VW2024 'Project Elevation' setting in Document Setup

[Tom W.]

It would be great to get some additional info on the new 'Project Elevation' setting in Document Setup. As far as I understand it, you can reference it in the marker layout in Elevation Benchmarks but that is the only part it plays in a document - is that correct? In Elev BMs what does it allow you to do that you couldn't do before? I have modified one of my existing Elev BMs so that it now uses the Project Elevation to return the same data, just in a different (albeit more straightforward) way but it would be good to see some other examples. None of the stock Elev BMs in the VW libraries are using the Project Elevation as far as I can see. Just interested to learn more. @SBarrettWalker? Thanks.

[Tom W.]

Ok I think I understand. I have set up a file to use Stories + I've edited my Elev BM so it's now getting all its values from the Story info plus the Project Elevation. Before, my Elev BM looked exactly the same but I was typing in a Reference Elevation plus a note. My Project Elevation is the real world elevation of the subfloor i.e. the zero for the model. So I guess if I need for whatever reason to raise the subfloor by 25mm I just edit the Project Elevation + the Story Elevation + the Elev BMs follow suite...

 

 

(Yes this is a single storey building! I just wanted to see how automatic Elev BM placement worked compared to adding them manually which I how I've done it until now).

[rDesign]

4 hours ago, Tom W. said:

None of the stock Elev BMs in the VW libraries are using the Project Elevation as far as I can see. Just interested to learn more.

It sounds like you have already figured it out, but over in this other thread Sarah Barrett posted additional EBM resources with relative benchmarks which were not included with the default Library in Vw2023.

 

 

[Tom W.]

Thanks @rDesign I did actually see that thread at the time + incorporated Sarah's 'fancy' IF/THEN statement into my EBMs (which makes me realise I should have already known about the ternary (@ Colon) operator that @Pat Stanford utilised in another thread recently, but that's another story...).

 

What I'm asking about though is the 'Project Elevation' setting in Document Setup which as far as I know is new to VW2024 so came after those posts. I have seen very little mention of it.

[Tom W.]

Ok I guess it (Project Elevation) allows you to say that your model has an elevation of such + such above sea level (+ return this in Elev BMs) when in fact the model has an elevation of zero in the file...? That would make sense. My models are given their real world heights so I can return that info from the model itself.

[Tobias Kern]

Hi,

 

In my experience, 'Project Elevation' is only related to the Elevation Benchmark.

 

I think it is a pity that 'Project Elevation' has not become a standard data field

so that you have general access with worksheets and data tags.

 

However, I have already communicated this and hope it will be made possible.

 

However, you could create your own database and store the same information

there and query the information like this:

 

=Formatfield('Record Name'; 'Datafield Name')

 

With this solution 'Project Elevation' would be universally usable!

 

LG Tobi

[Tom W.]

11 minutes ago, Tobias Kern said:

However, you could create your own database and store the same information

there and query the information like this:

 

=Formatfield('Record Name'; 'Datafield Name')

 

With this solution 'Project Elevation' would be universally usable!

 

I'm not sure I understand what you mean... Create a 'Project Elevation' Record? And attach it to object/s?

 

I was thinking that it would be good if you could link the Project Elevation to a Story Elevation (or rather bind a Story Elevation to the Project Elevation), but I don't really use Stories so perhaps I'm overlooking something.

[Tobias Kern]

Hi Tom,

 

yes, create an custom Record with a data field for 'Project Elevation'.

with =FORMATFIELD() you can have access to this information, even

if the Record isn't attached to an object.

 

If you update the standard data in the data field, you have to

update the worksheets as well.

 

… as far as my test are right, this could solve such situations

 

Greetings and Happy Easter

Tobi

[Tobias Kern]

If it is possible to transfer the Storey Elevation data to a worksheet,

you can link the data record there with this data.

Edited April 1, 2024 by Tobias Kern

[Tobias Kern]

It seems not possible to get Storey data with custom formulas.

 

 

[Tom W.]

21 hours ago, Tom W. said:

incorporated Sarah's 'fancy' IF/THEN statement into my EBMs

 

which I realise now in VW2024 you don't even need to do because there's a 'Show sign for non-negative values' checkbox in the 'Define Elevation Benchmark Field' dialog... That's very cool.

[line-weight]

On 3/31/2024 at 11:45 AM, Tom W. said:

It would be great to get some additional info on the new 'Project Elevation' setting in Document Setup.

 

I've arrived at this thread for the same reason as @Tom W. - there's not much in the VW help documentation to explain what this is.

 

Have I got it right: this is used to set the height above sea level of whatever as I choose as the zero Z value for my drawing?

 

Is this necessary to set, if I want georeferencing to work properly? In other words:

 

Say I set top of my subfloor as +0 in my drawing, then set the project elevation as +18.734m AOD, as per Tom W's example above.

 

Then I import something georeferenced, that is 20m AOD, that is going to appear a 1.3m above my subfloor level, not 20m above my subfloor level?

[line-weight]

It occurs to me that it would be useful to be able to tie some stuff to the "project elevation" and some stuff to the real world. For example, if I have a site model (or any already-existing buildings) once I have got them at the right height, they are never going to move.

 

However, through the course of a project it's very likely that I might want to adjust the height of the datum level for the new construction, relative to the outside world.

 

Therefore I am imagining that I could set my "project elevation" at some height above sea level, and then if halfway through the project I wanted to raise it by 100mm, I'd change the project elevation, and nothing would happen to any of my elevation benchmarks etc, but the whole building would raise relative to its as-existing context.

 

As far as I can see though, that's not how this works? If I change the project elevation then everything shifts (relative to the outside world) including things like site models?

[Tom W.]

As far as I know, like @Tobias Kern says, the Project Elevation setting is really only there to enhance the functionality of Elevation Benchmarks: it's another parameter you can use in EBM formulae. Not that this isn't really useful. But I don't think it has any bearing on anything else. In my example you quote above, the '18.734 AOD' is being read from the model, because that is the actual elevation of the subfloor in the model, and the '+0' is the elevation minus the Project Elevation value: since the Project Elevation for the file is 18.734m this gives me a zero value:

 

 

 

You could do this before of course it's just that the Project Elevation parameter gives you a better way of doing it.

[Tobias Kern]

Hey,

 

You can use that value in Data Tags for Elevation Benchmarks.

 

The value is unfortunately not available in Worksheets.

… but maybe I missed something.

 

Maybe it is possible to create an Record Format and

link the value with the Data Manager into a Data Field

in the Record Format.

 

I have to play around with that in the coming days.

 

Greetings from Germany

Tobi

[line-weight]

12 minutes ago, Tom W. said:

But I don't think it has any bearing on anything else. In my example you quote above, the '18.734 AOD' is being read from the model, because that is the actual elevation of the subfloor in the model, and the '+0' is the elevation minus the Project Elevation value: since the Project Elevation for the file is 18.734m this gives me a zero value:

 

I see.

 

So in your model, if you (for example) place a 3d locus on your finished floor level, then in the 3d locus's OIP it will show the elevation above sea level?

[Tom W.]

8 minutes ago, line-weight said:

 

I see.

 

So in your model, if you (for example) place a 3d locus on your finished floor level, then in the 3d locus's OIP it will show the elevation above sea level?

 

Yes. In this screenshot my cursor is resting on the finished floor + you can see the Z height in the bot RH corner is 18745:

 

 

I am quite happy modelling at real world elevation + real world angle to north.

[line-weight]

Thanks.

 

I sometimes use the Z value as a quick means of getting something at the right height. That's obviously more convenient if zero relates to something useful like floor level. Going to have to have a think about this.

[Tom W.]

In this file I'm also using Stories + the Story Elevation is 18734 too so I guess I'm kind of doing the same thing twice, in terms of setting the zero level once in the Story set-up then again in the Project Elevation. I think that's what I meant earlier in the thread where I said it'd be good to be able to link a Story Elevation to the Project Elevation so the one setting would affect things globally. 

[line-weight]

15 minutes ago, Tom W. said:

In this file I'm also using Stories + the Story Elevation is 18734

In which case you can just ask elevation benchmarks to report relative to storey elevation - so actually no need to have a formula to subtract project elevation from AOD elevation, is that right?

[Tom W.]

Just now, line-weight said:

In which case you can just ask elevation benchmarks to report relative to storey elevation - so actually no need to have a formula to subtract project elevation from AOD elevation, is that right?

 

Yes you're right. But it would rely on the file using Stories of course which I don't always do + also if you had multiple Stories would your EBMs be reading from different zero points as they moved up the building...? I am not that experienced with Stories or multi-storey buildings....

[line-weight]

31 minutes ago, Tom W. said:

 

Yes you're right. But it would rely on the file using Stories of course which I don't always do + also if you had multiple Stories would your EBMs be reading from different zero points as they moved up the building...? I am not that experienced with Stories or multi-storey buildings....

Not sure, as I do use storeys but only ever use one and put all layers in it.

[Tom W.]

34 minutes ago, line-weight said:

Not sure, as I do use storeys but only ever use one and put all layers in it.

 

Just did quick test. Created a first floor Story. This EBM is reading the elevation relative to Project Elevation (top value) + elevation relative to first floor story (bottom value):