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cad jockey1

major crashing issues

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since our firm has updated to OSX, i (and a few others running the blue G3's) am having ALOT of crashes. we are all running VW9.5 and most of us have dual monitors. originally we thought this was a 'dual' issue, but i have been running a single monitor to no avail. there are several different crash types, but the most common by far is the "there one second, gone the next" instant vanishing trick, and this happens ALOT, i have stopped counting at 20 crashes before. it happens while running in OSX, it happens while running classic and even in a OS9 boot. out of the 3 G3 blues we have loaded OSX and VW9.5 on so far, 2/3 are having major issues, the third is OK most of the time. the G4's seem to be ok, thou they are not pushing VW alot.

specs are: G3Blue with OSX and VW9.5, 2 ATI Rage videocards, 384 ram, 400 processor.

thx in advance...

cad jockey

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We are looking into the OS 10 crashing. We've had intermittent reports in regards to the program crashing in OS 10. Are you using any of the industry standard products?What version of OS 10 do you have?

As VW should run in classic mode, we really do not reccomend running VW 9.5 in classic mode.

Under OS 9 - you are getting crashing there? What type of error message are you getting? Do you have enough memory allocated to the VW application? What version of OS 9 do you have?

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I have a similar problem. I am running VW9.5 on the Mac with OS 9.1. The program will randomly lock up or freeze for no reason. I can move the screen curser around but the program itself is completely locked. I have to do a force quit on the program and restart. I have the save notify set at 3 minutes. One notice is that it happens most often when I am zoomed in and/or moving test or library objects? frown.gif" border="0

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Jon, In your case, I would check the memory allocation settings for VW. If they are set to the standard default settings, you may want to try increasing the preferred setting. I would also suggest updating the OS to 9.2.x.

When the program "freezes" do you get an error message? Does it happen as you are trying to zoom in by clicking on one of the zooming abilities, or after it's zoomed in and you try to access an object?Does it freeze when you move an object?What percentage are you zoomed in at?What scale are you working with?

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We have had similar trouble and what we discovered is the ATI rage 128 vidio cards seems to be the culprit.

Cad Jocky, check the Blue and White you have that is not crashing and see what kind of card is in it.

We figured this out by buying second vidio cards for all our production machines, then several weeks later we upgraded to OS X, this is when the trouble started. We noticed that if we ran the blue and whites off of the new cards there were fewer problems.

We're starting to think that the Blue and Whites generally don't like OS X. But we're hopeful that things will smooth out. Over all I don't think this is NNA's issue, it seems more of an apple issue to us. Although the problem does persent itself more often when using VW.

Good Luck

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I've had the same problems with VWA 9.5 on my G4 - 400mhz running either OS 9.1 or 9.2. I have a Apple installed Radeon AGP card. I figure I've lost about 2 wks work since the first of the year!

Maybe I'll have to spring for a new graphics card, any suggestions?

bruce arnold

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If you are on OS 9.x, updating to OS 9.2.2 and getting the most recent version of the video driver should resolve the problem.

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quote:

Originally posted by Katie:
If you are on OS 9.x, updating to OS 9.2.2 and getting the most recent version of the video driver should resolve the problem.

We have noticed that switching the Blue and White G-3's from OS X back to Native OS 9.2.2 seems to stabilize the machines.

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I have a major Kernal error that occurs at infrequent times when I am using VectorWorks. It doesn't usually happen when I am in VectorWorks it happens when I shutdown my computer afterwards. It also happens when I am using VectorWorks and Imaging a disk. It doesn't happen everytime just enough to be annoying. VectorWorks also crashes my tablet software (Wacom) if I try to add program specific menus and commands. I am running OS X, Spotlight 9.5 and a G4 laptop.

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confused.gif" border="0 I have been having "major crashing issues" with my G4 running OS9.2.1 and VW 8.5.2. It has been happening in a drawing that is about 1.5mb in size with not too many layers (9) . The sheets I am working in each have three layers turned on with one layer at 1/8" and one layer at 1/16" scales. A bit of hatching, a bit of grey scale fill (pattern). I thought the crashes (freezing) occurred when I was moving and scrolling at the same time. That is dragging something byond what is visible on the screen, but I just froze drawing a line so that's not it. ATI Rage graphics card.Save set at 1 minute and even that's not enough. I crash every thirty seconds or so. Except on coffee breaks .

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Joe, What do you have set as your memory allocation settings for VW ?Do you have Virtual Memory turned on ?If so, how much free hard drive space do you have?

Do you notice this problem in a new blank document?

There are some issues with the ATI cards in VW 8. To resolve the problem, updating to OS 9.2.2 and getting the most recenver version of the video driver installed usually fixes problems associated to the video driver.

The problem you are having could be video related, but I think it's more of a memory thing.

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KATIE!!!! That seems to have fixed it. It was the graphics card. I turned virtual memory on and had some 7000M on the hdrive.That didn't work so I downloaded a driver update for the Radeon 7000 Mac Version and installed that. So far no crashes, 20 minutes and counting. Incidently if anyone else is having this problem with this equipment, the 2002 retail update from ATI was corrupt or something and wouldn't install. The 7000 series worked. I have sent a note to ATI.

Thanks! grin.gif" border="0

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Katie,

We are also having crashing problems. We are running a dual 450 G4 running OS 10.1.3 and Vectorworks Architect 9.5.1. Every now and then, it just quits. It also happens on our new iMac 800 w. 1GB RAM although not as much.

I'm also finding 9.5 and 9.5.1 veeeery slooow. I can't get over how slow it is. You would think with 800mhz and 1GB RAM it would be fast. Dragging object, lines, etc. is slow. any thoughts.

Bill.

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Lett, There is a slowness of OS 10 overall that I've noticed. We have reports of VW crashing in OS 10 for no apparent reason, at least not one that we've been able to track down. On the other hand, I've also noticed other native applications crashing in OS 10 for no apparent reason. None the less, VW 9.5 and 9.5.1 shouldn't be running slower than VW 9.0.1. Have you made sure that everything, including drivers are up to par to match the OS version that you are using ?

Does VW 9.5 and 9.5.1 run slow in OS 9 for you as well, or do they run faster in OS 9 rather than OS 10 ?

About how much slower is it running ?

When you experience this slowness, do you have your email on or is there another application in the dock that is taking up the processor usage?I've seen VW slow down as far as snapping or redraw when the email program was checking mail or another application in the doc was doing some behind the scenes work. Is the dock bouncing when you notice these slow downs?

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Joe,

Glad it worked out for you !

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quote:

Originally posted by Katie:
Lett, There is a slowness of OS 10 overall that I've noticed. We have reports of VW crashing in OS 10 for no apparent reason, at least not one that we've been able to track down. On the other hand, I've also noticed other native applications crashing in OS 10 for no apparent reason. None the less, VW 9.5 and 9.5.1 shouldn't be running slower than VW 9.0.1. Have you made sure that everything, including drivers are up to par to match the OS version that you are using ?

Does VW 9.5 and 9.5.1 run slow in OS 9 for you as well, or do they run faster in OS 9 rather than OS 10 ?

About how much slower is it running ?

When you experience this slowness, do you have your email on or is there another application in the dock that is taking up the processor usage?I've seen VW slow down as far as snapping or redraw when the email program was checking mail or another application in the doc was doing some behind the scenes work. Is the dock bouncing when you notice these slow downs?

Katie,

I have tried it without any other app running and it is still slow. I have noticed that it is really slow when I run it with iTunes playing. I've also been working on a large document lately. If the document is corrupted, then how do I copy it into a new document so that the file size is smaller. I have tried purging eveything and it is still a 10mb doc.

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Lett, There have been reports of VW running slow when ITunes and VW are running together. The two program are fighting for memory and processor usage. If you are burning a CD while running VW, that will slow things down drastically as that uses the processor constantly.

If you run VW with ITunes off, does it still drag?

The 10 meg file is big, but it's not too too big. YOu can copy and paste to a new file by setting your layer options to Active Only and the Classes Options to Show Snap Modify others. Be sure to make all layers and classes visible. Set up the new file with the correct layers in the same order they appear in your drawing (For layer stacking order reasons) and set the layer scales for the layers appropriately. Go back to your "bad" drawing with your first layer set as the active layer. Select all and then go to Copy, go over to your "new" file and select Paste in Place. When using Paste in Place, it will retain the coordinate values in the new file rather than placing it arbitraily with the simple "Paste" command. Go back to your bad document, select the next layer, select all, copy. Go to the bad file, switch to the correct layer, and paste in place. Do this for all the layers. If you have any scripts or worksheets, you will have to import those over to the new drawing as those do not get copied and pasted.

If you have any sheets set up, you will need to recreate the sheets in the new drawing.

Another way to reduce the file size when it is saved is to save with layer views set to Top/Plan. This ignores the 3d information when saving thus reducing the file size. The 3d information is still there when you open the file again and switch to a 3d view.

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Katie,

We have some people experiencing this issue and some not (16 total). We have G4s that do have this intermittent crashes. and B&Ws that don't.

I have noticed a repeatable bug that does cause a crash every time, and while not something that affects most people, makes me wonder if this problem is related to the focus change between VW8 and VW9. What I am talking about, is that in VW9 after editing in object info you have to bring focus back to your document. In VW8 and before that wasn't the case.

The bug is recreatable by doing this.

Open any document in VW 9.5.x blank or otherwise

Resize your object ifo palette to almost as small as it will get, or as small for that matter.

Draw something in the drawing, for me I drew lines.

The object info pallette cannot display the info for the line, as there isn't enough space and will display the "jump" arrows at the top and/or bottom

Start randomly clicking on those buttons, in OS 9.2.2 about four clicks will bring VW down, in OS X 10.1.3 it is a lot more, but you will notice the jump buttons don't behave properly, and after 15 20 it blows up.

Now you see why I say most people won't run into this, but I'm hoping it might help point your programmers in the right direction.

thanks,

Ion Webster

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I just upgraded to 9.5, then to 9.5.1, and I'm having crashing issues that began with 9.5. If I click on the Desktop my computer freezes up, I can't even force quit. This just began after I loaded 9.5, and it doesn't happen with other programs, so it has to be the upgrade, right?

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A-Greene, What OS version are you using?

If you are using OS 9, what version of Carbon Lib do you have?

Do you have any other programs open when runinng VW?

If you are in OS 9, how much memory do you have allocated for the application?

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Ion,

I am looking into your post still with the Testing Dept. As soon as I find something out, I will let you know either here or in email.

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Ion this is a bug - # 26143. It looks like it's on the schedule to be fixed in the next version of VW.

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Katie,

I'm running VW on my G4 laptop, using OS 9.2.2. I have CarbonLib v1.5 in my extensions folder, and have a minimum 20000k memory, according to my info palette, preferred size is set to 39063k.

Let me know if you have any ideas.

-Adam

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A-Greene You could have a conflict with a set of extensions. You can try to boot in safe mode. Launch VW and then click on your desktop to see if you get it to freeze. If you don't, then try turning on a few extensions at a time until you find where the freezing is happening.

You may also want to increase the memory allocated to VW. I suggest increasing the preferred to about 80,000k.

If you have Virtual Memory turned on, you may want to turn it off as a test.

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Katie, Problem solved there seems to have been a conflict with th ATI Drive Updater and ATI Resource Manager Extensions. Doesn't make much sense, but I can run without 'em while I'm working.

Thanks

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