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Add in true elevation markers (finally!)

Projects levels?

More like Elevation Bench markers connected to project elevations, they adjust accordingly when Story elevations are changed.

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Add in true elevation markers (finally!)

Projects levels?

More like Elevation Bench markers connected to project elevations, they adjust accordingly when Story elevations are changed.

Ooh, finally a full-baked integrated implementation.

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Add in true elevation markers (finally!)

Projects levels?

More like Elevation Bench markers connected to project elevations, they adjust accordingly when Story elevations are changed.

Ooh, finally a full-baked integrated implementation.

It is possible to set a custom marker style as default too apparently.......

Edited by Vincent C

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There look to be lots of useful improvements. I'm hoping some of the major features feel fully implemented after last year's Auto Hybrid disappointment (though I'm told my Auto-Hybrid bug has been fixed).

The true litmus test for me will be if you can now edit the drawing number of a basic sheet layer viewport in the OIP like you can for section and detail viewports.... basic yes, but it tells me about the intent of development. Its something simple that would save a huge amount of time and that should have been there to begin with. As someone said in the other thread, a preview while mirroring is great, but its not a feature....

Kevin

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Apparently, still no roof components, no stacked walls, no wall finishes settable for each room, ...

It`s a shame they didn`t made BIM better, but:

The tapper face tool and twist tool are really cool and make me wonder what other kind of great stuff they are developing.

A friend of mine who does everything in SU was really impressed with these futures :)

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Apparently, still no roof components, no stacked walls, no wall finishes settable for each room, ...

When will we receive the tools we need to design an accurate (real world) model?

Stacked wall components, been asking for this for quite some time

Roof style tool, with definable soffit ends (gable, hip, full hip returns)and for multiple fascias imagine how much time this would save

Stair Tool that will actually allow more than 2 stringers and a real working railing tool

Definable room finishes that show in 3D with schedules. That includes interior trim.

OIP needs major overhaul

Floor System Tool or update Slab tool to include joists, sill plates

Should be able to change wall component materials on a wall by wall basis (not just textures)

Should be able to offset wall component materials on a wall by wall basis

It appears that no one is listening or taking serious our requests for these much needed changes.

We should not have to design/model graphically our building components.

As usual, we will have to wait and see.

Edited by taoist

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About 2 years ago I switched to Chief Architect as my "BIM" (even though its not really BIM) from Vectorworks. I was a user since Minicad 6.

I still find Vectorworks very useful for my concept drawings and even modeling "objects" for Chief Architect.

That said, I recently saw some info on Nemetchek's Allplan and I loved what I saw as a true BIM. Yet - they don't have a dealer in the US. I hope that changes, and I think if any of you guys look at Allplan you will be pleasantly surprised.

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Some tutorial videos of Allplan

Short video showing Allplan & RIB iTWO

Note the tabbed interface at the left side.

Drawing walls & Columns

General Arrangements (viewports)

Planes & Custom Planes (stories)

Layouts & export to PDF

User Interface

Edited by taoist

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This identifies an interesting conundrum NV faces. Minicad (now VW) didn't start out as an architectural package and many of its long time users don't use it specifically for architecture. These other packages you mention are architecture specific software and a lot more focussed.

Personally I'm interested in NV focussing on things that benefit everyone first (improved workflow, interface, drawing co-ordination and modelling tools) and I suspect they need to strike that balance anyway. The VW2015 videos show this. Entertainment Design, for example, is a growing market for them. I could be a very large market in the future if students are introduced to VW first. They need architectural tools, yes, but they also need a lot of other tools too.

The reality is while there may be other software packages suitable for the architectural market there aren't that many alternatives for Landscape or Entertainment design. You're not likely to design an Olympic Ceremony using Chief Architect or Revit. I'm sure that's one of the reasons VW got out of the Mechanical market, much more competition, but continues to grow these niche markets.

Kevin

Edited by Kevin McAllister

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I often read about sketchup here...

For example i know several architects from russian archicad forums, which used archicad for making of forms and documentation...but main modeling is in sketchup.

One of those architects wrote that archicad bim features limit his fantasy, imagination about finish of building.

I feel same with VW. It means simplicity of VW in workflow

Edited by Ilay

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Does anyone use AllPlan? To me it looks like the way to go for building modeler - then VW for concept and marketing stuff.

I am seriously thinking of changing from Chief Architect to AllPlan. Those who think Chief Architect is a joke need to look more closely, but I think AllPlan is a better all around app.

People that use Sketchup for their build models are nuts. I know Sketchup inside and out, and its a "dumb" 3D app. We need to have BIM tools to make our process faster and keep competitive. Certain architects use Sketchup in very "non-competitive" environments where they can spend 120 hrs on a residential house and still make a "wage". Permit docs are getting more and more complicated - we need to spend less time on routine items, and Sketchup has a "creation model" opposite to that goal.

Kevin, Vectorworks as a tool can help in areas that I don't think many BIM apps even think important. I use VW to conceptualize, model parts, and render 2D work. Its the best app I have seen for this type of work-product. Its great they try to include Architectural tools - but they are failing in this regard. I find value in VW just for the ways I use it.

Edited by Johnny"c"

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Kevin,

I understand and appreciate your views regarding VW.

That is one of it's strengths is diversity for design ability.

When (in my case) it is for architecture, the product (Architect) should be more defined to suite the needs.

We have Landmark, Designer, Architect, Spotlight, Fundamentals for more or less, CAD specific products.

While it is great to have the design flexibility, the tools we should have (Architect) are sorely lacking or need serious updating.

imho

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Thanks Taoist. I don't doubt it needs an update. I suspect most of the architectural resources have been going into BIM / IFC.

Following up on the discussion of the new Vectorworks Graphics Module earlier in this thread, there is more info in an article here -

http://architosh.com/2013/09/details-on-vectorworks-graphics-module-vgm-in-new-vectorworks-2014/

It looks like it has a lot of potential for the future (perhaps no re-rendering of sheet layer viewports is on the horizon).

I'm also curious if news of Apple's recent adoption of OpenGL 4.1 in the upcoming Mavericks will help Mac users get even greater performance from it (PC users are already at OpenGL 4.1) - http://architosh.com/2013/09/mavericks-brings-opengl-4-1-plus-specifics-for-new-mac-pros/

KM

Edited by Kevin McAllister

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Does anyone use AllPlan?

No, but we've been paying for the development and growth of the "integrated" Allplan group for many years now.

Short video showing Allplan & RIB iTWO

What ?integrated BIM? keeps speaking to in promotions like this by Nemetschek and elsewhere, is that coordinated proprietary efforts will always produce more powerful and efficient software, less reliant on user input and less prone to user error than the generic route.

If Nemetschek?s duplicity in promoting its mega-integrated solution doesn?t raise people?s hackles, I don?t know what will.

When will we receive the tools we need to design an accurate (real world) model?

The question is where can the Vectorworks team take VW Architect that isn?t integrated BIM and remain profitable with some BIM?ish abilities. They?re comparatively, a very lean team fighting handicapped in a market that's selling the benefits of integrated BIM on ?every? street corner now. They?ll need to find a niche where they can survive with the hand they?ve been dealt.

Moving to Parasolids as a foundation for powerful freeform modeling, the VGM and adding things like displacement mapping to Renderworks in 2014 are all reasonable indicators of where they may intend trying to carve a niche out. They're possibly more focused on the market for producing 3D architectural environments for visualisation, with a-bit-of-BIM added on, than they are with the intelligence and specificity of accurate (real world) BIM tools, the power of which are best leveraged within integrated BIMs. They need to find a future for VW Architect with the resources they have, which may mean not trying to compete directly with integrated BIMs.

Realistically, what else can they do?

Edited by M5d

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What is the reason that Nemetschek is keeping AllPlan and Vectorworks and Graphisoft all separate. It seems crazy to be developing 3 programs with so much overlap. They need to combine the best features of these different platforms into one cohesive product and concentrate their development dollars.

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What is the reason that Nemetschek is keeping AllPlan and Vectorworks and Graphisoft all separate. It seems crazy to be developing 3 programs with so much overlap. They need to combine the best features of these different platforms into one cohesive product and concentrate their development dollars.

The problem is you can't just hit a button and combine these apps. Plus, I see Vectorworks very differently than ArchiCAD/AllPlan. I use Vectorworks for concept work (color 2D), 2D drawing, site planning, terrain and massing models, interior design detailing, marketing documents, and even component modeling (like many do with Sketchup). I use an app like ArchiCAD and AllPlan for my building information model. Even though VW can technically do this work, I think we all agree its not the best. Yet, it is the best for the items I use it for.

I know a ton of people that use VW in ways Archicad etc wouldn't be considered - ie sound/trade show booth design/stage design etc etc...

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As Johnny says, however technology companies often buy other companies or software to gain some of the technologies or even personnel involved, integrate them into their flagship software then shut them down.

Nemetschek doesn't roll like that. It's a "financial holding company specializing in AEC, and so it gives no technical directions; divisions have strategic independence" http://www.upfrontezine.com/2012/upf-728.htm

Check out posts by M5d. He's posted some great commentary about the way NV is set up.

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Obviously it would not be simple. But your workflow is exactly my point. Both your conceptual work, 2D drawing, and your BIM model should happen (could happen) in the same program. I just feel like there are some synergistic opportunities that are not being realized.

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The software(s) are all maintained in separate code bases, you can't just cut and paste features from one to the other...

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