3d Locus does not Rotate about a point?

[Benson Shaw]

Another rotation hurdle. The Rotate Node works for many types of objects, but not for a 3d locus?

Or is there a method to rotate a 3d locus via the rotate node?

 

Circle created and rotated

 

 

Locus created, but did not rotate.

 

 

 

Here is my workaround using essentially create location via sin and cos 

 

-B

 

[Pat Stanford]

The Vectorscript/Python function the node is using does not work on Loci. Design Decision made many moons ago in the MiniCad days.

 

It does work on Groups. So you could check to see if the object is a Loci, if so, group it, Rotate, Ungroup.

[Benson Shaw]

@Pat Stanford - Ja. Good idea! Thanks!

 

I wonder about that MiniCad design decision idea. The workspace tools and commands seem to work as expected with 3d Loci.

 

Not to take away from Pat's tip, but this seems a workaround. How would Marionette users (especially inexperienced ones) know to do that conversion.  Is that perhaps addressed somewhere in those multiple hours of intro videos?

 

 

Thanks again, Pat

-B

[Pat Stanford]

If you select the Rotate 3D node and then click the Description button in the OIP, it tells you exactly what types of objects the node works on.  I just wanted to know why, so I looked at the script. Turns out it used the Set3DRot vector script function (that has been around since Minicad). And the Vectorscript Function Reference has the same list of the types of objects it works on.

 

Programming (even using Marionette) is always an issue of understanding the limitations of what the code can do.

[Benson Shaw]

@Pat StanfordThanks for looking and commentary.  Those such as yourself with loads of experience in the underlying VS might find and understand the limitations.  I look at the Rotation node description and see nothing that indicates a 2d or 3d locus would not be an acceptable object for action by the node.

Maybe there is some mathematical or VS argument that a 3d locus is NOT an object? (A locus is only a location? One is not a prime number? String theory and multiple universes are . . . um . . . something?)

 

 

I am not versed in VS. That Set3dRotation line in the node script is not informative for me. (not your fault!)

 

@Marissa Farrell is kindly reviewing some of these older nodes to update descriptions, scripts, user friendliness, etc.  This presents hope for me and other occasional Marionette dabblers that I will have easier rout to success in future!  I think Marionette is really cool and full of potential, but only implement it occasionally. And usually run into roadblocks. To the forum I go! Thanks all!

 

-B

[Pat Stanford]

I was talking about the description for the Rotate 3D node.

 

 

Under the hood, the Rotate node uses the same Vectorscript function for non-planar objects as the Rotate 3D node, therefore the exclusion of loci.

[Benson Shaw]

Doh! Rotate 3d! Either way got it to work with the Group idea.  Thx again

 

-B

[Antonio Landsberger]

"Angles are in Radians" has already been reported (https://jira.vectorworks.net/browse/VB-169146) a while (almost 5 years) ago.

[Benson Shaw]

Also not clear why 3d loci are not on list of "acceptable" objects.  Loci from 3d tool set respond as expected to the Rotate 3d command in the Modify menu.  If I understand properly, the  Rotate 3d command somehow incorporates that same Set3dRotation script?   Something about a locus seems counter to the script.  Or maybe script could be modified to include the 3d loci?  Meanwhile, group it! And, I'm off to slider questions

 

-B

[Antonio Landsberger]

Benson,

In general when it comes to scripting and objects in Vectorworks, I would advice everyone to first do all computations mathematically and then move or create objects in the drawing pane. With 2D and 3D loci I would simply set new coordinates (after the calculation) using the Move node.

[Pat Stanford]

No real information, but likely that the original thought was that loci are used as "layout locations" and therefore should not respond to menu commands to move them. At that time loci were used for things like the center  of a sweep and the center point of a mirror.

 

And once things get set in a programming language, they are hard to change. Change it to do what you want and how many other scripts that depended on the old functionality will be unknowingly broken.

 

You know it is not working, so do what you have to to make your script work as you want.

[Benson Shaw]

@Antonio Landsberger Thanks. That's basically what I am doing to move things forward, along with asking for others' help.  I'm not at all a scriptor/pythonista. Often my knowledge of trig and other maths can be applied to networks of existing nodes. With that, I'm often wishing some of the nodes behave more closely to the drawing space tools and commands.

 

@Pat Stanford 

On 6/11/2025 at 8:20 AM, Pat Stanford said:

the old functionality will be unknowingly broken

Absolutely. See also comments above by @Marissa Farrell regarding node updates and breaking networks.  My preferred solution would be to issue a brand new node with better functionality but with a new name, v2 suffix or the like.  This way the old node is available for replicating structure and function of older networks.  Witness the Enhanced Rectangle node by @DomC.

 

And, yes. Take an alternate path when network not working. A stop at the forum might help determine whether the problem is pilot error or node problem.  It was wild to see @Letti R cook up 3 alternate networks for rotation. I have since created another couple.

 

-B