How to cut a sink into a countertop.

[taoist]

Here is the link to the movie.

http://kbase.vectorworks.net/questions/753/Placing+a+Sink+in+a+Base+Cabinet

[Joe-SA]

I'm sorry, but I think this movie is a ridiculous solution. No offense to Alicia who I have emailed many times and found very helpful. Not sure of the date on the movie but I approached an alternate technique with her directly last year.

A better solution that doesn't involve ungrouping the PIO into its individual parts is to simply turn off the countertop that is created by the base cabinet. Then place the separate CounterTop PIO over top of the base cabinet. The CounterTop PIO includes controls for creating a hole for a sink either square or oval. Place your sink in the hole. There you have your solution while maintaining full control of your PIO for future edits of door panel, hardware, texture, etc. This solution has been around for long, long time.

The issues I had last year with this solution was that the back splash display in 2d was different between the countertop PIO and the countertop made by the adjacent Base Cabinet PIOs. They were controlled differently and displayed differently from each other. 2d and 3d back splash creation and view were linked in one and not the other. 2D Patch lines were needed in plan just to get a common look.

The other issues was the obvious question....if we can make sink holes as part of the CounterTop PIO then why isn't the hole function included as part of the sink front base cabinet? The code already exists. Can't they be combined? I don't think these cabinet PIOs have been modified in many, many updates. They've been the same for about the past 10 years or so.

Haven't looked into this in some time. Seems like an easy fix. Hopefully one of the Service Packs improved it.

Joe

[taoist]

Joe-SA,

Thanks for the good information.

Forgot about the (2) hole options in Countertop Tool.

1st why only square and oval?

What about polygon / polyline?

Why do we have to trace the hole cutout at all?

What about just having the countertop auto cutout for the sink anyway?

Nothing new. Other CAD software does this automatically.

Heck $50.00 software will do this automatically.

I feel as though there isn't anyone at VW who does this on a regular basis. Current methods are very time consuming.

I was not aware of the backsplash issues.

We must keep pushing / asking.

I know interiorcad will auto cut sink.

I have requested that interiorcad use stock VW library sinks as well as their fixtures. Seems counter productive to me being only able to use their libraries.

[billtheia]

I just turn the counter off in the cabinet PIO and then create a separate counter top using the floor tool. The floor object is as easy to modify and cut holes in as a simple polygon.

[taoist]

billtheia,

I was thinking about that last night.

I am also going to experiment with countertop edge profiles, you know, like the ones like the ones you actually see.

[J Lucas]

You can easily add the backsplashes with the floor tool as well.

[taoist]

Good idea!

Can you cut a hole if you make into a symbol?

[taoist]

Created 25" x 60" rectangle

Extruded to 1-1/2"

Drew rectangle for hole

Extruded to deeper than 1-1/2"

Subtract Solids to get hole

Drew 2D polygon at contertop perimeter

Created 1/4 round x 1-1/2"

Select 1/4 round and 2D polygon path

Used Extrude Along Path

Adjust profile so applid to edge of countertop

Align EAP to countertop

This is result

[CipesDesign]

A couple thoughts... I generally use a Floor Object or an Extrude for counter tops; With either one, the hole can be created by way of Clip Surface (subtracted solids are not needed); adding detailed edge profiles introduces another element which might be most easily achieved with EAP (then Add Solids); Did you know that there is a Counter Top plug in which includes backspalsh and sink cutout? However this tool is limited to straight runs only (arg!). What would be very nice is if this tool were enhanced such that it could be any shape and could contain custom edge profiles...

[taoist]

CipesDesign,

Great discussion here!

Good point. Clip surface is same principle as subtract solids.

Just 2D vs 3D.

Laminate tops are 1-1/2" thick

Granite, Quartz are 30mm approx. 1-3/16" thick

I am creating edge profiles for the tops.

NOTE: Need to make sure to deduct horizontal depth of profile from countertop (typically 25" here in the states) or 1" overhang dimension.

Still better than countertop tool for cutouts and edge profiles.

Just keep asking!

Edited June 19, 2012 by taoist

[bcd]

I know this sounds weird & bullnoses would be impossible but

the wall tool would work. Make your sink symbols insertable into walls, create a wall component for the backsplash and ...

(granted I'm not going to test it but it's probably worth exploring)

[CipesDesign]

Walls will not work because you can only insert objects into them from the side, not from the top or bottom...

[CipesDesign]

Taoist, the reason I prefer to use Clip/Add Surface (when possible) is that 2d stuff is always less of a data hog then 3d stuff. Whenever Added/Subtracted Solids (and other complex 3d objects) are present, files get large and rendering times increase.

Also, I am a huge advocate for anatomical accuracy and since most real building materials are highly rectangular (read: nearly 2d) I like to start with the simplest way to create a form. It's as if I had a piece of wood (or steel, or plastic, etc) and a saw and a drill. How would I go about creating the desired end result???...

[taoist]

Peter,

Good Points about 3D resource hog.

[Bryan G.]

Guys great point here and it is always great to see how there are different ways to do a task. I do think though that a hole should be created automatically when a sink or any other device is inserted into the countertop, much like the wall with windows and doors.

[CipesDesign]

Bryan, yes I agree 100%. Same principle as walls, but in another plane. Seems that it would be entirely doable... Keep asking!

[Bryan G.]

Peter and Bryan great idea! Oh they probably wont accept me asking for it twice in the same post.

This would be great though, sinks, stoves, grills, kegarators you get my drift.

[taoist]

Hey everybody!

Use a 24" wide profile symbol(need to correct that)

for countertop

Drew random " Z " 2D Polygon for cabinet line

Here is result

Will fine tune but all I would need to do is trace (draw 2D polygon) at cabinet face line in Top/Plan, EAP with profile align vertically or align working plane to 2D polygon and place profile and be done with it.

See images

EDIT: Need to draw trace line at cabinet wall line due to having to adjust edge profile.

Would be great when we create profile and set at axis it actually stays instead of re-centering itself.

Wonder if there is a fix to that.

Also, when cutting a hole (subtract solids) countertop turns to wireframe.

Attribute Palette, turn on solid fill.

Here is counter top using 24" profile and EAP with solid subtractions (cut hole) and sink placed

You will see sink and edge profile.

Just love learning new things! Till we get the countertop tool we need.

Countertop profiles file below

Edited June 19, 2012 by taoist