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Creating Site Model - Doesn't work


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I have been trying to figure out for hours how to create a site model and I am beyond frustrated. Here are my problems:

1. I drew 2D polygons from a survey and then tried to convert them to 3D polygons. In that process it skipped randomly to different lines so I had to do the math and figure out which elevation height I was at. How specify which line to start with and then have it go to the next line, etc. from there.

2. After I did all the math and created the 3D polygons. (Took 2 hours to get 30 lines from 2D to 3D because it randomly jumped to lines....not cool) I went to Create Site Model in the terrain menu. I went through all the step and when I clicked done there was nothing to be see but an outline of the model. I can't find any 3D model and my 3D polygons were still there. I have tried all kinds of things but the same results happened. What am I doing wrong? This has gotten so complicated from the previous versions of VW. I have been using VW for 10 years and have done many 3D models...I am stumped on this one.

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Do all my 3D polygons have to be closed? This may be my problem. I have just drawn lines, but maybe they need to be closed objects? Also I did the Validate 3D Data and it said I have overlapping lines. I did this because there is a retaining wall on the survey. The topo lines are on top of each other because of a straight vertical rise at that point. I wanted my model to show that, but it won't work if my lines overlap. Does this make sense?

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seh2007: a couple pointers. The Convert 2d polys to 3d contours command is NOT random. It will highlight the polys in the order in which they were created. So, if you are tracing (and I do this a lot), I find it best best to start with the poly which has the lowest elevation and work in order to the highest. Also, you can change the "z" value of the 3d polys (contours) after they are created simply by changing the number in the object info palette. There is a way to "fool" the program as to the order of creation: select all the original polys (in sequence from lowest to highest) then Copy and Paste in Place. You should find that upon running the 2d polys to 3d contours the polys will highlight in the order of selection (in the previous step).

As far as not being able to see the site model, I suspect two things: first, what do you have selected in the two "display setting" pulldowns (the ones that say "show existing/show proposed/no 3d/etc)? Second, if you select the site model then click on "site model settings" (in the Object Info Palette) there is a button called "Graphic Properties". Check out all the options there...

Hope that helps... BTW, Although there are still a few odd things with site models, IMO this version is so much better than the prior one(s) that it makes it very worthwhile.

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Wow, thank you for the insight. I feel like this can be more powerful than previous versions, but it is not intuitive. I don't know how long it would have taken me to figure out that I had to draw the contours in order and I didn't read anything like that in the manual.

In the 2D display setting I have "existing only / 2D contours". In the 3D display setting I have "existing only/3D Extruded Contour". It doesn't seem to like 3D Extruded Contour. It renders nothing. I can get it to render a mesh now, but it simply refuses to render 3D extruded contour. Thanks for your help!

-Sarah Heller, AIA

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I see the error in the documentation about this subject and have alerted for this to be fixed in the next documentation issue.

We apologize for the inconvenience.

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As for the rendering issue -- check to see if you have the Site Model on the same layer as the polygons. If you do, and the polygons have a solid fill, the polys will block out the site model.

The better approach to take is to class the 2D polys and turn the class off when viewing the site model. Another approach is to put the Site Model on another layer.

I typically take the second approach and use a layer called "Data" for the polygons and another layer called "Model" for the Site Model. I also class the objects in more complex projects.

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Katie,

I have separated into layers as you recommended and the 3D model is working now. One more problem I seem to be having is when I change the model settings and then click "update" the model will not reflect the change unless I move the model around. Are other people have trouble with a non-responsive update button?

Thanks for the help,

Sarah Heller, AIA

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Katie,

I have separated into layers as you recommended and the 3D model is working now. One more problem I seem to be having is when I change the model settings and then click "update" the model will not reflect the change unless I move the model around. Are other people have trouble with a non-responsive update button?

Thanks for the help,

Sarah Heller, AIA

I have also noticed this behavior with site model objects. I moved the object to see if I had an overlapping object that might be hiding my edits. I didn't have overlapping objects, but moving the model updated the change.

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Sarah -

What OS are you using?

Jodyb17 -

Are you still running 10.4.8 or have you since updated to 10.4.9 or 10.4.10 ?

Try updating to at least 10.4.9 (if not already) as well as running disk utility and see if the problem is resolved.

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I got an e-mail with the answer from Tech Support this morning. This is what he did to solve the problem.

"The reason why it is not updating is because you have removed the original contours (3d polys) from the drawing."

I sent just the terrain model and deleted all other layers to tech support. He put 3D polys back in and it worked just fine. The 3D polys do not have to be on the same layer either. This information should be included in the manual if it is not already.

Now that I finally have a model that is working now I am using site modifyers to create pads. The manual says that I can turn a polyline into a site modifyer by going to Modify>Convert>Object from Polyline. This would be fantastic but in my version of VW 12.5.2 it is not in the options of things that you can convert to...Where did it go? That would be soooo useful.

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Here is the next issue concerning "pads" in the terrain model. I have a swimming pool in a hillside. I created a pad at the pool deck level. Looks great. I now need to cut out the actual pool from the deck level. I can't create a pad within a pad in order to have the pool floor be at a lower level. The reason I am trying to do this is because I want to decrease the fill calculation by subtracting the volume of the pool. Is there a better way to do this than my approach?

Thank you.

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Sarah, In terms of "pad within pad" the answer is "yes & no". You CAN create pads inside of other pads IF they are completely inside (ie NOT overlapping), so in effect you are creating concentric squares (or rectangles or whatever). The pads can be impossibly close to each other (like .01 inches!) but make sure they don't touch!. Think of this like TOPOG lines that define a hill. ALSO, remember (and this took me a loooong time to get) that you can, and usually should, use a single FENCE to surround multiple PADS. Again, be careful that the PADS are all entirely with the fence (and not touching it). Again the FENCE can be impossibly close to the edge of the pad(s), to show a vertical cut, or very far away to show a graded slope. More than anything it takes a lot of trial and error, but once you get it it's irreplaceable!

One further note: if when you select a polygon and go to MODIFY>OBJECTS FROM POLYLINE and "Site Modifier" is not in the list, you might try adding it to your workspace via the workspace editor...

Hope all of this helps! P

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