Kevin McAllister

I'm not entirely sure that its the vector elements that increase the file size. I often receive vector based PDFs generated by Autocad of entire stadiums that weigh in at a mere 500KB. There's something about the bitmaps that Vectorworks generates and how it crops them that is definitely part of the problem. When trying to optimize a Vectorworks PDF in Acrobat you often get the error message "The PDF document contained some masked images that were not down sampled." This leads me to believe that most bitmaps generated by Vectorworks sample a much larger area of the drawing/viewport than they need to and are masked off using clipping paths. Kevin

The combination of Hidden Line and Custom Renderworks shows how Vectorworks rendering (Hidden Line) and C4D Rendering (Custom Renderworks) don't play well together. I believe that the basic render modes (ie. Hidden Line) are still handled by Vectorworks internally instead of using the C4D rendering engine. Because the results are created by two different rendering engines, they don't overlay exactly. Hidden Line creates a vector based layer while Custom Renderworks creates a bitmap based layer. Planar object outlines are rendered on both layers resulting in soft line edges or inconsistent line widths. I believe the result we all desire is actually a combination of 3D objects rendered in Custom Renderworks combined with 2D/3D objects rendered in Hidden Line, but at the moment there is no way to exclude the 2D planar objects from the Custom Renderworks render pass. I've been doing some online courses for C4D and its rendering engine has the ability to do many of the things you are asking for (heavier line weights in the foreground, lighter line weights in the background, outlining complete objects with heavier lines), Vectoworks just doesn't implement these options (mostly because its not using the C4D engine for line work). Kevin

Are you using both foreground and background rendering modes on your Viewport? I only ask because I've recently been fighting with inconsistency caused by this. I often use Hidden Line and Custom Renderworks together but Planar Object lines render in both modes, causing inconsistent line weights and other messiness.... Kevin

That's exactly the problem. Everything should be 3D period. And snaps should be smart and helpful. Often you want to snap in some visually logical way and can't. Vectorworks is missing basic snaps that other programs call "2.5D" snapping. It amazes me you can't just hold down shift to constrain and drag an object across the ground plane in a 3D view. 3D should be simple and intuitive not complicated and convoluted as its become with the transitional Vectorworks approach. KM

I like the idea. Often you think its closed and its not. Perhaps it needs to auto close when snapped within a certain distance of the starting point. Or perhaps it needs a smart cursor clue (much like you get when you use Adobe Illustrator or Photoshop) when it will create a closed polygon. Kevin

Definitely a good question. It was down for me as well though, unlike in the past, this time there was a message saying the board was closed. Kevin

I wish that I didn't have to choose the Cinema 4D application every time I use the "Send to Cinema 4D" command. If its really necessary to set the path to the Cinema 4D application, please make it a preference that sticks. KM

I love this. Real world files are a great test for real world software :-)

Hi Donne, I had a follow up email from someone in your department. I sent them an example of what I was seeing and some other feedback based on my Cloud experiences. Thank you, Kevin

I would tend to agree with Christian. I used Vectorworks Cloud Services for a few days before I went back to my old workflow. My previous workflow used iBooks as my viewer for self generated PDF files. It never has trouble with my PDF files. The PDF generator on Vectorworks Cloud Services is actually custom. It doesn't generate identical PDFs to Vectorworks (different bookmarking is one anomaly). Perhaps it could be made to "flatten" the PDFs or optimize them in some way. This has long been a wish list item for the desktop version of Vectorworks. Kevin

Importing DWG files directly often causes a double origin problem. I can imagine it would affect Workgroup References too. It usually shows up when I use the Cinema 4D command and things show up in Cinema 4D off to one side even though they appear centred in Vectorworks. Just like moving the origin, which you should never do, importing a DWG directly into a working file is not good workflow. Import it into a clean file first and copy/paste or reference it in. Kevin

I think I just answered my own question by looking at the source code for the web page. When entering the symbol for inches you need to use the double quote " (shift plus the single quote key), you cannot enter two single quotes in a row. Kevin

Ok, this is going to seem like an odd question but I'll ask anyway. What keystrokes are you using to type your ' and " ? Kevin

I always leave the inches " off. If your units are set to feet and inches Vectorworks doesn't need it. It will save you a lot of keystrokes. Interestingly if I cut and paste the 10'6" from your post into Vectorworks I get the ding sound too. I would add a signature to your post (under My Stuff above) detailing your Vectorworks version and system specs. From a Mac perspective it seems like something may be wrong with your keyboard settings or font encoding. If I cut and paste the 10' 6" from Pat's post it works fine..... Kevin

Well, Unified View is missing from Fundamentals so its not really a surprise. Not sure how exactly you use Fundamentals for 3D in a meaningful way without it. This was exactly the need that should have been filled by the Vectorworks iPad app. Unfortunately we got a 3rd party PDF viewer repurposed for closed networks use. The only feature of interest is the measure tool it provides, but it doesn't recognize Vectorworks snaps making it less than accurate. The most successful company in the world right now is based on the principle of user simplicity. The Vectorworks Viewer is based on developer simplicity. These two principles are polar opposites, its no wonder one approach is successful and the other is not. Kevin

I often find myself putting various types of sheet drawings into one file. I would like to be able to organize my sheet layers into folders, much like you can do with Photoshop layers. That way I can put my full size drawings into one folder, my details into another and so on. Kevin

I think they actually face a fairly steep uphill battle. A lot of areas of the program are lagging behind all at once. Vectorworks diversity was probably once its strength but has now become its weakness. What architects need vs. lighting designers vs. landscape designers vs. furniture designers vs. engineers vs. who knows what else. NNA's resources are split and it can only give a certain amount of attention to each group of users. There is a lot of competition in the various markets, but each competitor is better at only one or two aspects of what Vectorworks does. While architects are considering switching to Revit, Bentley, Archicad etc. I look how powerful some of the low end 3D programs have become (Rhino, FormZ, Bonzai3D for modelling / the basic version of Cinema 4D for modelling and rendering). None of those pieces of software can handle drawing sets, which is a big problem, but all of them are more flexible design tools for what I do. And all of them are better value. Someone mentioned Fundamentals above. Its not really viable for anything. Crippling high end software and trying to market it as your low end solution just doesn't fly in today's market. Software companies are innovating all over the place. Just look at what you can do on an iPad. In a way the "basic version" of Vectorworks should actually be Designer. Batch printing, Sheet Layers, Drawing Co-ordination, Import/Export options, Basic Reports, a basic architectural tools (walls, simple door, simple window, simple stair) etc. are all basic workflow necessities. And many cheaper, completive packages include these options already. BIM,on the other hand, is a pretty specialized market. I have no problem spending money on something that makes me more productive. But I am starting to feel like Vectorworks is not good value.

You may be right, but perhaps only for the architectural market. I use the architectural tools in Vectorworks but I don't do architecture. I own a copy of Vectorworks Designer because it gives me flexibility. Frankly I could care a less about BIM but it doesn't mean I don't need good import/export (Autocad, Cinema 4D, Lightwright, 3D printers). I need a flexible tool to do complex 3d modelling and an easy way to create drawing sets from that model. Note I said design drawings, not construction drawings. I suspect there are a lot of individual users like me, though probably not many companies with multiple seats. Revit or Archicad are not in my future as they are not at all suited to my work. Vectorworks is being pulled in many directions, you only have to look at the various modules and read the forum posts to see that. The architectural segment may be the largest market for the moment, but I suspect that market is stagnating as people wait to see where BIM is going. The entertainment segment is still relatively small, but growing much faster. My two cents. Kevin

I agree with this. I also wish that the drawing name and the viewport name could be set to automatically be the same. Too many different things to manage when they are basically the same thing. Kevin

Its all a bit backwards still. Canada is a metric country but so much stuff is still built using Imperial measurements, mostly because of stock materials. When I worked with an Australian colleague on the Olympics, I joked with him about material sizes and the elusive sheet of metric plywood. 4'x8' is a pretty simple size to do calculations with until you metricize it - 1219MM x 2438mm is not intuitive at all. Now 1200mm x 2400mm, that make way more sense.... Kevin

Which ironically Vectorworks is able to produce and remember for a Resource Browser thumbnail but not for actual use in a drawing....

So I was experimenting with the Vectorworks cloud and had some font problems (still trying to sort out). It led me to turn off a bunch of fonts on my Mac using Fontbook. The fonts I've turned off have disappeared from the font menu in other applications but are still present in the font menu in Vectorworks. When I first noticed it I restarted my system but the anomaly still persists. Does Vectorworks not respect the OS's control over fonts? It seems very odd. Kevin

I strongly agree. Especially since the 3D origin is actually fixed anyway. The confusion starts when the 2D origin is moved away from the 3D origin..... Kevin

I agree, though I would prefer if it were a Vectorworks preference instead of a file preference. KM

I used to see this a lot with 3D objects in DWG exports in Vectorworks 2009. It was usually because the object or a step within it had been mirrored at some point during its creation. Kevin