Ken

Here's another solution that may come closer to the appearance of a round-over stopping before the end. It's actually a Column object with circular (oval) shaft and Rectangular Mushroom capital. Then subtract and add solids with extrudes as needed. The inside corner is just a fillet on a radiused extrude.

I can confirm the odd behavior when opened in v2008. I don't know what's causing it, but the file seems corrupt. However, when opened in v2010 there seems to be no problem at all:

Oh, and one last suggestion is to NOT make it dependent on any particular font. This would reduce the problem of sharing when others don't have the same font in their system. In fact, make it a non-font graphic for scalability and DXF/DWG exportability.

Here's my suggestion for improvement? and for a more *constructive* discussion. Although I don't profess to be a delineation guru, I see the rules as follows: 1. In architectural drawings, the N should always read as an N ? never as a Z ? in regular comfortable zero-head-tilt reading position 2. In architectural drawings, there are TWO north indicators ? a page/ sheet/ drawing north and a true north The DRAWING NORTH (or sheet north or page north) is a reference that applies only to the drawing set. As such, it's always orthogonal to the floor plan, meaning it's always pointing to one of only four directions ? 0?, 90?, 180? or 270? relative to the sheet. This way, the elevations drawings can be referenced as, for example, a "north elevation" as opposed to some odd "north-northwest 47.32? elevation" The TRUE NORTH, on the other hand, is a terrestrial geographic indicator. It coincides with internationally accepted mapping standards. True north is NOT magnetic north. True north is always less than 45? from the drawing north, meaning if it's over 45? then the drawing north should be flipped to the next 90? direction 3. If there's no site plan included in the drawing set, i.e. the set contains only building drawings (floor plans, roof plan, structural plans, elevations, sections, etc.), then the TRUE NORTH component can be omitted. The north arrow becomes a very simple one-of-four-possibility directional icon (left, right, top, down, as in existing North Arrow Config 3 through 9). 4. If there's a site plan as part of the drawing set, then the true north indicator should be consistent with the property boundary's survey bearings. Often this is shown in degrees-minutes-seconds in the parcel map or property survey, so the accuracy can be very high. 5. The angular DIFFERENCE between the drawing north and true north is also related to the Page North when creating a sun light. This becomes an opportunity for NNA to tie the north arrow improvement with improved setup for massing-shadow studies.

As people who work in teams know, using consistent objects and drafting conventions are important for a professional look, regardless of how simple or quick you can make your own north arrow. Heck, you can carry your "quickness" argument all the way to line-per-line drafting for an entire set of CDs ? if you can do it fast enough, then why not? Knock your socks off.

I think sideways north should NOT become a Z arrow. How silly. It shows lack of refinement. We already have Adjust Flipped Text as a general preference. The north arrows should also automatically rotate back to N arrows. That's how we read the drawings. And what in the world is MN? Hopefully the software programmers understand the difference between TRUE NORTH and mere magnetic declination, which varies with latitude, longitude and even over time! Why do fancy 3D features keep expanding yet this very basic item is neglected year after year after year? I don't use it. I can't use, but I want to use it. Instead I have to use my own N arrow. And I know that prospective users who are savvy architectural delineators laugh at this silliness. Just another little smile. Yet another carryover from a very "mini" cad.

This sort of *almost* answers Gonzo's great question, but without the wall caps... ...and using two walls. :crazy:

If it's just for immediate printing or producing a PDF, here's the temporary workaround, assuming you have v2008: EXPORT your drawing to v2008. Launch v2008 and open the drawing in v2008. Accomplish your T join (or Y join or X join or complex + join whatever), relish the moment and enjoy your amazing wall joining powers in v2008! Save file. Open the same drawing in v2010. Voil?. The trouble is when you have to modify the same walls for any reason. They revert back to broken again. Also works using v2009. :crazy:

You can "compensate" for it by adding or subtracting the Reference Elevation in the OIP.

Cannot be done, my friend. In ancient versions I have wished for same. However, in recent versions, either View Bar and Tool Bar has information or interaction not found elsewhere, no? For example, the little icon next to design layer name indicating top/plan view or otherwise. Zoom percentage. Rotate plan. If only for those I keep the View Bar. And Tool Bar shows selected mode. Where else would you see tool modes?

This implies that the U.S. version cannot do it. And that this "Euro-style" construction never exists in the U.S.! (never designed, never built) Here's the closest that I can do in v2010 Architect:

I remember Robert Anderson had offered a solution to this many years ago. Few people were able to replicate his solution. It's worth a revisit. Robert?

Peter, actually LLs have always updated automatically ? for me at least ever since I started using them back in the day. Yes they were "live." And today, too, as I'm still trying to adapt all my LL tricks to the new Unified View approach. The problem he's facing could be caused by many other issues, including system memory, graphic screen refresh, etc.

Tami, glad you figured it out. The non mention of a hybrid symbol in the warning message does seem inconsistent. They should at least say, "the align plane tool does not work with walls, roofs or 2D/3D symbols. They must remain oriented relative to the active layer plane." It's a minor issue, but hopefully NNA can pick this up. That Top Ten movie, as well as Jonathan's excellent tutorial, actually show the object as a group, not a roof tile symbol. Probably a group of extrudes. Many thanks to Jonathan for sharing. I always pick up tips when watching those movies!

CIVILGT, are you talking about super tight zoom in? What's the zoom scale shown in the View Bar (one of several fields above main drawing, below window title) when the image gets lost? The percentage can also be manually typed in. Can you try typing in higher and higher zoom percentages until the image disappears ? then report the percentage that triggers the disappearance?

My general comment, Kizza, is that Vectorworks can do most everything you mentioned. I've never used Revit, so I cannot offer any comparison comments. The layers approach is very well thought out in VW and quite natural to the way buildings are constructed. It could just be nomenclature where layers are called levels in Revit (and Archicad?).

I'm a U.S.A. user of VW v2010 trying out WinDoor, hoping to find some way of fitting it into my local projects here that get passed around to other architects. The pass around to others is my concern when others don't own WinDoor. As I have mine installed, the plug-ins I see are separate tool icons in the Building Shell tool set. And one tool icon in the Dims/Notes tool set. I don't see any "native door and window tools hiding under the WinDoor icon." What exactly are you referring to? The native Window and Door tools are just separate tools (separate icons) in the same tool sets in my version with WinDoor 15 installed. So I have to choose either the native windows/ doors OR the WinDoor objects. It's an either/or proposition. Cannot switch back once chosen. Is this not what you have in Australia? This is why I commented to Kizza about the WinDoor feature.

Seems to make sense to me, as those objects (roofs and walls) have parameters tied to layer geometry. It's best to use 3D symbols, extrudes or other boolean geometry as your roof tile objects to align to working plane. I must applaud the improvement of the Working Planes tool/command/palette. There are still some less-than-intuitive procedures, but it's a whole world better than before.

Also double-click on the c key to zoom in double. Single click on it to call the tool. I assume you're talking about Vectorworks version 9.5.3 and not Mac OS (Classic) of that version as I vaguely recall the latest classic was 9.5.2. This topic reminds me of how the default keyboard shortcuts in v2010 have been modified (from v2008 for me as I skipped versions) to something that's now less accessible. A while back (probably true in v9) the v key used to be zoom out. A double hit on it was a double zoom out. But I kept mine in interactive mode whereas the c key I kept in marquee mode. It was a truly snappy approach if you're right handed controlling the cursor with the other hand.

WinDoor, as I understand, is sold as a bundled item by OzCad, a third party developer in Australia. My only concern when using WinDoor, being a third party plug-in, is that those objects are non-editable by others who don't own WinDoor. Others can't even replace the door and window objects like we can for symbols. But it's an excellent tool. Why can't NNA purchase the rights to it and integrate it into the mainstream.

I wish you did have VW to check because I can't see either of your "solution" happening. 1. Send to Back doesn't seem to apply. In fact, the PIO window doesn't even have solid fill to mask anything. The sill or stool component isn't turned on either. How exactly do you send any "(Object) in Wall" to front or back (of the wall)? 2. Presetting "Full break with caps" is the insertion option for symbols, but I can't find it for window PIOs. Where do I set it?

NNA can so easily implement this: User defined line weight for Top/Plan view User defined alternate line weight for Section view All other 3D views get default thinnest line (0.03mm or 1mil) The ultimate goal is indeed to get real-time elevation drawings as SLVP without unnecessary 2D editing. I've also wished this before at length in these forums, apparently falling on deaf ears. Now, to truly tackle the architectural delineation rule of heavier lines closer to viewer in flat building elevations (as well as perspectives), perhaps an exciting novel approach can be introduced as some sort of dynamic depth of view scaling for line weights in viewports. Say this applies only for Hidden Line render. Say it's a new viewport option. Say you go into the VP annotate, lasso-create a few polygons around your building elements side view, select and stack them polygons front to back, then slide some kind of bar to adjust their lineweights going from heavy to thin. And show the visual effects instantly for artistic/visual judgment. How's that for lineweight delineation? This would still require the basics ? that of NOT showing the heavy top/plan line weight in other views.

Thank you for the reply. I have two follow up questions: 1. How can I make the cap line as heavy as the wall line? It still seems partially masked by the window, making it appear lighter. See simplified example below. 2. How can this be set as default for all windows? Or does each and every PIO instance require an adjustment in the OIP?

On a floor plan, I want to have heavy lines show where the window unit contacts the wall. It should be the same lineweight as that of the wall. How can I do this?

I wish walls (actually any hybrid objects shown in multiple views) could have a SEPARATE line weight attribute when they're not in top/plan view. The non top/plan view line weight can be as easy and simple as the lightest available lines in the drawing ? it doesn't matter. Those views are usually rendered anyway. Let user define line weight ONLY for top/plan view. This would globally eliminate the odd heavy wall edges: