1. Batch Exporting PDFs to Dropbox does this with the added advantage that you can choose in advance which Sheets are exported and that you can access the exported PDFs from other apps (when using an iPad). This cuts rendering time radically in many cases.

2. I really tried using Nomad for the purpose I named at the beginning of this post and in this post: http://techboard.vectorworks.net/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=38057&Number=187864#Post187864 , however the annotation I made changed size radically when the file was saved and reopened making it impossible to see to what part of the drawing it originally referred, as well as several crashes taking place after a certain amount of time/annotating resulting in the loss of all annotation. In combination with this, the freehand/sketch tool is so basic, that writing numbers is impossible?!

So unfortunately and in this case it is completely useless for me, so I really do want to call it half baked, sorry. (if you ask me why I didn't bug submit, that should be proof enough.....)

Edited by Vincent C

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Nomad, being a cloud app, is being updated all the time. It is not on a yearly cycle like Vectorworks versions. One of the things that Nomad does (that your standard cloud PDF-viewer does not) is, it updates all your viewports, and creates the PDF export in the cloud. So you don't have to.

Imagine working up to the last minute to make some changes to a project, then just posting your Vectorworks file to the cloud, and when you get to your client's office to make the presentation, everything is ready and you just present on your iPad (or Android tablet.)

Obviously, you've never used Nomad outside the VW test lab, but keep on drinking the Koolade, Robert, keep on drinking the Koolade.

Nomad is anything but "half-baked."

You're right: it's 1/8th baked, if that.

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As others have pointed out the cloud render component isn't really useable. In my case there are viewports it won't render (they render fine on my machine), I have multiple sets of sheets in a file but cloud render has no way to choose which ones to render/export, and I've had continuous font issues.

The font issue is actually the biggest one. I've used the same professional font for years (ITC Avant Garde Gothic) and never had any problems (service bureaus, plotting services etc.) until using VW Cloud Services. Its used in hundreds, perhaps thousands, of files. I even tried buying an Open Type version. Still no go. Since VW doesn't have a replace font function or fonts by class there is really no easy way for me to solve this problem without a huge investment of time on my part.

Everyone's viewpoint and expectations are different. Just as every use for VW is different (Vincent and Christiaan work in the architectural field, whereas I've used VW for theatre shows, museum exhibits, costumes, live events and an olympic opening and closing ceremonies). VW needs to spend more time in the customers shoes.

Kevin

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Ok Ok boys, I think he's gone back under his rock now...

It seems with the atmosphere on this forum that nobody should dare sing any praise for VW until a serious overhaul of the program is pushed to market and even less for superfluous program extensions. Either, that or title the next VW release slogan "DISSOLVE".

Bye Bye!

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Imagine working up to the last minute to make some changes to a project, then just posting your Vectorworks file to the cloud, and when you get to your client's office to make the presentation, everything is ready and you just present on your iPad (or Android tablet.)

Well I don't know too much about clouds or nomads, but I do know that the absolutely last way I would present anything to a client is on an iPad (or Android tablet).

V-G

VW2013

iMac i7 27"

1978 AMC Gremlin (V8 sucka!)

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I agree vector geek, Robert is seriously disconnected with reality. Imagine sitting down beside your client with 10" color print out sheets of even a small residential project...They would definitely ask for a magnifying glass...it would be no different with a 10" tablet.

Wake up! Wake up!

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Well I don't know too much about clouds or nomads, but I do know that the absolutely last way I would present anything to a client is on an iPad (or Android tablet).

I think it depends on how you use the tablet.

I stream Keynotes (Apple's PowerPoint competitor) from my iPad to a pocket LCD projector connected to an AppleTV. That allows me to take notes or look things up on my laptop without having to switch away from the presentation.

I also like to use Air Display to mirror my laptop screen to iPad when I meet with clients at their home or place of business and hand them iPad so we don't have to crowd around my laptop. It also allows them to watch me make changes to a model and see the results in something close-to-realtime.

But I sure as hell wouldn't try that in Nomad.

I agree vector geek, Robert is seriously disconnected with reality. Imagine sitting down beside your client with 10" color print out sheets of even a small residential project...They would definitely ask for a magnifying glass...it would be no different with a 10" tablet.

Although in Keynote or with Air Display, you can zoom in on any area of interest.

Edited by pgym

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The cloud may be a solution for some, not for others. We all have different ways of working. Like Kevin says, theater and live events are not architecture. VW needs to understand that, and help us all if they are going to have a product that works across professions.

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Imagine working up to the last minute to make some changes to a project, then just posting your Vectorworks file to the cloud, and when you get to your client's office to make the presentation, everything is ready and you just present on your iPad (or Android tablet.)

Hi Robert,

Thank you very much for taking the time to reply. We really do appreciate when there are responses from folks at Nemetschek.

Unfortunately, I have to disagree with the use-case you've described here. I can't rely on Nomad's cloud rendering at all, so I can't be sure that the file will be ready to view on my iPad when I get to my destination. I've just simply had too many errors, or files that didn't work properly. In addition, I would never show a client something that I haven't proofed in its final form. It's too easy to forget to turn on a class, or screw up a Renderworks setting.

And so far, I've yet to find an instance where uploading a file to Nomad is faster than just rendering out the viewport myself, exporting the PDF, and opening it in iBooks (or some other PDF viewer).

The real killer-app for us is to be able to mark up (or, dare I say, edit) actual 2D and 3D drawing files on site, and have those markups sync back to the master file in some way. Nomad doesn't do that. As it stands, Nomad is no better than any other PDF viewer on the market, and in many cases it is less reliable.

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Hi Robert,

Thank you very much for taking the time to reply. We really do appreciate when there are responses from folks at Nemetschek.

As much as this is true, the way Robert has responded worries me greatly. Had the response been something like: "We are aware of these problems and have assigned a team to take care of it, in addition they are working on an enhancement where annotation is transfered to the original VWs file." I would be much more confident.........

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Had the response been something like: "We are aware of these problems and have assigned a team to take care of it, in addition they are working on an enhancement where annotation is transfered to the original VWs file." I would be much more confident.........

We never ever discuss unreleased products. I think this is pretty widely known.

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Had the response been something like: "We are aware of these problems and have assigned a team to take care of it, in addition they are working on an enhancement where annotation is transfered to the original VWs file." I would be much more confident.........

We never ever discuss unreleased products. I think this is pretty widely known.

Oh really?

What do you call the annual pre-release dog-and-pony show hyping all the half-baked new "features"?

And how do you explain Biplab Sarkar's discussion of VW Cloud Services with Architosh, in March last year, well ahead of its release, particularly the closing paragraph:

Nemetschek Vectorworks, Inc., approached Architosh and one other CAD media company to do a feature on the new cloud services offering ahead of their official announcement, planned for 2 April 2012.

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I understand why they wouldn't want to comment. It puts them in an awkward place when things don't happen on schedule or go as expected. I know there's a lot of people here is interested in the result of this -

"One of the things that did come up during this topic was when Vectorworks would become a 64-bit application. Dr. Sarkar stated that the development team at Nemetschek Vectorworks is in the process of removing the dependency on QuickTime and Carbon API on the Mac. QuickTime, has many may already know, is stuck at 32-bits. The Carbon API (application programming interface) would be replaced by the Cocoa framework." ( http://architosh.com/2012/06/aia-nemetschek-talks-with-architosh/ )

(I could have sworn I read an article that said it was a two year time frame, either in VW2013 or if not then for VW2014, but I haven't been able to find the article again.)

Any even in a Q&A the year before there's a lot of discussion about speed and user interface improvements for the future -

http://architosh.com/2011/10/notes-from-press-chat-on-vectorworks-2012/

Kevin

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Had the response been something like: "We are aware of these problems and have assigned a team to take care of it, in addition they are working on an enhancement where annotation is transfered to the original VWs file." I would be much more confident.........

We never ever discuss unreleased products. I think this is pretty widely known.

Yes it is and I respect that, and I guess that was part of the point, we (the current users) get no feedback about what is happening behind the scenes, however some type of acknowledgment of faulty software indicates to us that you (NV) are actually working on it instead of just burying your heads in the sand........this makes [us] hopeful instead of resigned but at least keeps us with it.......

....or perhaps the Sales talk works better and attracts more new customers than those leaving for the competition? In that case these threads are counter productive in that respect and denial is the best defense!?

Again all speculation and negative publicity for VWs, so what am I to do? Should I just shut up and keep working 'around'......?

You know I just don't have the energy and time to bug submit anymore! Yesterday I found out that wall sculpting elements don't follow the walls when changes are made in Story heights they simply just remain where they were created but I just can bother to bug submit,

My favourite example is the wall sculpting tool. Great idea but pretty much next to useless in an architectural context because it has never worked at the corners of walls since it was introduced in 2009.

these types of omissions(they are not bugs!) just make me so dam tired, I just want to get on with my work!

Edited by Vincent C

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I find Nomad to be an interesting app. For our workflow and client interaction, its primary weakness is we do more than just work with VectorWorks. Using a .pdf reader on our iPad, I can sort and organize all of our current project drawings, specifications, etc in .pdf format and have a traveling file archive to take in the field and to client meetings.

The weakness of our approach is that it requires occasional preparation and updating to ensure that we have the latest files on the device. The strength of the approach is that once that is done, there are no worries about server/cloud reliability, etc.

At this moment, Cloud Services isn't accepting my VW files. A post for another discussion stream, but relates to my concern over reliability.

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We use Box.com for all outward communication.

We can access all files on the iPad from box.com.

There is no way to mark up a file, but you can make comments.

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