Lighting Wiring

[Bobby B]

Apologies if this is covered somewhere I am missing...

 

I've been using VWX Spotlight for many years, but lately moved into architectural lighting design (using Revit heavily).

 

Is there a goto workflow in Vectorworks (using cable tools, or electrical tools) to represent simple wiring on lights for circuiting?

 

In Revit this is so simple with wiring tools (select lights, create circuit, and auto add wires as arced lines). The wires event move with the lights when re-aligning.

 

We are not in need of any other cable information on lights (the electrical contractor handles all that), this is purely for design representation like in attached screenshot (from Revit)

[cberg]

You have to move to the Benelux region... 

 

 

[Scott C. Parker]

Here's place to start. It's really basic at the moment. https://app-help.vectorworks.net/2024/eng/VW2024_Guide/MEP/Creating_a_circuit.htm#h

I think these are the right steps, but I've not tested step by step.
 

1. Open your Vectorworks project and navigate to the desired drawing where you want to create the room electrical layout.
2. Make sure you have the MEP toolset activated. You can do this by going to the top menu and selecting "Tools" > "Workspaces" > "Tool Sets" > "MEP".
3. In the toolset, locate and select the Circuiting tool. It should be represented by an icon resembling a plug and socket.
4. Click on the first electrical device or outlet that you want to include in the room electrical layout. This will be the starting point of your circuit.
5. If the selected device is a custom symbol without a Circuiting record attached, the tool will automatically attach the record to the symbol. You may need to specify whether it is an electrical or communication circuit.
6. The Circuiting Tool dialog box will open, allowing you to enter information for the circuit and the objects within the circuit. Fill in the desired information, such as circuit number, phase, and any other relevant details.
7. Continue clicking on the remaining devices or outlets in the order you want the circuit loop to be drawn. The tool will automatically connect them and assign circuit numbers accordingly.
8. To complete the circuit, click in an empty area of the drawing. A confirmation message may appear asking if you want to place the Home Run marker. Click "Yes" to place the marker.
9. The Circuiting tool will generate a Home Run marker and denote the phases as specified.
10. Repeat steps 4 to 9 for any additional circuits or devices you want to include in the room electrical layout.
11. Once you have finished creating the room electrical layout, save your work to ensure you don't lose any progress.

 

ConnectCAD is another route, but it's designed to make riser diagrams vs. room mapping and layouts.

[Scott C. Parker]

Being that you have a spotlight background, you could use the cable tools with single output "breakouts" for each outlet, etc...

[Scott C. Parker]

Something else a colleague suggested to explore. Could be an interesting rabbit hole.

 

[_James]

13 hours ago, bluelite said:

Is there a goto workflow in Vectorworks (using cable tools, or electrical tools) to represent simple wiring on lights for circuiting?

There doesn't appear to be but I really wish there was. Doing electrical plans is probably one of the biggest time commitments on a set of construction drawings now because it is all done manually.

[jcogdell]

If you have ConnectCAD check out the Cable sheet feature, it can produce this sort of cable plan.
As @Scott C. Parker says it isn't really designed for architectral/domestic power wiring but it can be easily adapted to do so since cabling sheets and riser diagrams are intended to be used to communicate with onsite electrical contratcors which means it has to use their standards.

 

[Tom W.]

12 minutes ago, jcogdell said:

If you have ConnectCAD check out the Cable sheet feature, it can produce this sort of cable plan.
As @Scott C. Parker says it isn't really designed for architectral/domestic power wiring but it can be easily adapted to do so since cabling sheets and riser diagrams are intended to be used to communicate with onsite electrical contratcors which means it has to use their standards.

 

 

If anyone was able to demonstrate this that'd be amazing. I have ConnectCAD + Spotlight + have often wondered whether there was anything there I could be utilising in an architectural context or at least having a play with .

[Peter Vandewalle]

@bluelite In our localised version (Design Express region) we have a tool that does exactly what you need. In Belgium, architects are used to drawing electric plans that look like the example you attached.

[E|FA]

4 hours ago, Peter Vandewalle said:

In our localised version (Design Express region) we have a tool that does exactly what you need.

What are the chances of the tool being available to users of other versions (e.g. USA)?

[Tom W.]

I am still intrigued to know how I could be doing it already using ConnectCAD... Would love to see an example from VW... Presumably there are plenty of other architecture practitioners like me who have Design Suite + are sitting on the software not using it...?

[Peter Vandewalle]

On 1/12/2024 at 6:34 PM, E|FA said:

What are the chances of the tool being available to users of other versions (e.g. USA)?

Years ago, we proposed the tool to the other distributors worldwide. The answer was that Vectorworks users (architects) never make these drawings. So they were not interested.

In Belgium, architects do make those plans.

[E|FA]

I don't know about anyone else in the US, but I've drawn the same kind of plans on just about every project I've worked on for 30 years.  My practice is primarily custom single family homes in the Seattle area.  I've been relying on using 2D symbols and polylines in annotations.

 

I'd be curious if VW USA could include the tool the same way they've added WinDoor.

[rDesign]

On 1/13/2024 at 11:40 AM, Peter Vandewalle said:

Years ago, we proposed the tool to the other distributors worldwide. The answer was that Vectorworks users (architects) never make these drawings. So they were not interested.

In Belgium, architects do make those plans.

The nugget of truth in here might be that Vw architect users never make these drawings because the Vw Circuit tool is so old and not easy to use. I don’t think the Circuit tool has been updated in a decade or more.

 

I’ve tried using the Circuit tools in Vw (Architect) several times over the years; I posted a question about how to use it on the forum and got zero response. I could not find any tutorials on how to properly use the tools.

Vw certainly didn’t ask any architect end users working in the U.S. if this is a need, because as an architect working on small single-family residential projects I always do the reflected ceiling plans, electrical outlet layouts, switching, etc. 

 

@bluelite - you can try using the Circuit tool as @Scott C. Parker suggested, but I found it incredibly frustrating to use. I don’t use the Circuit tool but instead just manually draw the circuit lines as 2D splines. I’m guessing that you will be frustrated with it based on what you said about the Revit workflow. My 2 cents. 

 

Edited January 15, 2024 by rDesign

[_James]

On 1/13/2024 at 7:40 PM, Peter Vandewalle said:

Years ago, we proposed the tool to the other distributors worldwide. The answer was that Vectorworks users (architects) never make these drawings. So they were not interested.

Wow. Architects in the UK make these drawings on most, if not all, projects. It would be good for VW to review this.

[Bobby B]

Thank you all for the input. I used ConnectCAD years ago when it was a plug in, but will give the Cable Sheet a look for sure.

 

I'd echo the sentiment to Vectoworks that there are some really basic electrical tools missing for the non-entertainment folks out there producing architectural design plans.

 

As Vectorwroks chases Revit in BIM functionality I think having some better options for (even simple) MEP layouts/schedules will be really important. 

 

Cable Tools as a designer...is just so overkill. I'm sure any architect would stay far away also 🙂

 

Thanks all

[Bobby B]

On 1/11/2024 at 5:37 AM, Tom W. said:

 

If anyone was able to demonstrate this that'd be amazing. I have ConnectCAD + Spotlight + have often wondered whether there was anything there I could be utilising in an architectural context or at least having a play with .

I'd second this...if anyone has a demo of this workflow in action.

[line-weight]

On 1/15/2024 at 8:56 AM, _James said:

Wow. Architects in the UK make these drawings on most, if not all, projects. It would be good for VW to review this.

I've come to this thread just to reinforce the above - in the UK architects absolutely do make these kinds of plans all the time. And doing them in VW is currently a little painful, because (other than some slightly elaborate workarounds discussed in other threads) they basically have to be done entirely manually.

[jcogdell]

ConnectCAD can create this sort of documentation, cabling sheets like shown above and riser diagrams showing where cable trays/conduit has to be installed.
Here is a ink to the ConnectCAD Cable planning guide, its a high level introduction but should atleast help you decide if it can help you.
https://university.vectorworks.net/pluginfile.php/135141/mod_scorm/content/1/scormcontent/index.html#/lessons/18OW1fOG5jk_474CkbrCQJbP-VImc1oQ

[line-weight]

1 hour ago, jcogdell said:

ConnectCAD can create this sort of documentation, cabling sheets like shown above and riser diagrams showing where cable trays/conduit has to be installed.
Here is a ink to the ConnectCAD Cable planning guide, its a high level introduction but should atleast help you decide if it can help you.
https://university.vectorworks.net/pluginfile.php/135141/mod_scorm/content/1/scormcontent/index.html#/lessons/18OW1fOG5jk_474CkbrCQJbP-VImc1oQ

That tutorial seems to focus on how cabling is dealt with - I think architects will generally be most interested in how fittings (lights, switches, sockets etc) can be represented. What we want is a sort of schematic plan, but overlaid on a scale drawing, so that the physical locations of the fittings are shown. Is there a tutorial that gives an overview of how that could look?

[jcogdell]

Yes ConnectCAD is primarily for AV install design and this part of it is primarily about cabling, but if you create your electrical component as schematic devices then you could get a schematic from it and then use them to create equipment items to add to the 3D model, or you could create them as drop points if you only want the cable route planning to help create the riser and cabling diagrams.
Both riser and Cabling diagrams are effectively specialised viewports so you can include other elements using class and layer visibilities, for example the floor plan for cabling sheets or the 3D wall model for a riser diagram.
I'm not sure if there is a specific turorial for just cable route planning but I cover part of it in the rack and panel webinar I did  while back, the webinar is focused on how ConnectCAD schematic is converted into a 3D design model
https://university.vectorworks.net/pluginfile.php/113920/mod_scorm/content/1/scormcontent/index.html#/lessons/8dsWbX8tbGeEiu5rKBo1XmQWZ8_NJeRz

[cberg]

Rather retool another product which is not intended for architectural design, why not acquire and localize the Benelux tool which does what users in this thread are requesting?

 

Or at least make it available for purchase as some sort of partner product?

 

It's frustrating that a solution exists but it is not available to the majority of VW users.

[jcogdell]

2 hours ago, cberg said:

Rather retool another product which is not intended for architectural design,

ConnectCAD is in a bit of an odd space as it stradles both the entertainment and AEC worlds. One of the primary use cases is working with Architects to plan things like building control systems.
The black box design process it uses for schematic devices means it is very easy to create devices to represent switches, plug sockets etc.. power is just another signal type as far as ConnectCAD is concerned.

 

 

2 hours ago, cberg said:

Or at least make it available for purchase as some sort of partner product?

I'll make some enquires and see if its possible,

[Tom W.]

4 minutes ago, jcogdell said:

ConnectCAD is in a bit of an odd space as it stradles both the entertainment and AEC worlds. One of the primary use cases is working with Architects to plan things like building control systems.
The black box design process it uses for schematic devices means it is very easy to create devices to represent switches, plug sockets etc.. power is just another signal type as far as ConnectCAD is concerned.

 

 

I'll make some enquires and see if its possible,

 

Is it possible to post some screenshots of the type of output it might generate that would be of interest to architects? I do intend to watch the videos, just be great to see something up front if you had anything to hand...?

Thank you

[cberg]

The challenge for architects using Connect CAD may be similar to using InteriorCAD's cabinetry suite rather than the updated VW2024 Cabinet Tool. 

 

The former is for highly technical production, and the latter is intended to show design intent and maybe a little bit more. Only a few very gifted architects can engineer their own electrical systems.  Most probably have a basic concept of how devices and lights should (generally) be circuited.  When the project gets too large, we would likely get a second professional opinion and some design assistance.  

 

The VW MEP Toolset has been forgotten (abandoned?) since around the year 2000.   At some point, these tools need to be modernized like the rest of the program.  This is a good opportunity to ask what tools would help the current (and future) user base.

 

 

 

Edited December 6, 2024 by cberg