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deljones

Musical Symbols

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Hi All,

Active user of Spotlight and have purchased the spotlight training CD which shows a piano symbol etc.. as one of the tutorials. Where can I obtain symbols like this, drum kits etc.

Many thanks

Derek

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Spotlight 2008 contains several musical symbols, Pianos, Lectures, Music Stands, Podiums, Drum Kits etc.

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Spotlight 2008 contains several musical symbols, Pianos, Lectures, Music Stands, Podiums, Drum Kits etc.

How about for those of use that aren't interested in 2008?

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Spotlight 2008 contains several musical symbols, Pianos, Lectures, Music Stands, Podiums, Drum Kits etc.

Does it? Where?

(I can't wait to see a user to flip the grand piano so that it fits the layout...)

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(I can't wait to see a user to flip the grand piano so that it fits the layout...)

They already did that at least once. Back in MiniCAD 4/5/6 (I don't remember exactly which one), the grand piano symbol shipped with the long side on the right.

Pat

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The file is called Audio and is in the spotlight object library.

Steve Ross

Lighting Designer

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Is there a piano symbol(s) available for Architect?

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38 minutes ago, Ian M. said:

Is there a piano symbol(s) available for Architect?

 

When I search for "piano" in the Resource Manager I get a mix of 13 - 2d or 3d piano symbols. It looks like they may all be part of the Entertainment library files.

Kevin

 

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@Kevin McAllister Thank you for taking the time to answer my question.

 

It turns out that I needed to download the "SpotlightLibraries - Entertainment Objects Libraries" via the Help_Download Content menu. 

Piano.pdf

Edited by Ian M.
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I see some new drum kit symbols were recently added to Service Select.

 

1972076966_ScreenShot2018-12-05at12_13_27AM.thumb.png.e267f89cc9c3e8211e549868e0870c6a.png

 

I apologize in advance for saying this, but did the person who made these ever see a real life drum kit? Did they not research drum kits? Not a single one of the three pictured symbols bears any resemblance to reality. (Not talking about level of detail, but literally just general proportions, placement, how stands work, etc). It's good to keep it simple, but it shouldn't be wrong.

 

I can accept the fact that some of the older library content leaves a bit to be desired, but to release these new drum kits in 2018 to "Service Select" is a bit embarrassing. Vectorworks is professional software and deserves professional-level libraries (which in other cases it succeeds at).

 

Sorry 😄

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we duplicated those layouts directly from a drum company website.  also, all the parts are individual symbols so you can lay out any drum setup you want.

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11 hours ago, Andy Broomell said:

1972076966_ScreenShot2018-12-05at12_13_27AM.thumb.png.e267f89cc9c3e8211e549868e0870c6a.png

Not a single one of the three pictured symbols bears any resemblance to reality. (Not talking about level of detail, but literally just general proportions, placement, how stands work, etc). It's good to keep it simple, but it shouldn't be wrong.

 

I think the challenge here is that resources need to be good for more than visualization. My primary use of this type of symbol would be for confirming spacing (I once had to investigate if we had made a riser big enough for this famous Canadian drummer - link). At first glance I would say none of the stands in these drum kits would actually stand up. When I look at the Pearl and Mair website all of the stands are setup with their legs fully extended. For me the outside footprint (in this case the legs) has to be accurate or its not really worth modelling something like this.

 

Kevin

 

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Since Vectorworks employees are not drummers, it is probably best to ask the drummer in question how they set up their drum kits. Every drummer is going to do it differently.

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And hence why we gave everyone not just the set-ups but also all the individual parts so that drummers could set up just how they like it, but also in the preliminary state, a general kit could be placed for the impression of the kit on the stage.  I have tried not to limit the user when the Spotlight content team makes something that has multiple layout options.

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You are right that the placement is easy to adjust by moving around individual symbols 🙂

 

That being said... the individual elements aren't even right. Placement aside, give us cymbals on accurately-sized stands, a floor tom that's the correct proportions, mid and high toms that are the correct proportions and that attach to the top of the kick drum, a kick drum that's the right proportions, a snare drum that are the right proportions, etc.

 

So first we need to start out with better symbols. In all honesty, these look like someone just 'guessed'.

 

Now back to layout... I looked on Pearl and Mair drum websites and didn't see the layouts mentioned above, but I have have missed them. Maybe I'm crazy, but in 15 years as a percussionist I've never seen a set-up that resembles any of those included in the new library. For what it's worth, most kits start with the same layout of kick, snare, hi-hat, 2-3 toms, and a cymbal or two, which then gets added to as the number of pieces grows. But that baseline set-up isn't anywhere to be found in this library. In fact most of the included layouts aren't even playable (looking particularly at the snare and hi-hat relationship, for example). And there are weird attachment methods in some of the set-ups that don't exist in real life. So while I'm not suggesting that the library include every possible layout, the ones it includes should at least be somewhat realistic.

 

I truly don't mean to be rude; I just don't understand how we end up these weird toy-looking things in what should be a professional, usable library of a common thing. 😕

 

Edit: Adding an image of that basic set-up mentioned above. 95% of drum kits look like this, or start as this and then get additional toms and cymbals:

drumkit.thumb.jpg.6f0a30458201829a09e625005b6fdadf.jpg

 

If this is somewhere to be found in the new library and I missed it, my apologies. Or if there are other drummers on here that can point out that what I've written is way off base, that would welcome as well. 🙂

 

 

Edited by Andy Broomell

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I'm sort of curious why NV wouldn't just rent a drum kit for reference while you're modelling it..... (sort of holds true for all sorts of library items). It would be way easier to take some real world measurement than work off a sales brochure.

 

Kevin

 

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8 hours ago, Kevin McAllister said:

I'm sort of curious why NV wouldn't just rent a drum kit for reference while you're modelling it..... (sort of holds true for all sorts of library items). It would be way easier to take some real world measurement than work off a sales brochure.

 

Kevin

 

Our area is not big enough to have storage for all the things we model.  not to mention, that sometimes it is weeks or months before we get freed up to work on a particular library, or we work on it as a change from working on something else so it is over months to get it all together.  it is easier to work off the cut sheets as those can be stored on a computer.  We also expect that the manufacturer would have accurate drawings of their products.  

 

9 hours ago, Andy Broomell said:

Edit: Adding an image of that basic set-up mentioned above. 95% of drum kits look like this, or start as this and then get additional toms and cymbals:

drumkit.thumb.jpg.6f0a30458201829a09e625005b6fdadf.jpg

that is actually the original drum kit that is in the Previous Drum Library folder.

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Just for fun I thought I would post some screen shots of the symbols (and cymbals for that matter) I've made for this purpose.  All 3D elements are pretty simple.  All circles are 12 sided polys, and hardware are all 4 sided polys which minimizes render times significantly.  All are accurately sized.  The finish on the standard kits is a white fade and it is set up so that I can edit the 3D component and select any shell which will select all of them in a group, change the color in the attributes menu and you can immediately change the color of the entire kit.  These are the things I do when I need a break from real work....  

golivepro drums front.png

golivepro drums plan.png

golivepro drums top.png

Edited by scottmoore
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Sell those as a kit Scott and a bunch of us would buy them. I know I would. I have a standard kit I use, but it's not as nice as those. 

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48 minutes ago, scottmoore said:

Just for fun I thought I would post some screen shots of the symbols (and cymbals for that matter) I've made for this purpose.  All 3D elements are pretty simple.  All circles are 12 sided polys, and hardware are all 4 sided polys which minimizes render times significantly.  All are accurately sized.  The finish on the standard kits is a white fade and it is set up so that I can edit the 3D component and select any shell which will select all of them in a group, change the color in the attributes menu and you can immediately change the color of the entire kit.  These are the things I do when I need a break from real work....  

 

These are fantastic Scott. In a video I linked to about C4D recently (link here) the speaker talked about how important personal projects were to a designer's sanity. Sounds like you use them in the same way. Your work is very inspirational to see!

 

Its sort of what this wishlist item was all about - 

 

I agree with Evan that your kits definitely have market value. Good for both rendering and for working drawing use.

 

I'd also be curious to learn a little more about your texturing approach.

 

Thanks for sharing!

 

Kevin

 

 

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Thank you guys. I have created a substantial library of standard musical instruments (keyboards, pianos, drums, percussion, amplifiers and guitars that fit this same profile. I could spend a bit of time cleaning up line weights and sell a package if people are interested. 

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