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user defined 'objects' ?

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He did, earlier in the thread.

The official representative of toxic dumps seems to have a problem with people who actually know something.

Maybe he can tell us how easy it is to create parametric objects in Revit? This is something even I don't know.

Don't be shy, Mr. Expert: let us hear!

Edited by Petri
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Well it isn't hard to find something negative to say about New Jersey,

but it also isn't hard to simply read the posts and the responses to the questions asked.

I'm not sure who you're referring to as mr. expert but I thought the general gist was laid out in several extensive posts.

If you want further information, go to the autodesk website and follow the links.

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I'm curious about this as well. I think we need to define what a PIO actually does as opposed to how it is created? To my simple mind a PIO is simply a device to allow a user to create a 3D and 2D object by entering in parameters (width, height, number of parts etc etc), and, importantly, to attach non visual data to (like cost, manufacturer, U value etc).

VectorWorks already provides a huge library of PIOs which can be adapted to many needs. Furthermore these PIOs can be broken down to component 3D parts and "tweaked" to give exactly the 3D data that is needed - VW is actually a fairly powerful 3D modelling application - the 3D interface is just poor at the moment.

So, the process of generating the 3D elements needed is actually fairly simple if you combine a PIO with existing 3D tools. The issue is then that the resultant 3D object is just a dumb 3D object that cannot be converted back into a PIO for easy tweaking of parameters. The non visual data can still be tagged - so that is not an issue.

The other problem is that all VW PIOs and indeed 3D do not interact with the data in a way other than simple adding and calculation of volumes and surface area. For example you cannot swap one window PIO with another and then have VW automatically calculate updated U values (well if you can I'm not aware how!).

So the question is what are the PIOs being used for in your projects. If they are intended for use in a full on 3D CATIA like BIM environment then you can start weeping now. If, on the other hand, you want to generate objects that can be added to models and drawings to which you can tag data and use for worksheets and reporting then VW is extremely flexible, providing you with (probably) the best all round 3D modelling tools in a production AEC system at the price point, and ways of manipulating the data side in a flexible format.

From my point of view, the supplied PIOs do a good job but there are always cases where the detailing is not right - especially in sections and wall joins. The other issues is the placement of PIOs in relation to each other and in relation to other objects. I think this is where Revit and Archicad are far superior (from my limited exposure to both). On the one side VW is easy to drag parts around, on the other hand if you go changing things it takes more remedial work to repair.

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Maybe I'm missing something...

For the 'extensive' 3d library let's use the doors as an example: Ea. door is simply a variation on the parameters of one door PIO, correct? It simply automates the arduous task of having to place ea. door PIO in the project then go through ea. parameter and change it?

This holds true for everything in the library? windows, cabinets, etc.?

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Why is there a need then for WinDoor?

Because NNA's implementation is not powerful enough and broken in some respects, such as the sills in 3D and 2D.

As with many features in VectorWorks the Win/Door PIO has been designed with the McMansion market in mind, at the detriment of those who need to deviate from McMansions with bay windows, insulated cavity closers, control of material of each pane, support for tilt 'n' turn windows, continuous windows in high-rise, etc.

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Does anyone have an example of a PIO they created that they could share the script/process with me?

I've started reading through the VS manual, but feel like some actual examples are going to be needed to get to the next step.

thank you

Here is an example of a script for a path based PIO (most of the data is maintained as an editable polyline) The PIO has 3 text parameters- FirstLabel, PIOType, and Prefix that were created in the PIO editor.

Because it is a path based PIO, creation is like creating a polygon. In practice, you place vertices over your doors, windows, or rooms in the order you would like them labelled, enter the starting number, the PIO type you are labeling (Door, Window, etc.), and any prefix you want. The labeler will then label them. If you forget one, you use the polyline edit tool to add a vertex where you want it. You can use this labeler with any object as long as it has an IDLabel field (the record is irrelavent) attached to it. It is more of a meta PIO and isn't actually doing much drawing.

Note: This script uses library files that I haven't included, so it won't actually run. If you really want them I can supply them.

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