Mark McCay-Moran
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Posts posted by Mark McCay-Moran
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Mark,
Aren't you going to have the same hardware issues with Autocad? I am assuming if VW2012 won't work on your current machine, neither will Autocad. It sounds like the first step is the machine, then you can give Autocad a trial run and perhaps also use the demo of Vectorworks 2012 as well.
VW 2012 runs fine under Lion. They advertise lots of improvements in the brochure but I find myself appreciating the lesser known ones. This has often been the case. I can't say I've used the new push pull stuff and I just find the automatic layer plane stuff in the way even though I work almost entirely in 3D. But I do appreciate the work with hidden line rendering (intersecting lines) and the amalgamation of many of the duplicate tools into a unified 2D/3D toolset. I experimented with Stories and it was fairly successful, though I don't specialize in architecture.
There is a lot more stability and functionality since VW2008. You can start to see the future with VW2012.
Kevin
Thanks for that, Kevin. Greatly appreciated! Yep ACad/Mac will require new computer, but at least I've already got the program. Part of what I was trying to get was some feedback from those who may have used or played around with ACad/Mac especially since I do architecture, and draw in 3d, and the only ACad available for mac is the vanilla flavor.
Also I was looking for VWA '08 functionality on Lion, not VW2012. Any thoughts?
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Thanks for that guys
Yes, windows is getting better and better. At some point it may even be so "mac-like" that I consider using it. However...
Amusing to see where this thread has gone, didn't mean to start a Mac vs. Wnds thing. FYI I will stick with Mac for numerous reasons, not least of which are: continuity btwn home/office/music studio, ease of use (kids included), coordination with other apple products (iPhone, iPods, iPad) and apps, and...being a designer, quality of product and design.
That said...
So I guess one burning question is... Is VWA 90% better than is was in 2008? As I stated earlier, there are always improvements to features, but is it that dramatically different, and if so, will 20years of MC/VW use not be of any value?Couple of items that would be truly useful if anybody could comment:
Will vwa/rw run on Lion if I ditch the upgrade and get a new computer for now?
For me VW has always been a program of "workarounds" especially in 3d. Are new wall tools, Dr/wnd objects, workflow really better? What about live sections? I know that's relative, but please give me your take.
Some previous pet peeves that I'm hoping have been addressed--use of polygon by lasso in VPs (for profiling elevations), hatching objects in 3d, cantankerous notes library, sectional control (visual), stability, file size.
Thoughts about AutoCad for Mac? Has anybody used? Weak? I'd rather be moving toward Revit for Mac if it was available.
I'm not looking to switch to ArchiCad (I've actually been down that road already). I don't want to switch to AutoCad, although its a decision I'm in the process of evaluating.
what I want to do is upgrade VW, but won't be able to run it on my current computers.
Anybody have some insight into some of the items mentioned above? Particularly the status of VW in its current form and usability of ACAD for Mac 2012?
Thanks again, mmm
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Mark, check into service select. this should keep upgrades manageable
I will, thanks for that.
Amusing to see where this thread has gone, didn't mean to start a Mac vs. Wnds thing. FYI I will stick with Mac for numerous reasons, not least of which are: continuity btwn home/office/music studio, ease of use (kids included), coordination with other apple products (iPhone, iPods, iPad) and apps, and...being a designer, quality of product and design.
That said...
So I guess one burning question is... Is VWA 90% better than is was in 2008? As I stated earlier, there are always improvements to features, but is it that dramatically different, and if so, will 20years of MC/VW use not be of any value?Couple of items that would be truly useful if anybody could comment:
Will vwa/rw run on Lion if I ditch the upgrade and get a new computer for now?
For me VW has always been a program of "workarounds" especially in 3d. Are new wall tools, Dr/wnd objects, workflow really better? What about live sections? I know that's relative, but please give me your take.
Some previous pet peeves that I'm hoping have been addressed--use of polygon by lasso in VPs (for profiling elevations), hatching objects in 3d, cantankerous notes library, sectional control (visual), stability, file size.
Thoughts about AutoCad for Mac? Has anybody used? Weak? I'd rather be moving toward Revit for Mac if it was available.
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So I guess one burning question is... Is VWA 90% better than is was in 2008? As I stated earlier, there are always improvements to features, but is it that dramatically different, and if so, will 20years of MC/VW use not be of any value?
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Going by memory with current pricing. My bad. ACAD for Mac is 4999.00 USD, Archicad 15 is 4250.00, but VWA/RW is almost 2900.00. Ouch. an additional seat is 2400.00 USD. Whoa.
So in 8 years VWA/RW has gone up over 90%, ArchiCad up around 25% and ACAD down almost 45%.
I was quoted 950.00 to upgrade to subscription to VWA/RW 2011 from 2008. I'm a little scared now to call and find out what I'll have to put up for 2012. This will definately influence my decision, especially if I have to spend more on my software package than the computer to run it, which has never happened in the 14 years I've been in business for myself.
Going back to hand drawing sounds like less of a joke now.
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3) Go back to hand drawing...
Had to chuckle at this, yes, I'm old enough to have started out hand drafting. Interestingly, the only part of my business that it thriving right now is hand drawn renderings! My clients are mostly other architects who can't/don't hand illustrate that are tired of the "look" of computer renderings. Full-circle.
I'm surprised the Autodesk person gave you the software. Must be they don't consider Mac a viable platform and he's unloading it.I think its more like they haven't seen a lot of mac-heads jumping on the wagon, and are willing to give away some goods in order to gain exposure. Presumably, once I'm down the rabbit hole...
...play around with it but I would stick with what you know, upgrade, it's a lot better now, and there are a lot of firms using it because as a business decision it makes sense, more bag for your buck.Herein lies my problem: either route requires a new computer to run new apps. Also, its my feeling the new upgrades are always claiming "better," not always coming through. I have tested '09 and '10 (actually used '09 pretty extensively at another office that I freelanced for)and was not overly impressed. Not the quantum jumps in workflow or tools as in previous upgrades with a lot of improvement taking place "under the hood." 2011 and 2012 require too much horsepower to adequately test with current computers. Statistically I'm not sure VW has gained marketshare, but I may be wrong. Its cost has certainly grown compared to both Archicad and ACAD. (I paid about 1500.00 USD for VWA+RW plus 500.00 for addl seats (I had 5 at one point)less than 8 years ago--when ArchiCad was 3500.00 and ACAD was 8,000. Now same runs 2600.00 USD while Archicad is 4250.00 and ACAD/mac is 5000.00)
Don't let a lazy engineering draftsman say you have to have Acad, you don't.Nope, never have, never will.And while I'm relatively happy with DWG translations, I don't like this "openDWG" game the the cad industry is forced to play. I also don't like making excuses for the translation issues that do come up and tap-dancing around ACAD users needs.
I'll need to look at what the ACAD licence is worth on the open market, that might play as a viable solution!
Thanks so much for the imput!
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I'm doing some serious soul searching here, looking for advice.
Long time user (MiniCad+ 3.1, yeah that's since about 1989!) but economy has slammed my business and as a result haven't upgraded since VWA/RW 2008. Also haven't upgraded my computers, which is beginning to cause problems. I'm a comitted Mac guy.
The cost of BOTH a VW upgrade plus a decent computer to run it is prohibitive to me right now.
The twist: after years of avoiding ACAD like the plague and telling anybody who would listen that AutoDesk made an overpriced, unituitive product (that forced professionals to use it because it had become the "default" program in the industry), I'm now looking to use it myself!
Why you ask? Because I was given a copy free of charge from a client who's a VP at Autodesk. $5000 retail! Granted, it's not ACad Architect or Revit but...
1) It would allow me to buy a new computer with my limited funds desparately needed on many fronts including but not limited to CAD.
And, 2) when looking for freelance work in architecture (or even a 9-5 job) I'm constantly reminded of the ACAD dominance in the field.
I've read a bit about the ACAD for Mac shortcomings, and I know folks here are generally VW disciples (as am I) but I'm hoping for some unbiased help in weighing the factors. Any info would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks for slogging through this long post!
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Nearly all window manufacturers will "gang" together just about any two (or more) windows as requested (there are weight and size limits however).
Actually, Peter generally if a window grouping can't be factory ganged and transported, virtually all mfgrs will send individual units (or pairs)for field ganging. Can be awkward to install, but that's my problem (I'm a builder too). But the real point is...
There is a way to show the "Newer" way on a schedule, which is to specify (for example) 2-3'0" x 5'0" (AKA 2-36/60, or many other variants).
Also, in the real world, at least residentially, we generally specify Rough Opening Dimensions and often depend on the owner and builder to choose a specific brand.
In VW's you can also use two windows, placed close together. The main issue here is the trim which will overlap awkwardly. The solution (from NNA) was to make Custom Window Configurations available....
NNAs solution won't deal with lack of shim space between ganged windows, won't build "frame" properly in ganged windows with Custom mullion options, can't calc properly for useful info in a window schedule, draws overlapping trim elements for adjacent windows poorly (requiring me to extrude exterior trim for all window groupings for int/ext elevation and section views), and a bunch of other annoying issues I won't take the time to list...
How common are ganged or grouped windows? Like I said, depends on local vernacular, arch style, etc. But I would say fairly common to very common (especially in "historic" areas double/single hung windows predominate and contemporary clients want more "uninterrupted" glass area than wnd mfgrs can give in one unit. For my work, I haven't done a project in recent years without at least one ganged or grouped window, with MOST jobs using a grouping in 30-60% of the total fenestration design.
Even if its a more of a problem for me than most, I'm curious how other architects are addressing this (especially in elevation views and on schedules, as I can usually get the plan close enough).
cheers, mmm
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I'll bump this just once...
Still having problems. This file, and others are a problem on all of my machines, so for now I'm ruling out vid card/driver, amt of RAM, etc.
Any ideas?
Thanks, cheers, mmm
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This works, yes. But now shows up as one item in Window Schedule as "custom" with overall dims. You also have to play with the mullion settings which are unsatisfactory. ie: ganged windows vs. adjacent windows with trimmer/kings btween.
Ganged and/or adjacent windows are common in our local vernacular and frustrating to deal with in VW.
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Hi y'all,
Having trouble with building elevation VPs of my model. When using background render set to OpenGL with shadows, content "disappears" for lack of better word. I can see elevation in wireframe, but won't render in OpenGL or RW HiddenLine(I mean VP goes blank and all I can see is info in Annotations).
Once this happens, the VP is dust. No amount of jostling will get it back. When updating VP, computer chugs a bit then says "rendered" (absence of candystripe border). But its still gone.
If orig VP is created with OpenGL no shadows background and hidden line foreground in sketch mode (my usual method except I like the look of shadows especially for prelim work), VP works fine. I find when I modify to OpenGL with shadows, VP blank again and have to start over.
May be related: odd shadows are being cast in the VP that dont show up in DL.
Cant afford to add info in Annotations to a VP that becomes corrupted, too much work to recreate.
Please any ideas welcome.
TIA, mmm
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OpenGL is a hardware based render that is implemented in the graphics card - this is why it is quick for interactive rotations. Different graphics cards implement OpenGL in different ways, often using a mix of hardware and software emulation and often as a subset of the full implementation (shadows for example is not available in all OpenGL implementations). So you may well see different results using different hardware and/or video drivers.
Thanks for the response, that makes sense. I'll try this file on another machine and see what happens.
Personally, I would stick with OpenGL for quick and dirty screen previews and use a renderworks mode such as Final Quality Renderworks for presentation views such as in SLVP's where you don't need the interactivity but need a consistent result.
I agree in concept, unfortunately render times are so long with FQRW that its impacting office workflow. Also, graphically I like the shadows generated in openGL for non-photorealistic orthagonal drwgs. Maybe I should be asking, "what custom RW settings will give me sharp uniform shadows (without "fall off" gradients) and not compromise speed?" Any takers?
Thanks again, mmm
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In using Open GL render with shadows option I'm getting some strange results in SLVPs. Almost like there are some hidden elements casting shadows on elevation views in these VPs. when traveling back to the DL from the SLVP the odd shadows are gone! I've checked the class/layer overrides for any clues--nothing. Creating a new VP from the DL of the same model, same file yields more odd shadows, only in different places???
I finally found a couple of clues: when zoomed in close on the DL model in elevation view I can see some unwanted shadows cast on a wall with no shadows. This is the really strange part: in this zoomed view if I use the pan (hand) tool, the shadows actually move!(not while panning, but they redraw in a slightly different config after finishing operation) The pan tool does nothing to the model, light, or other objects in the drawing, so how can it change the shadows cast?
Back to the SLVPs. By accident I discovered that the errant shadows disappear if I change the scale of the VP from 1/4" to 1/8". What the heck? How could this be possible? Again, this shouldn't do anything to the model, lighting, VP overrides, other elements etc. Bug?
In the past I've used open GL a lot and I like how it remains rendered when rotating models etc. Now I'm using the Textures and Shadow options in open GL mode so maybe this has been an issue for a while and I wasn't aware of it.
I've restarted VW and rebooted machine to no avail. Any suggestions? Using VWA 2008 SP3.
TIA, cheers, mmm
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Just use custom viewports!!
Sorry, don't follow. I am using many VPs to view the model, but how does this figure in my vertical alignment issues?
thanks, mmm
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Hi Y'all,
Locally business has been slow and I've taken on a job with another architect who also uses vectorworks. Catch is that he wants me to work in his office on his station using VWA (no RW) ver 11.5.1. I'm coming from 2008 and its been hard going "backward." Nevertheless, I'd like to impress and show him the power of modeling in VW (he currently uses VW as a 2d drafting tool) and possibly secure a role in his office upgrading his system and managing the CAD/BIM stuff.
This brings me to my issue:
In VWA 11 I've created a Layer Link for a simple one story house with full basement (four Des Layers: Roof, Wall, Floor, B'ment Wall, Slab). The resulting model in the LL when viewing Front appears to have 2 of the 5 linked layers with incorrect Z values.
I've checked and double checked the z and delta z values of the errant elements and they look good. In fact, if I'm the Wall DL and turn on the other 4 DLs, View Front, Align Layer views, the model looks correct!!! I haven't used any Move commands in elevation views to mess up z values. What gives?
Unfortunately, I've gotten so used to Stack Layers (also my personal templates have model views pre-set etc) that I'm having a problem troubleshooting this LL issue.
I'd like to show my new "boss" the advantages of working in 3d, but can't do so until I get this resolved. Any help greatly appreciated.
BTW, I'm not a big fan of the Sect Layer VP implementation in 2008, but now using Cut 2D and 3D sections...arrrrrgh, I want it back!!!! Not to mention VP class overrides which, in my opinion, has done more for VW than people give credit. Or Polygon by boundary, or... I'd better stop now before I blow a fuse.
Cheers, mmm
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So... how are the window options in VWA 2009? (doors for that matter too) I'm still using lots of workarounds in 08 for window type that I use fairly frequently and more options would be a plus.
It looks like the walls now can handle some fairly complex shapes(see current thread: Objects in Walls) without converting wall objects to "solids" and losing the benefits of components, texture classing, etc.
TIA, mmm
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That's what I just said.
It is? sorry I guess I didn't understand.
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The program is just designed that only the parameters that the objects have the same can be changed in the oip at the same time.
Actually, my quick test shows that this appears not to be the case. For example, two windows with different size Ext Trim can be selected and Trim size can be modified to another size at the same time. But only if its changed in the OIP. If I select the same two windows and change Ext Trim size in the Setting/Part/Trim dialog, then the change only sticks to one of the windows. ???
When windows with two different trim sizes are selected the value in the OIP is blank, but can be modified. If one window has the "Include Ext Trim" radio button checked and the other doesn't,then when both windows are selected, it shows in the OIP as a "dash," but can still be modified together.
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Sorry for the long post...
I?ve been migrating current projects in my office to VWA 2008. One new feature that is really important to me (and probably the single convincing feature to upgrade) is the ability to select and edit multiple objects embedded in walls. This has been has been a wish list item for me for a long, long time.
This is not working like I expected. What I?d like to be able to do: Client decides at the 11th hour to change window manufacturer from Anderson to Loewen, I simply run Custom Selection, with all windows within walls selected; open Settings dialog, Data tab; select new manufacturer and?done!
Nope, when recalcing the window sched I find only one window has updated info.
If I want to change dimension of exterior trim on 42 windows, this technique works (when modifying data in the OIP). It seems any parameter that requires me to access the Settings dialog won?t stick to selected objects. This means I still have to select and mod ONE WINDOW AT A TIME to access any Data item, Special Parts Classes, Part Line Styles or any other item not contained in the OIP. Arrgh.
OK lets work around by selecting and modifying the info from the Wind Sched WS. Well, I can select the cell for one window and get the manufacturer changed in the WS and in the PIO, but cannot mod multiple windows at a time. Heck this ?reverse workflow? through the Schedule Worksheets was my number 2 reason for upgrading!
Maybe workaround through the Eyedropper tool? (I?ve tried and failed with this technique in the past, but, hey, maybe options have changed in 2008) Nope, even with pick up plug-in parameters checked, I can?t use this without also changing basic info like window size. Useless.
I really, really like the direction that VW has gone in versions 11, 12 and ?08 (I?ve been a user since MiniCad+ 3.1). But I?ve also paid employees untold dollars making ?one-at-a-time? changes that should be easily accessed through global editing.
BTW, my #3 reason for upgrading: Rotate Plan?thank you, thank you, thank you (and seems to be working well so far). #4 reason for upgrading: Better control over wall components and visibility (and ability to dimension to framing)?I?ve had some real problems with how this is working, but I?ll have to save for another post.
cheers, mmm
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but if you need to access the 'Settings' dialog to make your changes, they will only apply to the first object selected. This seems to apply to multiple selections as well.
huh? can anybody verify this?
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Usually I have 2 or 3 "groupings" of windows done with Custom sashes on a Res project and a lot of single windows. In this case I'll call out the individual sizes in the Notes area. I'll also include a graphic window type under the schedule to clarify operations of sashes. This works ok. However, I'm doing a project now that mostly Custom groupings and its making a real mess of the schedule. I think I'll have to manually enter the data in some User Fields.
I wish the window schedule would list a Custom grouping by main ID Tag with subsets for individual sashes ie, W-17a, W-17b, W-17c. Why not? All the data is in the window settings but doesn't show up on schedule (just overall dims and "custom" for sash type).
cheers, mmm
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You can set the layer to use an HDRI for lighting and a plain color for the background, for example.
I was wondering about this. How is it done? Also, can an HDRI be used for lighting and a different image (of a site for an architectural rendering for instance)be used in the background? It seems you have to choose only one RW Background image.
I think what MikeB is talking about is to use an HDRI to handle the "sky" part of the lighting and a regular directional light to handle the "sun" part. This is a good and appropriate use of the feature.This is how I'd like to use HDRIs as well. Can somebody explain or point me to an example of what type of HDRI and Directional Light Spec to use.
cheers, mmm
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What export option is being chosen here? An image file? what format to use as an .hdr?
Sorry to be so dense but I'm still looking for how to export to the .hdr format.
TIA, mmm
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Sorry Dave, I was looking at the Retain Rendering slider not responsiveness. I'll have to look again. BTW with Retain set all the way to Always, the Open GL still goes to Wireframe when not in Stacked Layers.
cheers, mmm
2d vs 3d elevations and line weights
in Architecture
Posted
Here, here. I'll have to second that thought!
I have a current thread in "general" section (Help with VW vs ACAD)in which I'm weighing the cost of upgrading from VWA/RW 2008 to 2012 and I specifically ask if in the 4 versions I've missed my list my pet peeves has been addressed.
Among them:
--applying hatches to 3d objects (why? textures are not the same (my drwgs still get plotted in B&W) and its way, way too cumbersome to fake in the annotation VP)
--polygon by lasso within VPs (why? so I can quickly, although tediously get elevation line wts to look right, ie profiling. yep that's oldschool, but its what makes my drwgs look better than an engineer's working in ACAD)
--visual control of live sections.
--Better door and window control (mainly to simply have them look right in plan view, elevation, and section)
and... the big kicker-- can I finally use VW as a 2d/3d tool rather than have this convoluted workflow to address one workaround after another!!!
BTW I use the classes to control visuals control extensively and rely heavily on Class overrides in VP's. Sounds like this workaround, er, I mean, workflow is still an accepted methodology.
One tip is create one good elevation with overrides in place, foreground/backgrnd render options selected, then duplicate and reset view for each add'l elev needed (still req's a lot of "touching up" IMHO).
I'm sure a lot of you have used Sketch-Up. How can such a basic program define line wts by edge so easily and effectively, while we continue slogging through the workarounds.