alanmac

What's wrong with using the current procedures put in place for this ?

Hugo Just as a little footnote to your imaginery render competition, would you buy a Hi Fi system based on listening to just one song on a few systems? or would you look at how each system handles a wide variety of musical information. I think the same applies to computers. Each have their merits and everybody has their own needs, circumstances and budgets. It sounds like your choice is a fairly simple one, which one of the three MacBooks models available do I buy. Not the black one I hope.;~) Alan

Hi Hugo Imagine is all you can do since there is no version of VW in UB released as yet. Whilst you have incuded the Pentium 4 in your imaginary "shootout" Intel are pushing and selling its Pentium D dual core processor so a machine with that on should be included. Whilst we are about it an "equivalent" AMD processor should also join the party. I think you'll find that this whole matter is a little subjective anyway. I'm sure varying processor on varying files, complexity, size, lighting settings etc. will give a particular processor an edge over the others from file to file. Just the same as one car will be faster in a straight line whilst another is quicker round the bends. As I mentioned before I have never used Renderworks so I can't comment on its use but according to some comments I've read from other users if you want a fast way to speed up your render times then buy Artlantis. Of course you lose the "integration" of one program and I'm not here to promote Artlantis over Renderworks, but I find the use of a seperate render program very useful. I can render from several different programs in Artlantis, VW and Sketch Up. I can also put a walkthrough render on one machine and let it churn away till finished whilst I work in VW on something else. The same could be said of using any external render program, Cinema 4D, Cheetah3D (one to watch out for, great product, great price), Maxwell(although this is very much work in progress) etc. not just Artlantis. But Artlantis is fast. Again it depends on what level of service in rendering you want or need to provide your clients. One thing you don't have to imagine - the MacBook will be faster than any iBook ever made. If you worked well within the confines of its size and speed then you'll be even happier with the MacBook. The use of an external monitor without an "illegal" patch is also good news for your eyes and productivity. UB version will be the icing on the cake hopefully, but remember that thing about computers, the faster they get the more the software folks use the extra power which then slows them down again in relative terms. Happy buying Alan

Yeah, sorry to hijack the thread, but it's a bit like Ford calling a new car, well, "car." Ah but they did, a few years ago Christiaan - The Ka interestingly they never brought out a Si version as they did in some other models ;~) Alan

Changing my chair and my monitor from CRT to a TFT helped with both my headaches, eye strain (which are linked) and the pains in my neck I was suffering. The main cause of my neck pain was poor posture. I was found to be having my head leaning forward towards the monitor, this meant all the weight of it was on my neck, and the joints etc. were saying enough is enough. Sitting more upright cured it. Not in the "old sit up straight, shoulders forced back" Army fashion. The advice was to image a helium balloon tied to the top of my head and image this lifting your head upwards. Your shoulders would come back natually. Try it, lifting just your head in this way and see how the shoulders naturally go back. The head is then more in line with the body and not straining the neck. A towel, rolled up and placed in the chair at the small of my back also helped with posture. Alan

Hi Hugo As you've been using a iBook for some time, if my memory serves me correctly, and if in the work you do and what you do with VW you find it okay then I'm sure the MacBook as an upgrade is an excellent choice. My comments on the on board graphics would be in the context of all the other programs I may use on my machines as well as how I use VW, which is mainly detail 3D models, moving these around on screen to see the various design and layout advantages, file average about 50mb. As you are probably aware almost all rendering is done in software rather than using a dedicated hardware card like some high level systems. To this end, cpu is were the number crunching goes on for these calculations and the dual core Intel chips can only be a big plus in this regard, even without using both cores, which thankfully I understand Renderworks does. You've got to increase that RAM as well, to at least 1GB. If it was me I'd go to the maximum but find a way of doing it without the costs Apple talk about. Maybe buy the minimum spec and reside myself to ditching both sticks 256 mb sticks to buy 2x 1GB sticks from a good aftermarket supplier. Apples prices for RAM are just too high. The areas were I think I'd find problems are panning and generally moving around a drawing, moving the perspective view around in a 3D model etc. But like I said it depends on what you are doing in VW. As a program it's used by many people in many different industries, who again have differing levels of complexity to the work they do. After starting my VW CAD work on a cramped 15" monitor and working up to 21" CRT's and now 19" TFT and 20" Cinema displays I'd find working all day with a smaller scene very uncomfortable. Short spells on the companies iBooks the sales guys use I find very frustrating. I hav'n't studied the specs so I honestly don't know if you can add another monitor to give you additional screen space in the MacBook as in the MacBook Pro, but bear in mind that has got to be driven by the same card as your Macbook on board card. My last comments on screen size are of course personal, and again if you find the iBook good for you then the MacBook will be more of the same. Since the Intel based machines have been introduced with their capability to load and use Windows XP I've been considering getting one for my daughter to use, and the base model MacBook looked ideal for her schoolwork etc. Sadly the talk of the units high heat readings from the CPU's and the posts debating the "wrong" application of thermal paste inside these machines has put me off for the time being. I will be holding back until they've been out for a while and get more customer feedback or even until the first revision model appears. Alan

One more I found a while ago, but I have not downloaded anything. http://www.archibase.net/ Alan

Michael If I could jump in, I think this was a new import procedure as part of the feature set of any VW12 Industry series version, Fundamentals doesn't have it. I use Cinema to convert any 3DS into dxf to get into my pre 12 versions of VW that way. If you don't have anything to open 3DS like Cinema 4D then its a case of using/downloading the available dxf file of the item you want. Alan

One more for the resources www.buildingenvironments.com George. I've got a few of the Herman Miller ones. Wish I could own the real thing though. Alan

All graphic cards can have issues with software, not just with VW. You'll see quite often the advice to check you have the latest drivers for your card installed, given out by Katie etc. I've even read some cases were different older issue drivers have been recommended to get a system stable, not for VW, but other software such as Maya etc.. The two main companies involved in producing the chipsets nVidia and ATI both edge forward of each other in speed and capabilities from time to time. Its true that under certain software programs one is favoured over the other, but I've never seen this in relationship to Vectorworks. Of course any card "problem" is only relative if you have made some change to your system, such as installing a piece of new software, updating existing software in some way, or introducing a new monitor. If your system is running stable then there is no need to look for new drivers, but if you do, ensure you've got copies of the old should you need to revert back. As regards VW's compatability with nVidia cards, no more or less than any other piece of software from my knowledge and experience. I run with preinstalled ATI cards on my two machines. Mac and Windows, whilst my semi retired old Dell has an equally old nVidia card with no issues at all in VW. Alan

With the supplied graphics card I don't think its going to be a good choice, but again it depends on the type of VW work you're going to do on it. That's about the only downer I can see in its specs but Apple probably did it to make sure there was a good enough differential between these and the Macbook Pros. You've got to hand it to Apple, the way they introduce black as a colour option and make it something special, paying extra for it when those nasty old Windows machines have been giving us black for the last few years and people liked the Apple white because it was different. I see Apple have adjusted the specs on the MacBook Pros as well. Alan

Hi I just spoke to one of the guys at my old company. He just types the text in one continues line never touching return then grabbing the box handles (arrow shape) shapes the text to the size/layout he wants and gets no box character returns in his exported EPs to Quark. Hope that helps. He's using 11.5 or 12 I believe. Alan

I remember this from back in studio I worked in using quark a couple of years ago. It was VW8.5 and I'd hoped it had been sorted by now. My workaround was to use the centre alignment of text. This stopped it but of course may not suit your presentation. Alternatively is to place a white square in Quark over where character will appear, but its a bit of a PITA. What does leaving the return alone and drawing/dragging a text box to the area you want produce type in the text and let VW choose the line length/returns do. Still give you return characters? Alan

Yes, from elf06 last post that's clear now. The first post did say "I have got few Vectorworks client in my network" and in that situation most people use a server set up, do they not? Is this not the best way to set up for multiple user use. Anyway, I know and have installed software that checks for illegal use and it's not a problem for me, I don't think it's a case of it encroaching on my privacy but the software companies ensuring its property is being used correctly. As a matter of course I block programs accessing the Internet unless I know its required for the program to function, but that's a different issue. elf06 - the dongle is not used by all countries, it's very much down to the country you buy VW in and use. So maybe what your experiencing is the "blanket" requirement built into the software supplied by NNA to protect it, with the dongle being required as additional security by your countrys distributor, as is the case in the UK, Added afterwards but without the other checking method able to be removed. As I said, maybe..... NNA will probably explain it better and will have their reasons which I'm sure are understandable. Alan

In this scenario each specific work station doesn't need which serials the other works stations are using, instead the server only needs to know which ones it has dished out already. That's what I was describing, the allowance of a user to use any available license up to the number they have installed, VW looks to see what licenses are being used/already allocated, not the user, and is dynamically linked as opposed to specific license number linked to a specific workstation permanently. It's this process of checking by VW that seems to upset the original poster and feels that VW should not be doing it. And as I said, does he have an alternative method to allow NNA to keep its license agreement secure and free from misuse. Alan

I agree 100% It's certainly been a hit and miss affair with me to cancel any hidden line rendering I want to stop over the years. Got so bad I expect to force quit instead and always save the file before I execute hidden line render view. Needs to work just like "escape" does in Photoshop, virtually straight away. Alan

You could make a start by suggesting a way that NNA, with multi user licensed sites, can ensure licenses are not used illegally. But, at the same time it still gives the VW users the flexability to start the program with VW seeking out and using any available license rather than have to have a specific license per specific workstation scenario. By the way out of interest, just how much and how serious is the amount of network resources VW is "stealing" from your network anyway? What are the reprocussions ? Alan

Why not? Sorry, but is that not why you have these options in Norton's for, to change them to suit the situation. This is part of the functionality of the program, to allow those that require access to do so and to block the ones that are trying but shouldn't. As said before, I'm sure it's nothing more sinister than just VW checking to ensure licenses are being used correctly. Alan

I have never used Renderworks so I can't fairly compare the two, most of my experience of rendering work has been done with Artlantis, admittedly with VW models, but also with Sketch Up to. It was this that I was refering to in my post to Grant before I got jumped on for having assumed things. Sure, can't see a problem with discussing what each renderer has to offer in comparison or suggest what Renderworks could have to improve its workflow etc like another render program. What I was going to do was discuss how I use Artlantis, its functions, easy of use, outputs etc in detail, my experiences with it and under these circumstances, which is what I was refering to, felt it right to do this off the VW forum. Also from viewing Grant's web site I can see we are in a similiar industry. Hope that this is now clear. You know what they say, assume makes an ass out of u and me. Stay cool ;~) Alan

Christiaan Its not an "assumption" as you put it, it's a opinion, a point of view, which I'm entitled to am I not. Let's move on. Alan

Grant Doubtful if you will be able to get somebody with the same VW file to show it rendered in both programs. I can maybe send you a image or two done in Artlantis off list and we can also discuss this off list, which i think would be better. No big secrets, just feels it's ethically wrong to be discussing Artlantis and its workings in this context on NNA tech forum. I would just say that C4D beats both in render quality etc. but I'm still, yes after owning it for a couple of years, not getting to grips with it and continuing to use Artlantis because of its easy of use. Alan

Its been my experience that whilst using many objects turned into symbols keeps the VW file smaller, as opposed to just duplicate copies of an object, it does extend the export time to Artlantis, so file size in VW does not always equate to file size and exporting time to Artlantis. It's understandable as the plug in has to reference each object and convert it regardless of how VW sees it. Interestingly as a side issue VW's Renderworks is capable of using dual processors, and you'll see two render lines in processing on your dual Macs but Artlantis is not..... Alan

I'm not in my office, at work, full time, which is were I use Macs, but if I get time when next in I'll take a look. Exporting times seem in my opinion to be about the same, don't notice a great deal of difference, but never done a side by side comparison.If anything the Mac feel slightly, and only by about half a minute if that, faster. But if its grabbing 100% CPU usage then that may explain it. Also at the moment I wouldn't know on OSX were to look for CPU usage graphs etc. like the Windows Task Manager in XP which gives comprehensive details of what's happening. It's Artlantis 4.5 in both cases by the way. Alan

Just to clarify, export plug in to Artlantis was developed by/for Abvent and NNA has no responsiblity over its workings/updates etc. On my WindowsXP machine with Hyper threading enabled it only ever uses 50% cpu usage when exporting to Artlantis. I can let it happily export in the background whilst I do other things. Maybe, and I only say maybe, its a OS issue. Alan

Hi Christiaan No problem. The spooling of course is done by the computer and the file processing, the only thing the printer does is receive the information in a series of commands to control its heads and paper feed. It's been a while since I was involved in all this but built into the printer would be a buffer to ensure the data was held from the server in the printer. This in our machine was small and this leads me to my opinion that regardless of the connection the data coming from the server could easily swamp the printers capability hence the buffer and nothing more than a 100 base is needed. Sure from your workstation to server will benefit from gigabit connection, and that probably is in place if you have G5's etc. I'd be inclined to call in somebody to give you help and advice on this, lay out what you need to achieve and ask them to quote on a solution. Good luck. Alan