Beyond Renderworks

[carpalmer]

Renderworks produces rather basic renderings when compared to higher end rendering softwares (lighting - shadow, textures, 3 d shapes quality, etc, etc.), plus it takes FOREVER when you put more than a few (five?) light sources, I have never even ventured into radiosity... since some of my Custom Renderworks take over 12 hrs... I know about cutting down light sources, and other ways to simplify rendering, but some of the renderings are intrincicly complicated (ie: not a shoe box with one light source). I have been a user for over 18 years and have latest VW

version and high end computer, and I am now interested in getting better renderings. So what are the suggestions, Cinema 4D? What is the latest in VW / Maxon plug in? Just visited Maxon site and there's NO mention of VW workflow (although they have a demo video for Archicad and Allplan...) Also, since Nemetschek now owns Maxon, can we expect some technology transfers and SERIOUS improvements to Renderworks?

Interested in what other VW users opinions and expectations on this subject.

thx

carpalmer

[cad@sggsa]

Which version of VW do you have? VW12??

I have been having the same frustration, was told I need more RAM. And would be good to upgrade...but wait vor VW2009 rather, then getting VW2008.

When I was on on VW10 I rearly had Rendertime problems, but the quality was not the best in being realistic although you use good textures. From what I,ve seen from VW2008 Renders, it looks like it is getting to a level that others have reached already. Saw a Render using AutoCad and 3D-Max...looked like a photo.

[grant_PD]

I've started the process of moving over to c4d and found it to be rather easy. Things map properly, and the renderings are far superior.

[G_Hannigan]

The latest VW Exchange plug in is for VW2008-C4D 10.5. C4D R11 will be released shortly, meaning that a new plug in will probably be required for VW2009-C4D 11, usually a wait of several months.

NNA (Vectorworks) and Maxon (C4D) are subsidiaries of Nemetschek AG. I wouldn't expect to see much,if any, transfer of rendering technology from Maxon to NNA.

The Exchange Plug in seems to work better with the more recent versions of C4D. I've had problems going from VW 12.5 Arch to C4D 10.111, but C4D 10.5 seems better. I've also exported as 3ds from VW and opened in C4D(including R11 demo) with good results.

gh

[Tobias]

The latest VW Exchange plug in is for VW2008-C4D 10.5. C4D R11 will be released shortly, meaning that a new plug in will probably be required for VW2009-C4D 11, usually a wait of several months.

gh

Is there official news that VW2009/C4D R11 needs an new exchange plugin? I could be waiting for that to upgrad VW ( and C4D)

[G_Hannigan]

Is there official news that VW2009/C4D R11 needs an new exchange plugin? I could be waiting for that to upgrad VW ( and C4D)

Nothing official. Historically, a new plug in has been required when VW and or C4D versions change. The plug in has been provided to Maxon by a third party - don't know if this is still the case.

There is an Architect Edition of C4D that includes the VW (and other) plug ins. The R11 Arch Edition release date has yet to be announced.

I spoke with Steve Ridley at Maxon last week about upgrade options. Here is his contact info:

Steve Ridley

Manager, Direct Sales

MAXON Computer, Inc.

(phone) 877-226-4628 x5133

(fax) 805-376-3331

gh

[gScott]

once you figure your way around the weird interface ArtLantis is ridiculously faster + better than RW...

but one of the nice things about RW being built-in is that you can change the model + regenerate the image pretty quickly in VW if you keep the lighting simple.

it's a toss-up, though, whether it's worth upgrading RW next time now that i've tried artlantis...

[Christiaan]

once you figure your way around the weird interface ArtLantis is ridiculously faster + better than RW...

That about sums up our experience, although one could argue that the Renderworks interface is far more complex than Artlantis; an inherent problem of shoe-horning a renderer into a CAD app in my opinion.

[LMS]

We gave up beating our head against the wall with RW back at version 12....went with artlantis and piranesi, depending on what look we were after. much faster with better results, which is important for those of us that have deadlines to meet and more than one project on the books.

[BrendanFella]

I have been reading the above posts with great interest.

I was just getting the hang of VW/RW v12.5 and my co. just got the 2009 version (still to be installed)

Question, what is artlantis? Is it a totally diff. product than Renderworks?

[Ray Libby]

http://www.google.com/search?q=artlantis&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

[carpalmer]

Brendanfella:

Artlantis is a stand alone program, look it up in the web

http://www.artlantis.com/

carpalmer

[BrendanFella]

Thank you Ray and Carpalmer,

Will check it out

Brendan

[DonM]

Get ARTLANTIS ... it ten times faster, get really great results, allows for lighting effects through time etc... but as Gideon says its a bit weird working around the interface a the beginning, but once you get the hang of it, its a piece of cake ....it really produces fast good quality images + the fact that the Studio version allows you to move objects (cars etc) around the model when you make movies...

[DonM]

By the way if you want to get really nasty with rendering effects (smoke, lightning flashes, splashes and other kinky rendering stuff .... like People n' Motion and what not get Strata 3d studio .... a little on the slow side too but can produce great presentations ... you need to exports through Vectorscript using classes and assign materials to each class when you import but you get great control over the textures and so forth.... used it for years but as I said before fro basic GOOD presentatiosn use Artlantis ....

[cad@sggsa]

donm

With Strata 3d studio is it possible to create a render of lets say a stage concert looking very realistic, almost bringing it to life so to speak??

[M.CH]

For stage visualisation, ESP Vision is hard to beat.

There is a VW plug-in and as with Artlantis, changes made in VW can be updated in the ESP/Artlantis files without having to make any other changes, lighting and rendering settings etc stay the same.

Artlantis is a stand alone programme, but requires 3D files to input prior to rendering and animating etc.

http://artlantis.com/

ESP Vision is also a stand alone programme that also allows programming of lighting desks, lighting plots, and anything else happening in a stage environment.

http://www.espvision.com/

Also of note the Opening and Closing Ceremony at the Beijing 2008 Olympics was modeled in VectorWorks and visualised in ESP Vision

http://www.espvision.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1224716820&archive=&start_from=&ucat=&

[grant_PD]

But can ESP vision produce photo realistic renderings? Renderworks doesn't really either. Just a point worth noting.

[Jershaun]

Hi everybody, very interesting topic.

My personal view is although RW is slow, it's well intergrated into VW and is worth getting even if it's just for colouring the elevations or putting some textures in Sketch Mode, anyway that's what I use it for. Also for quick visuals. I also use it for export options to C4D.

I don't doubt Artlantis is a good renderer, however IMHO, C4D is a much better option for partnership with VW. It's more flexible in terms of modeling freeform objects like sloping landforms, etc., it can import more material out on the web and it can animate objects (eg. a man walking) for high end animations such as movies like Monster House and Open Season and with BodyPaint it can apply textures/materials with basically a paint brush (eg. Your own painting on a wall or weather steaks in areas you want). It also has received Macworlds Editors Choice with 5 out of 5 stars. In addition, it has options of using other rendering engine's such as Vray and Maxwell IF you're still not satisfied with it's more than capable and improved built in rendering engine. So as I said, much more options hence more flexible.

That's my 2 cents.

[cad@sggsa]

Is it just me or is there a problem with the download of the demo for ESPVision version 2.2??

[Ariel]

Can anyone confirm if the C4D exchange plugin works with VW2009 and C4D rel 10? How about VW2009 and C4D rel 11?

Just playing safe before making the upgrade from VW2008. Thanks.

Ariel

[Jershaun]

The existing plug-in for vw2008 and c4d10 works with vw2009 and c4d10. It should work with c4d11-I don't see any problems there. However I tested this with a demo version of vw2009 (I think I'll wait for vw2010) so take this with a pinch of salt .

[Luis M Ruiz]

Vectorworks 2009 does export to Cinema 4D, it is a two step process, first you install the plugins inside Vectorworks and add some into Cinema 4D so they communicate perfect, you can set up your export settings to classes, layers or colors.

[jcooper]

It seems that Artlantis is geared more towards Architecture. I use VW for Industrial Design only. I downloaded the demo and it doesn't seem that useful for this application and they don't have relevant surface materials available.

Does anyone have recommendations on a 3rd party software to improve renderings for ID application?

[dr paaj]

CINEMA 4D Architecture edition or the Engineering Edition... Depending on what for a libraries and modules you want.