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M_Fedoruk

Visual Cues

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It's been awhile since I've been on here but I have a question since I recently upgraded both Vectorworks (v10 to v12) and my Mac (Powerbook G4 to Macbook Pro). It's more of an annoyance than anything else. Under v10, Vectorworks would show visual cues so that you could tell which lines had been selected - an example would be two lines representing a corner; if you chose one line it would be highlighted with a small white dot at each end and if you chose both lines, the intersecting corner would show two dots at the corner. Now, in Vectorworks v12, we have a coloured dot (nice touch) at each end but only one dot representing the intersecting corner. At larger scales there is no way to tell which line has been selected unless you zoom out or play hit-and-miss. Am I missing something here. Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

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Not sure why you would have difficulty selecting the desired line. Just click on some point other than the endpoint. Sometimes I change the color of the selected object to be sure what I have selected.

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I understand what you mean and this is by design. The selection handle size and color was changed in VW12 to make it easier to see.

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Okay, I think we're going backwards here. Previous versions of Vectorworks allowed one to see which lines were selected (including versions v4, v5, v6, v7, v8, and v10 - all of which I still have and running on my PowerBook G4). As an example, take 2 lines that intersect, have them "join without trim" and you have 4 lines that intersect at one point, zoom in until you can only see the intersection and not the other ends, now pick a line or two, go answer the phone and come back and look at the 4 lines - there are no cues aside from the one "handle" at the intersection and it doesn't tell you if you have one, two, three, or four lines picked (the other versions of Vectorworks/Minicad did) - my only options appear to be zoom-out or a hit-&-miss approach. Why take away what worked for over ten years?

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You saw 3 or 4 handles only when the end points did not sit right on top of each other, likely because a snap to grid/points was not turned on.

The behavior of VW 12 is actually a better technology since end points don't cancel themselves out (like in all previous versions of VW), they are larger and are in a color other than black. (They are still white when a selected object resides on a layer other than the active layer, as has been the case for as long as I can remember.)

I think what you are wanting, which is currently on our wish list, is to get some other feedback that a line is selected such as the object is highlighted or has a temporary color change to signify the object is selected - other than the selection handles.

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The points DO sit on top of each other. I always have the snap to grid/points turned on. The points do not cancel each other out, they shift slightly in tne direction of the line while slightly overlapping (I've checked this out with v4, v5, v6, v7, v8, v10 and they all react the same). Again, take two lines, join them together and you'll have four handles even if the two ends of each line run into each other. I think I'm not asking for a "wish" as much as a "bring it back". Please.

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An alternative to this problem would be for the selected objects to hilight, as other programs do it

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The points DO sit on top of each other. I always have the snap to grid/points turned on. The points do not cancel each other out, they shift slightly in tne direction of the line while slightly overlapping (I've checked this out with v4, v5, v6, v7, v8, v10 and they all react the same). Again, take two lines, join them together and you'll have four handles even if the two ends of each line run into each other. I think I'm not asking for a "wish" as much as a "bring it back". Please.

I have to say I just went into my copy of VW 11.5 and drew four lines and when they are all orginating from the same location and you select them all, there are four white dots (one for each line).

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The difference is that older versions of VW place the handle slightly inside the end of the line, where VW12 places the handle directly ON the line's endpoint. The older versions will often show two handles for touching endpoints, where VW12 will never show two handles for touching endpoints. BUT, for concurrent handles, the older software only showed a handle for odd numbers of endpoints, and no handle for even numbers. VW12 always shows a handle. That's an improvement.

I liked the placement of the handles in the older software better, but the bigger handles in the new software are easier to see. The bigger handles eat up more screen area, and obscure object detail in a drawing when many objects have selected points within a small area. With overlapping handles the drawing is easier to see.

It's a trade off. If you want big handles to see them more easily then you will have to live with overlapping handles. If you want separate handles, you will have to live with smaller handles.

Tough call. Perhaps we could get a highlight option that was controlled by a modifier key press - Cntl-Option or Shift-Option when pressed would temporarily color or thicken selected objects. It would be nice, but I can live happily with the program just the way it is ... or was.

Raymond

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I don't know how many people are running on version 12 or are waiting for 12.5 to switch to the Intel Macs, but I'm guessing there's a large number of people who will find that this "improvement" is not such a leap forward. Forgetting about the larger handles, we now have that will show that the top most line of 2 or more line sitting on top of each other is highlighted or all of those lines are highlighted (still doesn't indicate which is which). Now I'm sure there must be a reason why someone needs to know this but it is beyond me why you would trade in a method of visual cues for multiple lines for a weaker one? If you needed lines on top on each other isn't that what layers and classes are for? After all. the final product (at least for me and I assume most users) is a printed version (and those multiple lines will only print as one). Why can't we at least toggle the "features" between the old and new at least? This would at least give those that need the "feature" the choice.

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Really, REALLY, don't like the new set-up. Just tried picking out a series of 3 lines with one line touching the end points of the other two (forming a "U"). Could not tell if I picked that line or if it was the ends of the other two lines. Frustrating to think I have to organize the order in which I choose lines (couldn't choose ALL lines as there were other lines I didn't want to highlight just as I couldn't use the 2D selection tool for the same reason). Just had to vent...

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This will not completely satisfy your concern, but I have found the Object Info Palette useful when selecting multiple objects. When selecting objects, the OIP will indicate how many objects you have selected, which, when combined with the selection handle indications, often tells you whether or not you've gotten the selection right.

If I am not sure whether or not that line segment (which has other currently selected lines at both its endpoints) is included in my selection, I shift-click on the line in question while watching the object info palette to see the number of objects selected change. If the number of selected objects decreases by one when I shift-click on the line in question, I know it was included in the selection, so I simply shift-click once more and I know that I have it.

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