MrTemplate

hello G Cliff; i have an old copy of 11.5. i'm currently on mac OS 10.5.5, perhaps the app is too old? anyway, i just attempted to dupe your sequence; i opened a doc, i selected spotlight>instrument processing>label legend manager, and the label legend manager window properly appeared. i added a new label called 'shelley'. in the 'add new legend' window i double-clicked on unit number, color, channel, and purpose. i clicked ok, i then clicked on 'edit layout'; i edited and clicked ok. i then selected 'shelley' from the resource browser and edited it some more. no problem. i then made a fresnel symbol active in the RB, inserted it into the drawing using the spotlight instrument insertion tool, and assigned the label legend. no problem. then i inserted the same fresnel into the drawing using the 2d symbol insertion tool, convert to instrument, assign label legend. no problem. does this help at all? hope so, shelley

Hi Scott; yes, when you convert to multi circuit your numbering options reduce. when you wish to label them 201, 202, etc, i presume this is unit number, right? if so you might consider trying to merely group them? or not group them? when you invoke the multi circuit, you are then stuck with the suffix issue in the numbering (i **think**). but yeah, you're right; the user fields will not be helpful to you. hth, shelley

hi kelrock; i can't address all of your comments because i don't use some of the stuff you're talking about. when you talk about the size limitation of the label legends, on the other hand, i wonder what size or scale of unit you're working with. on most lighting fixtures, moving or conventional, if you paste one in a LL box, it (and the accompanying text) will fit easily presuming the fixture is in 1/2" scale. maybe with your 1000 unit plots you're working so small that the text is then huge? or maybe you're working with big honkin' fixtures? in any event, you might consider changing the percentage scale of the drawing, and have that help in the reduction. so that the symbols (?) and/or the text (?) wouldn't need to be so huge. then again, i could be missing the problem completely. good luck, shelley

hi goldie; in vw12.5 you can also click on the layer button in the top menu bar (that may not be the correct name) next to the class button and the X & Y data fields. hth, shelley

Hi kevin; so you can add the user fields but you still can't reorganize the light info record, right? cuze boy-howdy there is still a lot of info in the OIP for lighting devices that is stuff that 9 times out of 10 i don't give a hoot about. and i'm **always** having to scroll up and down and up and down in the OIP to get to class vs label legend vs layer vs... well you get the idea. shelley

Hi ceester; when Kevin says to "check that your origin is somewhere reasonable", what i **think** he means is to edit your symbol (activate symbol in RB, select edit, select 2d component) and check that what you think is the middle of the symbol actually ends up at the proper X zero and Y zero point on the ruler. right kevin? shelley

hello CY; as i read your note i'm a bit confused by your nomenclature. when you say you're in the 'edit info' window of the light data record, do you mean that you are first selecting the label legend manager, and then choosing to 'edit layout'? or are you editing the 'light info record' in the resource browser? i **think** you're saying the first, that you're editing layout within the label legend manager. right? in which case, if my assumpting is correct: the lack of displayed data--i would first check the "label" classes. it sounds like most/all of them have been turned off somehow. which would in turn make all your applicable labels invisible. second, it sounds like the generic symbol that you're seeing in the 'edit layout' window, or the actual symbol you've attached the label to, has either had it's class turned off, or the symbol has somehow been deleted from the resource browser. hth, shelley

hi michael; i attempt to make the 3d as accurate as possible, based on the 2d which i try to dupe in overall size to the available art on that particular fixture/device. (sweep or extrude). on some of the moving lights which feature bodies comprised of multiple curves and planes, i reduce them to simple shapes in an attempt to keep file size down. i decided that moving lights would more often be hanging down than sitting on floor, so i make my defaults hang. (when i need a floor unit, flipping the unit can be simple or complex, depending on how **exact** you need the 3d to appear.) i usually tilt all fixtures 30 degrees. when i use text (esp. for lamp designations) i'll make a duplicate set of fixtures that use slashes and other lines to designate beam spread as well. i try to keep text (or anything else) to a minimum to reduce unecessary visual clutter or ink usage. i think the only 3d text i use is the EDLT series in the ETC object library. (i also remember making an umbrella in a 3d fixture when i had too much coffee but i don't remember which fixture it was....) usually i try to keep the text in the "nose" of the fixture, but under 7 point i often place it somewhere else adjacent to the fixture. i always use the nemetschek-provided default intstrument texture, especially since version 12. hth, shelley

hi herrick; if the instrument is facing "upstage" in the label legend, you should be able to edit the LL, exit the symbol, deselect everything, invoke 'refresh instruments', and see the results. i have found that, once i have found one LL that works for most fixtures, that when i want the channel/handle in a different position, i have to duplicate&modify a separate/new LL. apply that new LL to as many fixtures as seems profitable. see how many are left that require the channel/handle in yet another position, duplicate&modify, etc. ymmv. good luck. shelley

hi michael; i created my own graphic standards, based off spotlight conventions, in my collection of object libraries called SoftSymbols. version 3 is completely updated (as of fall/winter 07), and includes vari-lite, martin, coemar, robe, and clay paky, to name a few. you can download a complete list of the current symbols at http://www.fieldtemplate.com/soft/SoftSymbols_TotalData.pdf hth, shelley

hello Lightsact; you are accurate in your description and your dilemma. no, the legends no longer flip. this was changed in vw12 as memory serves. the flip impacts only the lighting device. i have asked for it to be returned to it's former state and have found no one who feels the same way. i feel your pain but right now to my knowledge there is no alternative but to create an additional label legend that is a "flip" of your original, in order to achieve what you describe. so first you flip the lighting device, then you apply the "flipped" label legend (or change the name in the 'use legend' OIP data pane). hth, shelley

Hi Jeff; take a look at sam jones' Chain Hoist series of plug-ins and macros. shareware, available at his website www.autoplotvw.com hth, shelley

hi ray; i don't know about creative. i think i started using it since the "W" in whole made that saved sheet typically drop down to the bottom of the saved sheet list. on the other hand, your "all" would keep the same thing up at the top, which might not be a bad thing. sometimes when i start to get myself into trouble i also create the opposite saved sheet, the "whole naked enchilada". every class and layer turned off, and only active class and layer viewed. shelley

hello JCS; it's also worth checking which mode the 2D selection tool is in. when the 2D tool is selected, check the icons above the horizontal ruler. there are three against the left side of the drawing. the furthest left-hand icon shows a diagonal line with an arrow at both ends and a red-slashed circle in the lower right hand corner. this is the "Disable Interactive Scaling Mode" icon. click the next icon to the right (same diagonal line w/arrow ends, NO red-slash circle). this is the "Single Object Interactive Mode", and when it is selected, it's more likely that you'll be able to select a lighting device with a label legend and see/grab the label control points. hth, shelley

all true, kevin. it's also worth checking what the active class is when you insert your lighting device. if, for example, the active class is "dimension" while you're inserting lighting devices, those lighting devices will be in the "dimension" class. when the dimension class is turned off, the lighting devices will disappear. i create a saved sheet (that i call Whole Enchilada) that has every class and layer turned on, when i insert a lighting device or any symbol and it disappears, i double click on the Whole Enchilada saved sheet. typically, the missing symbol (in the wrong class) re-appears. hth, shelley

all true, kevin. it's also worth checking what the active class is when you insert your lighting device. if, for example, the active class is "dimension" while you're inserting lighting devices, those lighting devices will be in the "dimension" class. when the dimension class is turned off, the lighting devices will disappear. i create a saved sheet (that i call Whole Enchilada) that has every class and layer turned on, when i insert a lighting device or any symbol and it disappears, i double click on the Whole Enchilada saved sheet. typically, the missing symbol (in the wrong class) re-appears. hth, shelley

hello bfeaginir; if you can, send me an example and i'll take a look at it. in the meantime, it sounds like the alignment of the text may be the culprit (?). were i in your situation i would duplicate the label legend from one that "worked" [the individual label handles became active upon selection], then move the labels to their new desired position, then apply that label to an example lighting device--basically experimentation. hth, shelley mrtemplate@earthlink.net

hello josh; are you using a spotlight 2008 symbol? or is it a fresnel imported from a vw version earlier than vw12? if it is the latter (earlier than vw12), then the default texture of the symbol's 3d component may be stopping the light. for that matter, earlier symbols' 3d light point-of-origin defaulted from the middle of the c-clamp. if the light position is an import from an earlier version, it may be the culprit. hth, shelley

hi albrecht; man, i have seen other postings or emails or **something** about this of late. the 'new label legend displays the text, not the data' problem. i have not experienced it myself. knock on head, er, wood. for your initial problem, have you tried to go "the other way"? open the house plot, the paste your existing plot into the house plot doc? sorry that's all i got right now. if i can find that other thread/email i'll post. shelley

Just on the side, to return to the original thread. i think the discussion of layers and classes takes on a different perspective when one considers using them in sections. my .015 cents. shelley

hi mSachs; i think you've been bitten by the vw08 2D selection tool. Activate the regular 2D selection tool. In the mode bar at the top of the screen check to see what mode it is in. i **think** you've find the left-hand mode (icon) selected (with the red slashy circle), which is the "disable interactive scaling mode". you want to select the middle icon, the "single object interactive scaling mode". selecting this will allow the cursor to change to the 45 degree "move my label legend component" indicator. hth, shelley Just switch it to symbol insertion mode and you should be back in business.

hi adam; wow, that's a good one. if the symbols look ok prior to the dwg import, then my first suspicion would be the dwg import. i'm guessing that the dwg is importing a class that is somehow the same as a nested object/polygon in your drawing. try this: open your original non-dwg imported drawing. edit one of the symbols that turned black. keep editing, and, as you double-click on each object to get to the next nested level, see if the class remains the same. you may not be going "deep" enough in your symbol editing to see the nested class. all of the polygons in SoftSymbols are in the "none" class. but if an imported dwg had a "none" class that was filled with black, it might achieve the same result as what you're seeing. hth, shelley

hi kneightx; not a bad idea. sort of like alternate workspaces, only for palettes and their relative layout on montors or different documents. sounds good to me. shelley

hi guys; did you get your PAR bars working? i just remembered i built some number of these in the James Thomas object library that's included in SoftSymbols v3. Contact me if you are still looking for solutions. shelley

I'll second that emotion. i use Autoplot for multi-show rep plots, and Autoplot Tools for Spotlight for less complex one-off plots. While Sam's numerous macros save massive amounts of time, the automated import/export macros to/from Lightwright are the next perfect extension to the database capabilities in VectorWorks. for me, in either Autoplot or Spotlight, Sam's macros are a no-brainer. shelley